Wolfenstein: The New Order

[00:00:00] Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to another episode of the Pre-Order Bonus podcast and one

[00:00:13] of your hosts, Cameron Warren, and I'm joined as always by Jacob Price. It's April 11th,

[00:00:21] 2020 for Spring has sprung and so have video games. Jake, what do you think of the $120

[00:00:33] ultimate edition of Star Wars Outlaws?

[00:00:35] Dude, well, I'm not gonna buy it.

[00:00:43] Is it funny?

[00:00:44] Dude, what's in there? What do you what else is in there? But you know, the game, let's

[00:00:50] look this up real quick because, because guess what? We made a prediction a few episodes ago

[00:00:56] about the financials of the video game world and guess what's happening already? $100 video

[00:01:02] games, right?

[00:01:03] Triple digits. So it's insane. I think we talked about this the last time it came up. So

[00:01:07] in regional pricing in some places, they've been in triple digits for a while now to see

[00:01:15] $120 package for a game in US dollars is a bit.

[00:01:19] Sorry, I made a mistake there $130.

[00:01:21] No dude, you were under?

[00:01:25] I was under. Alternatively, you can pay $110 just for early access but you don't get

[00:01:34] the in-game bonuses which usually these in-game bonuses are really stupid like

[00:01:41] that's really dumb like cosmetics that you don't even want.

[00:01:47] So there's a $109 gold edition and a $129 ultimate edition.

[00:01:54] Dude, yeah.

[00:01:56] The gold edition offers three day early access as well as the game season pass for DLC.

[00:02:01] Okay.

[00:02:02] Okay.

[00:02:04] So that makes a little more sense.

[00:02:06] So if the game is $70, there's a season pass that includes a couple DLC packs and

[00:02:15] you're talking 30.

[00:02:18] Okay. So so you basically pay in 10 bucks for early access and then $30 for the

[00:02:22] DLC.

[00:02:23] Yeah, I hope that's kind of how that and then the ultimate edition you are getting.

[00:02:31] It's not clear what you get a free digital.

[00:02:35] Ultimate edition includes all that as well as the sabacc shark and rogue infiltrator

[00:02:40] bundle in-game item bundles.

[00:02:42] So some cost that's a steep price for like a weird they don't give you free

[00:02:47] plus a free digital copy of Rises Skywalker.

[00:02:55] I think you can find that in the $1 bin at Walmart.

[00:02:58] Dude, I don't know.

[00:03:00] Listen, I personally am not really annoyed by, hey, get the digital deluxe, get a

[00:03:06] bunch of random cosmetics and even even the early accessing, hey, play the game

[00:03:11] three days in advance.

[00:03:13] I'm honestly personally not bothered by that.

[00:03:17] I understand the corporate side of, hey, let's try to get some money out of

[00:03:22] this.

[00:03:23] But it's also my personal opinion that the stuff that comes in nearly every

[00:03:28] single digital edition is total garbage unless it has a season pass for DLC,

[00:03:35] which it sounds like, you know, at least for Star Wars Outlaws, it has something.

[00:03:40] But I mean, I get it.

[00:03:41] They're trying to make some more money off these games because games are

[00:03:44] super expensive to make.

[00:03:46] I'm just not the target demographic for that kind of pricing and for the

[00:03:49] bonuses that you get for that.

[00:03:52] But I don't know.

[00:03:54] Maybe maybe I'm just not seeing the light.

[00:03:56] Is there a reason to be like really annoyed at this other than just to kind

[00:03:58] of be like, this is an outrageous price?

[00:04:03] OK, the one thing that is a little different and this is showing a sign

[00:04:08] of things to come is that the standard edition is actually $80 retail.

[00:04:12] Wait, what?

[00:04:12] Retail.

[00:04:14] Unless this is a British website.

[00:04:17] Is this in pounds?

[00:04:18] Is it in pounds?

[00:04:22] I'm going to look at the actual Ubisoft store.

[00:04:29] Star Wars Outlaws Ultimate Edition 12999.

[00:04:32] OK, so Xbox.com has a 6999 with 70 bucks.

[00:04:35] OK, that was in pounds, I think.

[00:04:37] OK, or Canadian dollars, maybe.

[00:04:41] So OK, so you know what?

[00:04:42] This isn't even unprecedented.

[00:04:44] So I'm going to actually push back on the rage.

[00:04:46] OK, to be pushing back on the rage,

[00:04:48] TVH because like look.

[00:04:52] For games like this, if you want companies to make games like this

[00:04:57] moving forward and you like stuff like this and I hope Star Wars

[00:05:00] Outlaws is good, I mean, first off, the game has to be good.

[00:05:02] Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[00:05:03] Like I but if you want game, let's assume Star Wars Outlaws

[00:05:07] is like a nine and a nine point five out of ten open world

[00:05:11] incredible Star Wars.

[00:05:12] All right, let's yeah.

[00:05:14] Let's just make that assumption.

[00:05:15] Let's just decide that that's what it's going to be.

[00:05:18] If you want those to exist, bottom line.

[00:05:22] A portion of the audience is going to have to pay over a hundred

[00:05:25] dollars retail for the game in order for these games to continue

[00:05:28] to get made or else they're just not going to continue to get made period.

[00:05:32] That's just the bottom.

[00:05:33] That's the where we're at in the industry.

[00:05:36] Is that greedy?

[00:05:38] Probably maybe.

[00:05:40] But also we know that like the financials are just not shaking out.

[00:05:44] We've like we've beat this horse to death in every episode

[00:05:49] over the past like six episodes, but it just keeps coming up in the news.

[00:05:52] And this is the latest example.

[00:05:54] And even then it's not even unprecedented because the last Far

[00:05:58] Craig game had a one hundred twenty dollar ultimate edition and

[00:06:01] Assassin's Creed Valhalla also had the same thing.

[00:06:04] And the bottom line is like you as the buyer, you have the power

[00:06:09] to simply choose to not buy the latest addition, which it doesn't look

[00:06:13] like it locks you out of any content as far as what I'm seeing,

[00:06:17] unless I'm missing something.

[00:06:19] It looks like you're just missing out on early access and stupid in-game items.

[00:06:23] So I mean, I feel like with these these like special editions,

[00:06:28] these companies have been careful to toe the line there

[00:06:33] to kind of not make it seem like if you just buy the base game

[00:06:38] that you're actually like getting less of a base game than somebody who

[00:06:42] buys a digital deluxe pack, does that make any sense to me or to you?

[00:06:46] Sorry guys, my brain's a little fried into semester.

[00:06:48] I'm deep in the pit of grading.

[00:06:51] But yeah, I don't know.

[00:06:54] I get why people are annoyed because the price point is painful.

[00:06:58] At the same time, I'm not annoyed because I know that's not me.

[00:07:02] I'm not going to buy that.

[00:07:05] And so that's that's a really kind of selfish perspective, I think towards it.

[00:07:10] I kind of just wish that these extra editions were more creative in what they offered.

[00:07:19] I think that's a much more valid complaint.

[00:07:22] That's a way more valid complaint where you just like oh, it's too much money.

[00:07:27] It's like, OK, just don't buy it.

[00:07:29] Like it's the standard edition is 70 bucks.

[00:07:32] The whole industry has moved to $70.

[00:07:35] That's already pretty expensive, but like long overdue.

[00:07:39] Right? Long overdue because like games have been 60 bucks for 30 years at this point.

[00:07:45] Anyway, go ahead. Yeah, I don't know.

[00:07:46] OK, so I'm looking right now at the ultimate edition.

[00:07:50] You get the season pass.

[00:07:51] You get everything that comes in the ultimate pack.

[00:07:54] You get the pre-order bonus.

[00:07:55] Hey, what's the name of our podcast?

[00:07:57] And you get the digital art book.

[00:08:00] Here's here's kind of the kicker for me is like

[00:08:04] they really want people to buy these huge editions in advance.

[00:08:09] But how do I know that I want the digital art book?

[00:08:14] You know, like I think you have to and you are getting at this as well.

[00:08:17] They put out these editions not for every single player.

[00:08:20] And they know that not every single player is going to,

[00:08:24] you know, chomp at the bit and get these super expensive ones.

[00:08:28] They know that, right?

[00:08:29] They know that it's just a, I don't know.

[00:08:32] What do you think it's like two percent of total players

[00:08:35] are probably going to get like the Star Wars Outlaws ultimate edition?

[00:08:38] I mean, enough that they keep putting them out.

[00:08:42] Yeah. So they're clearly not clearly the people getting mad or like

[00:08:46] they're not buying it, but they don't care because clearly people are buying

[00:08:50] or they would shift the strategy like they would bundle this differently.

[00:08:53] Yeah, you're right.

[00:08:54] They would do that and they've done it now three games in a row.

[00:08:56] And you know what?

[00:08:56] That's probably why there isn't more creativity in what they offer

[00:08:59] because they don't need

[00:09:01] from a financial standpoint to come up with something more interesting to say here.

[00:09:05] It's like, oh, look,

[00:09:07] 10 percent of our sales came from the ultimate edition.

[00:09:09] It's like, oh, that's like it's going to be millions of dollars in some cases.

[00:09:12] So in this case, probably millions of millions of dollars, right?

[00:09:15] So I disagree about how I believe sold gangbusters.

[00:09:20] It sold like really well.

[00:09:22] Yeah. And it also had a hundred and twenty dollar edition.

[00:09:25] I think the other things probably to consider is that

[00:09:28] I wonder what the Venn diagram is of people who buy

[00:09:33] something like an ultimate edition and the the people who play

[00:09:39] two to three games a year.

[00:09:41] One billion in revenue for about one billion.

[00:09:45] Oh, nice. That's a decent chunk of change.

[00:09:47] If I do say for a open world single player game, I mean, that's good.

[00:09:52] Hey, this is what the people want, right?

[00:09:56] And this is the thing.

[00:09:58] Yeah, the industry has become so unsustainable when it comes to producing,

[00:10:02] like in, like you said, giving the benefit of doubt of giving Star Wars out

[00:10:05] was like a nine out of 10 in, let's say it's like an 80 hour

[00:10:09] or let's say it's like a hundred and hundred hour experience

[00:10:11] if you want to get everything that's in there, right?

[00:10:14] Is it still worth your money?

[00:10:17] And I know this is a super bad way to sort of phrase

[00:10:21] this this conversation topic.

[00:10:25] Is it still worth your money to spend $120 on a game

[00:10:27] that you're going to get 100 hours out of and you are not buying a bunch of games?

[00:10:33] You know, like if you were buying Star Wars Outlaws

[00:10:36] and maybe one other giant single player game

[00:10:38] and then spending the rest of your time in Fortnite or Call of Duty.

[00:10:42] Is it that painful for you?

[00:10:44] Maybe, maybe not, right?

[00:10:47] Whereas the people who I think are most vocal

[00:10:51] in the games industry who are loud about this kind of price point

[00:10:54] who are annoyed about it, are people probably like us for the most part

[00:10:59] who are buying and playing a ton of games a year.

[00:11:01] This is a like a big hobby for you.

[00:11:05] Or there's some other reason for you to be playing all these games.

[00:11:07] I don't know.

[00:11:08] I I just have a really hard time being cynical about this, mainly because

[00:11:14] and I know this isn't the case, mainly because I want all this extra

[00:11:17] money to go to the developers who put in so much time

[00:11:21] to make something of this scale.

[00:11:23] And I know a lot of this is going into bonuses for people at the top.

[00:11:26] And that's not super great.

[00:11:27] But a part of me wants to live the fantasy that like, hey,

[00:11:30] if you buy the hundred thirty dollar version of Star Wars Outlaws,

[00:11:33] like maybe a big chunk of the extra money you're spending

[00:11:37] is going to help retain a whole lot of staff.

[00:11:42] Yeah, I don't know.

[00:11:42] I'm kind of mentally sorry, guys, I'm not like super focused tonight.

[00:11:47] But I would just say I have a hard time

[00:11:49] just being really up in arms and raging about this.

[00:11:51] A lot of that comes from my sort of personal egotistical perspective

[00:11:55] and like, well, I am not the demographic that's going to buy this.

[00:11:58] So I kind of, you know, it's easy for me to brush it aside.

[00:12:02] But I do wish that they would offer things more creative than

[00:12:07] than just OK, here's a bunch of cosmetics.

[00:12:10] Hey, you get to play the game three days early.

[00:12:14] I mean, yeah, as a counterpoint to that,

[00:12:15] like if they did offer more creative,

[00:12:17] then I think people would be even more mad.

[00:12:19] Like so maybe we should be thankful that it's not very creative

[00:12:22] and it's kind of dumb because it's like, OK, you still get literally everything.

[00:12:26] You're just not going to be able to play the game the same time.

[00:12:31] So what they did is they like, OK, let's charge money

[00:12:34] so people can play early and some people pay the money.

[00:12:37] Yeah. So they can play early. Yeah.

[00:12:39] I would much rather have that than like, hey, there's a

[00:12:43] three hour story mission that's locked behind this $20.

[00:12:47] That's not the case here, right?

[00:12:49] Right. And this is where I think they're towing the line

[00:12:52] because if they were to add like that three hour extra experience

[00:12:56] with an extra special boss or whatever,

[00:12:58] it typically would also be sold separately, right?

[00:13:02] And it'd be sold at a greater markup

[00:13:03] to try to encourage you to buy the bundle.

[00:13:06] And so I mean, that's just how these things have worked forever.

[00:13:08] Right. That's why the season passes included in here.

[00:13:11] But yeah, having it did.

[00:13:14] I mean, I want to I want to like not.

[00:13:18] I don't really want to defend Ubisoft,

[00:13:20] but I think these types of conversations like we just have to be honest.

[00:13:25] I think I think the Spider-Man reveal like the.

[00:13:29] The Spider-Man 2 Financials leak.

[00:13:32] Yeah. It's just a stark reality check for this stuff.

[00:13:37] It's just such a stark reality check for this stuff.

[00:13:40] It's like, if you want this type of stuff to exist,

[00:13:43] this is just the reality now.

[00:13:45] Like this is just what it is.

[00:13:46] And this and companies literally have to do this.

[00:13:49] And there's no way around the system that drives that forward.

[00:13:54] So it's kind of like, I don't know,

[00:13:57] it's maybe like taking the bad with the good.

[00:13:59] Like if art were made for art's sake and Spider-Man 2

[00:14:02] and and.

[00:14:06] Insomniac or perfectly happy

[00:14:08] with Spider-Man 2 just breaking even, right?

[00:14:11] They could just pay all the developer salaries

[00:14:13] and then go on to make the next game with zero money in the bank.

[00:14:18] And it was just made for art.

[00:14:20] That would be amazing. Oh, yeah.

[00:14:22] But that world doesn't exist.

[00:14:23] Yeah. And if you are listening to this and shaking your fist,

[00:14:27] I do recommend that you go listen to our episode.

[00:14:29] We did a big hour long episode talking about the layoffs in the industry

[00:14:33] and sort of what's kind of happening.

[00:14:34] And camera does a good job of bringing in different articles

[00:14:37] and data regarding that conversation.

[00:14:42] And I remember just the two big takeaways for me

[00:14:46] in that conversation was, well, the problem is that huge game companies,

[00:14:52] big triple A games, games like Star Wars Outlaws

[00:14:55] are just unsustainable when it comes to the finances.

[00:14:58] And when it comes to the different avenues of the big wigs

[00:15:02] of those companies trying to save money.

[00:15:06] Unfortunately, you know, they're trying to quote unquote save money,

[00:15:11] which they are, right?

[00:15:12] Maybe I don't need to put that air quotes.

[00:15:14] But at the same time, they're doing it to appease shareholders.

[00:15:18] That's problem number one is that investors are more important

[00:15:22] to the people up top than consumers, than the developers.

[00:15:26] And the other problem is that developers layoffs is the easiest way

[00:15:31] for to sort of appease those financials and to make it look like

[00:15:36] you're constantly growing.

[00:15:37] So the biggest problem here really is just unsustainable growth

[00:15:42] and this kind of very silly, just to put it lightly expectation

[00:15:47] that a company's year over year always must be increasing

[00:15:51] in that if it decreases, it's the end of the world as we know it.

[00:15:54] Quarterly profits as Sven Larry and Boss said.

[00:15:58] Yeah.

[00:15:59] Yeah. So Larry and being an example, I think a shining light

[00:16:02] sort of in this darkness of unsustainable game development

[00:16:06] for sure with all the things that he's been saying

[00:16:09] and been on record saying in these interviews recently.

[00:16:12] But yeah, I don't know.

[00:16:13] I mean, the game looked cool, but folks, you will not be seeing me

[00:16:17] with an addition beyond the base game edition for Star Wars Outlaws.

[00:16:21] I I think I bought.

[00:16:24] I think I might have bought in an ultimate edition like once.

[00:16:27] And I think it was ten dollars more.

[00:16:29] So it was like 80. Right.

[00:16:31] I'm trying to think which game that was.

[00:16:33] And I know what happened.

[00:16:34] I ended up playing the early access version for like

[00:16:38] like an hour and then ended up not even being able to play

[00:16:42] until it was actually just out.

[00:16:45] And so I basically wasted 10 bucks.

[00:16:47] That's the other thing is like if you're patient,

[00:16:49] Ubisoft games have a very quick and steeply discounted

[00:16:55] like discount strategy.

[00:16:58] Oh, yeah. It's like so Star Wars Outlaws will be down to 30 bucks within one year.

[00:17:03] Prince of Persia, the lost crown, which came out in this year

[00:17:07] three months ago has already been on sale for 33 percent off.

[00:17:12] Yeah, exact, exact.

[00:17:14] And that's that's just Ubisoft.

[00:17:15] And that's that's just how they do it.

[00:17:17] They they they strategy that that's how they do their economics

[00:17:20] on the game pricing side.

[00:17:23] Yeah, I would say that a better version of what we're seeing here

[00:17:29] with kind of these ultimate additions is when

[00:17:33] a game will say, hey, if you pre-order the game

[00:17:36] and it's the base game price, but you just buy it in advance,

[00:17:39] then you get these cosmetics to go in game.

[00:17:43] I'm actually way more likely individually to pre-order a game at regular price

[00:17:49] because one, it's still the same amount of price.

[00:17:54] And two, like if it's a game that I know I'm going to buy anyway,

[00:17:58] if it in that happens every now and I save a few games every year

[00:18:01] that's like, yeah, I see this game.

[00:18:03] I know I'm going to play it.

[00:18:04] Sure, I'll just buy it right now.

[00:18:07] Make sure it's cute so it'll be installed immediately when I get home

[00:18:10] and I can kind of play that day.

[00:18:11] And there's a few interesting cosmetics.

[00:18:14] Let's see, I did that with a game this year.

[00:18:16] I can't remember what it was.

[00:18:17] And I ended up just like, yeah, sure.

[00:18:20] I booted up the game.

[00:18:22] Oh, it's Final Fantasy 7 Rebirth, right?

[00:18:25] Booted up the game, you get through the tutorial and it's like,

[00:18:27] oh, hey, now your extra pre-order bonus DLC is available.

[00:18:31] And then I just kind of added that and I used it for a little bit

[00:18:34] and I was like, hey, this stuff does look really cool.

[00:18:36] And then, you know, five hours later into the game

[00:18:38] when I had better gear, I un-equipped it.

[00:18:41] That stuff is never that good.

[00:18:43] It never lasts any of those little cosmetic packages or

[00:18:47] I think in the case of Final Fantasy 7 Rebirth, it was like

[00:18:51] you got maybe access to a specific summon

[00:18:55] if you like order the game.

[00:18:57] And I don't know.

[00:18:58] The stuff never lasts.

[00:18:59] It's really not worth it.

[00:19:01] But I think it makes more sense to try to incentivize people

[00:19:05] to pre-order your game so you have much better predictability

[00:19:09] in terms of how well your game is going to do

[00:19:11] and what kind of turnaround you're going to get financially on a game.

[00:19:14] Then it is to have like these super massive nearly double

[00:19:18] the price of a base game package and just hope that people buy that at launch.

[00:19:24] 100% agree, Jake.

[00:19:26] Other news is looks like the fallout TV show is incredibly good.

[00:19:32] Like I don't think I've seen reviews this good for a TV show like

[00:19:36] in a long time.

[00:19:38] It's been a while, at least for me.

[00:19:41] So I'm excited to watch that.

[00:19:43] And on piggybacking on that, and I was actually curious

[00:19:47] of when they were going to do this, but they waited.

[00:19:49] They waited for the perfect timing.

[00:19:51] We are getting new gen version of Fallout 4 at the end of this month,

[00:19:56] which is really cool.

[00:19:58] Yeah.

[00:20:00] I think just frame rate uprated.

[00:20:02] I think said frame rate visuals, some other little things in there,

[00:20:06] which dude, it's been great.

[00:20:09] Dude, it's been 10 years since we've gotten a fallout game.

[00:20:12] So follow fans are like frothing with a mouth at this point.

[00:20:17] Oh, I have actually never played Fallout 4 and.

[00:20:21] Hey, am I going to now?

[00:20:24] No.

[00:20:25] Jake, should we do fall?

[00:20:29] Jake's back.

[00:20:30] I guess we're going to.

[00:20:33] Listen, Jake, but wait, wait, wait, wait.

[00:20:36] What if we did?

[00:20:37] What if we watched the TV show and then we put like 20 hours

[00:20:42] into the upgraded version and then we do like a big episode on it?

[00:20:46] What do you think?

[00:20:47] Okay, listeners, let us know if you if you want us to do that

[00:20:50] because my plan was actually just to do another playthrough

[00:20:55] of Bloodborne.

[00:21:01] Okay, please for the love of all that is holy.

[00:21:05] Do not play.

[00:21:06] Dude, at least do your Elden Ring playthrough to get ready for that.

[00:21:11] Oh, I've started that.

[00:21:12] Don't worry.

[00:21:14] Or at least finish Baldur's Gate 3 for crying shame.

[00:21:18] I knew this was going to come up.

[00:21:20] All right.

[00:21:21] If you have if you're not a long time listener,

[00:21:24] I haven't finished Baldur's Gate 3 and every day that passes

[00:21:28] in which I don't boot up Baldur's Gate 3 again,

[00:21:30] Cameron's soul just starts to just chip away

[00:21:33] and splinter and fracture and crumble the dust.

[00:21:36] Jake, I think it might be my favorite game of...

[00:21:39] Kotor is still my favorite game of all time,

[00:21:41] but it's real close.

[00:21:43] It's number two at least.

[00:21:45] No, I want to put this to the listeners.

[00:21:48] If you were listening, what would you rather have?

[00:21:51] Would you rather have me play Bloodborne again

[00:21:54] or would you rather have us do an episode on Fallout 4?

[00:21:57] Let us know.

[00:21:59] Jake plays Bloodborne.

[00:22:01] I'll give you two options, listeners.

[00:22:03] Two options. This is an important vote,

[00:22:05] so we need to hear from you.

[00:22:07] Discord, Twitter, wherever you're at.

[00:22:09] Either A, Jake and I play Fallout 4 again,

[00:22:13] watch the TV show and do a big Fallout episode.

[00:22:16] Or B, we do the ultimate world-ending ranking

[00:22:22] of all from software.

[00:22:24] Oh, let's do that.

[00:22:26] Let's do that.

[00:22:28] No, let us... Okay, let us know what you think.

[00:22:30] Let us know. Let us know. That's two options.

[00:22:32] Maybe we do both. Maybe we don't.

[00:22:34] Obviously you know what camp Cameron is in

[00:22:36] and what camp I am in there.

[00:22:38] So we will...

[00:22:40] Those actually both sound like pretty good options for Joe.

[00:22:42] Here's the deal.

[00:22:44] We will both take personal offense

[00:22:46] if you pick the other side.

[00:22:50] What we need to happen is a 50-50...

[00:22:52] I actually didn't love Fallout 4.

[00:22:55] I did not finish it, to be honest.

[00:22:58] I tried Fallout New Vegas a while ago.

[00:23:02] It's just a bit too dated for me.

[00:23:04] I just couldn't do it.

[00:23:08] I'll be honest, I'm not even the biggest Fallout fan,

[00:23:10] but I'm excited to watch the show.

[00:23:12] I am really excited to watch the show.

[00:23:14] And listen, Fallout fans, you are going to curse my name

[00:23:16] after I confess this.

[00:23:18] The only Fallout I've ever played was Fallout 76.

[00:23:23] Yikes.

[00:23:25] That's bad news bears right there.

[00:23:28] I think I played like 10 hours of that and I was like,

[00:23:30] I think this is fun.

[00:23:32] Well Jake, speaking of Fallout...

[00:23:35] made by a little studio

[00:23:38] called Bethesda.

[00:23:42] Actually, this isn't a good transition.

[00:23:44] But Bethesda who...

[00:23:49] Oh boy. Okay.

[00:23:51] Today we're talking...

[00:23:53] You're fine. Man, I couldn't do it.

[00:23:55] Last thing I want to get out in terms of news,

[00:23:57] the triple I initiative showcase happened.

[00:24:00] Oh yeah, I was going to ask you about this. Perfect.

[00:24:02] So I watched it, shout out to Soccer.

[00:24:04] We were in there, this is somebody in our Discord

[00:24:06] and we were kind of live reacting to it in our Discord.

[00:24:09] I think this is weird.

[00:24:13] Because we kind of have a sense of what triple A is

[00:24:18] and the showcase is trying to give us a sense

[00:24:20] of what triple I is.

[00:24:22] And I don't think we're any closer to a definition

[00:24:26] after watching the showcase, I'll be honest.

[00:24:29] But I think it was very cool to see this

[00:24:33] what feels like a pretty grassroots initiative come together.

[00:24:39] It was a 45 minute showcase that just...

[00:24:42] All it was was news.

[00:24:44] All it was was announcements.

[00:24:46] It was some gameplay.

[00:24:48] Essentially what it was, we actually got a lot of really cool,

[00:24:51] I think really states, probably the biggest information

[00:24:54] that we got is Slay the Spire 2 is in development right now.

[00:24:59] Let's see what other big ones there were.

[00:25:01] I'm trying to think of like huge ones.

[00:25:04] The Prince of... Rogue, Prince of Persia.

[00:25:07] Yes, it's called the Prince of Persia, the Rogue Prince,

[00:25:11] fitting name.

[00:25:13] Let's see, we got a little bit more in Flintlock Siege of Dawn,

[00:25:16] which I think is cool.

[00:25:18] Vampire Survivors showed off a huge DLC.

[00:25:21] They did this thing with Contra.

[00:25:24] So there's crossover there.

[00:25:27] Folks...

[00:25:28] Boulder's got three crossover incoming, by the way.

[00:25:31] Wait, are you an insider? Do you know that?

[00:25:33] With Vampire Survivors?

[00:25:35] So Sven and the creator of Vampire Survivors

[00:25:41] posted on Twitter...

[00:25:42] Wait, what?

[00:25:44] Sitting together being like, should we collaborate?

[00:25:47] Question mark?

[00:25:48] Oh, that would be dope.

[00:25:50] That would be super cool.

[00:25:52] Was not announced, but that would be very cool.

[00:25:57] Let's see, did you ever play the game Never Alone?

[00:26:00] It was this side-scrolling platformer.

[00:26:04] It came out in 2014 and it was pretty cool.

[00:26:08] I liked it.

[00:26:09] Actually my wife and I played this one together.

[00:26:11] We liked it because it's this really cool story from...

[00:26:15] I cannot pronounce.

[00:26:17] It's not Inuit, but it's another Indigenous group.

[00:26:20] I'm sorry.

[00:26:21] Inupiak.

[00:26:22] I'm reading that as if it's Spanish.

[00:26:24] Anyway, it's getting a sequel 10 years later,

[00:26:26] which is kind of mind-blowing.

[00:26:28] But yeah, I thought there was a lot of cool games in there.

[00:26:30] What I thought was kind of wild is just how many indie games

[00:26:37] are going into early access?

[00:26:39] Most of the announcements here were like,

[00:26:41] hey, this game is hitting early access this month.

[00:26:44] Most of them were 2024.

[00:26:46] Speaking about monetization models,

[00:26:50] early access is one that we've talked about.

[00:26:53] The triple-I initiative kind of showed me was

[00:26:58] indies to sort of weather what's happening in the gaming industry

[00:27:02] right now because they're getting less funding

[00:27:04] and things are just really tight.

[00:27:06] Belts are a little tighter there.

[00:27:08] Sounds like a paid early access.

[00:27:11] Like a low entry fee.

[00:27:13] I would imagine these are all between $5 and $20.

[00:27:16] $20 at the most is a way to sort of shore up revenue

[00:27:20] and try to work with the community

[00:27:23] to make sure that when your game does launch,

[00:27:25] it is a financial success.

[00:27:27] So this seems like maybe the indie response

[00:27:30] to this problem,

[00:27:32] to the games industry sort of financial crisis.

[00:27:36] Yeah, that's an interesting name.

[00:27:38] Triple-I.

[00:27:40] Is that a new category of games?

[00:27:42] Triple-Indy?

[00:27:43] I don't know, man.

[00:27:44] Or did I read into that?

[00:27:46] I don't know.

[00:27:47] It makes for a really cool logo.

[00:27:49] And so...

[00:27:52] I don't know.

[00:27:53] Is this term going to take off?

[00:27:55] I mean, good luck.

[00:27:56] We have the hardest time deciding what is indie.

[00:27:58] Yeah, but...

[00:27:59] You know?

[00:28:00] So...

[00:28:01] It...

[00:28:02] As much as we like to...

[00:28:04] I mean, indie is still...

[00:28:06] pretty niche outside of Stardew Valley.

[00:28:10] You got your viral hits like Vampire Survivors,

[00:28:13] Stardew Valley,

[00:28:16] Undertale, right?

[00:28:19] What was your...

[00:28:20] I wonder how many copies Haiti sold.

[00:28:23] A lot.

[00:28:25] Anyway, I wanted to get that out there.

[00:28:27] I thought there was a lot of cool things in there.

[00:28:29] I recommend that you either watch the video.

[00:28:33] It's 45 minutes long.

[00:28:34] If you don't have time for that, there are tons of...

[00:28:38] There are tons of news outlets that did little write-ups

[00:28:41] on things that were most exciting for them.

[00:28:43] But I thought there was a lot of cool stuff in there

[00:28:45] and a lot of stuff for everybody.

[00:28:49] Yeah, it was a cool show.

[00:28:51] Well, speaking of cool shows...

[00:28:53] Here's a transition for ya.

[00:28:56] Bethesda Softworks,

[00:28:58] the publisher of...

[00:29:00] for Bethesda Game Studios,

[00:29:02] creator of Fallout also...

[00:29:04] publishes or publish,

[00:29:06] now Xbox does.

[00:29:07] The games for...

[00:29:09] machine games.

[00:29:11] Okay.

[00:29:12] Creators of the Wolfenstein series of video games.

[00:29:15] Whoa!

[00:29:17] Of which, we were talking about today,

[00:29:19] Jake reached back into his Xbox Game Pass library,

[00:29:25] finally pulled this gem out

[00:29:27] that has been sitting there forever.

[00:29:29] He's never played it and he finally played it

[00:29:31] and so we're gonna talk about it.

[00:29:32] That's Wolfenstein,

[00:29:34] a new order.

[00:29:36] Jake, how are we gonna break it down?

[00:29:38] We will be talking about Wolfenstein, the new order,

[00:29:40] which, as of next month, will be 10 years old.

[00:29:44] Holy cow.

[00:29:45] Oh my goodness.

[00:29:46] Yeah, that is a long time.

[00:29:48] I actually played this game at release.

[00:29:51] 10 years ago.

[00:29:52] Really? Oh cool.

[00:29:54] Let's see.

[00:29:55] Wolfenstein, the new order,

[00:29:56] we're gonna be talking about this in four different categories.

[00:29:59] The first one is narrative,

[00:30:00] so we'll be talking about the story,

[00:30:02] story beats, themes.

[00:30:04] If you are new to the podcast,

[00:30:07] we typically don't go beyond the first 20 to 30%

[00:30:10] of a game's narrative,

[00:30:11] so mild spoilers are in order,

[00:30:13] but then again this game is nearly 10 years old,

[00:30:15] so if we slip up please forgive us.

[00:30:18] So yeah, narrative.

[00:30:19] We'll be talking about kind of what happens

[00:30:21] in this interesting alternative speculative fiction

[00:30:24] or historical fiction.

[00:30:26] And then next we'll be moving on to mechanics.

[00:30:29] We'll be talking about the way that you engage

[00:30:31] with the different systems of the game,

[00:30:33] how that sort of works, what lands,

[00:30:35] what maybe doesn't land as well.

[00:30:37] Third we'll be talking about the gameplay loop.

[00:30:39] So this is kind of the circuits

[00:30:41] that are baked into the game

[00:30:42] that kind of gets you roped in.

[00:30:45] They sometimes will define

[00:30:46] what a play session looks like,

[00:30:48] and essentially a lot of this has to do

[00:30:50] with the pacing

[00:30:51] and how a game sort of helps a player get through it.

[00:30:54] And then finally impact on the industry,

[00:30:56] what's really cool about doing a game

[00:30:58] that's 10 years old is that we have

[00:31:00] much more clear perspective

[00:31:04] on what this game has been able to accomplish

[00:31:07] in its wake,

[00:31:08] or maybe its absence from the game industry.

[00:31:12] We can discuss whether or not Wolfenstein

[00:31:14] the new order sort of faded

[00:31:16] from conversations broadly about the games industry.

[00:31:21] Last thing I want to say here folks is that

[00:31:23] every year Cameron and I

[00:31:25] we put together kind of bonkers predictions

[00:31:27] for what's going to happen in a year

[00:31:29] and whoever wins gets to force

[00:31:31] the other player to play some games,

[00:31:33] and I lost.

[00:31:35] And so I actually have to play two games.

[00:31:38] I have to play Wolfenstein the new order

[00:31:40] and Wolfenstein the new colossus.

[00:31:42] I finished Wolfenstein the new order

[00:31:44] and so this is me paying my debt to Cameron

[00:31:47] at least half of that debt.

[00:31:49] So be on the lookout,

[00:31:50] we will be covering the other game

[00:31:52] as well this year.

[00:31:55] Narrative.

[00:31:59] As far as alternate World War II histories go

[00:32:05] this is a really cool one.

[00:32:10] Really scary one.

[00:32:12] But a really cool one.

[00:32:15] Yeah, this is like the ultimate

[00:32:18] I don't know if maybe ultimate is the round word

[00:32:20] but this is like the World War II alternate history

[00:32:24] nightmare scenario.

[00:32:29] Where the Nazis through the use of

[00:32:33] basically advanced technology that they discover

[00:32:36] they win World War II

[00:32:38] and essentially are taking over the world.

[00:32:41] And the protagonist of the game,

[00:32:43] BJ Blazkowicz.

[00:32:45] Yeah, he's a US Special Forces soldier

[00:32:48] in the prologue you hop in your B17

[00:32:52] with your special ops buddies

[00:32:55] and you're going to Death's Head Castle

[00:32:58] to blow it up and try and do an op there.

[00:33:03] And then that's when the one

[00:33:05] and only branching narrative choice

[00:33:07] of the game I believe takes place.

[00:33:09] I think. Yes.

[00:33:11] Jake, is there other ones?

[00:33:13] I believe it's extremely significant this one.

[00:33:16] I can't think of other.

[00:33:18] I think this is the only truly significant one

[00:33:21] but basically you have two buddies

[00:33:23] you have a Scottish dude I can't remember his name.

[00:33:26] Oh my gosh.

[00:33:29] I'm getting this name mixed up with

[00:33:31] the real world actor's name.

[00:33:33] I think I had it pulled up.

[00:33:37] He's a really good character.

[00:33:39] Ferguson.

[00:33:41] Yes.

[00:33:43] Anyway, and then you have another buddy.

[00:33:45] So basically you have to pick within the first

[00:33:47] this is like this game is like visceral starts off.

[00:33:49] It's incredibly violent.

[00:33:51] You get captured.

[00:33:53] You have to basically pitch pick which one of your buddies

[00:33:55] lives or dies the one who lives

[00:33:57] like you escape with him out of the castle

[00:33:59] but you end up essentially

[00:34:01] in a coma or in a vegetative state

[00:34:03] in a mental hospital in Poland

[00:34:06] and then the game starts off where like you kind of

[00:34:08] wake up and you kind of get back to your senses

[00:34:11] and you come to discover that

[00:34:14] the American I mean the allies lost World War two

[00:34:16] the Nazis are taking over.

[00:34:18] They're insane.

[00:34:19] They have like crazy technology

[00:34:21] and you're like, okay, I got to figure out how to take these Nazi

[00:34:23] son of a bees down.

[00:34:27] Yeah, and it's

[00:34:29] it's a game about killing Nazis

[00:34:31] and man do you kill a lot of frickin Nazis

[00:34:34] and it's real good.

[00:34:37] Yeah, I would say that

[00:34:40] I let's see

[00:34:43] I don't really have any

[00:34:45] before playing this game

[00:34:46] I did not really have any real attachment to Wolfenstein

[00:34:49] as an IP

[00:34:51] and I don't think I played any of the games

[00:34:53] like even the old like doom

[00:34:56] versions of this game right anyway

[00:34:59] and so I the way that people talk about this game

[00:35:02] and we'll get to this when we talk about impact on the industry is like

[00:35:05] man, that is a great game.

[00:35:07] You get to kill a ton of Nazis and that's a lot of fun

[00:35:09] and so I kind of went into Wolfenstein

[00:35:11] the new order thinking that okay

[00:35:14] this is going to be a really fun kind of just shoot them up

[00:35:17] and first person shooter and this is going to be a good time

[00:35:20] but let me tell you folks the first hour

[00:35:22] and a half of this game narratively

[00:35:24] man it swept me off my feet

[00:35:27] I was really really impressed

[00:35:29] with some of the conversations

[00:35:32] that you have at the beginning and the fact I mean

[00:35:35] they had to show that the allies lost

[00:35:38] and make it really feel like a gut punch

[00:35:40] and I think they do a really successful job of that

[00:35:42] and it really is painful

[00:35:44] as you're playing as BJ and you get sent to this

[00:35:47] it's essentially like a psych ward right

[00:35:50] somewhere in Poland

[00:35:52] and the cutscene

[00:35:54] where you meet your lover

[00:35:56] yes but the cutscene there

[00:35:58] where BJ passes

[00:36:00] 14 years

[00:36:02] like pretty much as a vegetable

[00:36:04] and you see all these things that are happening

[00:36:06] you see the Nazis come in every now and then

[00:36:08] they sort of do their inspections and you see

[00:36:11] just this post war terror

[00:36:14] like reign of terror

[00:36:16] man I gotta say that one that scene was

[00:36:18] incredibly like

[00:36:20] emotional and radicalizing for me

[00:36:23] in the way that like it really got me pissed off

[00:36:25] at what was going on

[00:36:27] and then there's another conversation that happens

[00:36:29] shortly after when BJ sort of comes to

[00:36:32] and then there's this nurse

[00:36:34] who's been taking care of him for 14 years

[00:36:36] is her name Anya

[00:36:38] I'm doing a bad job with names

[00:36:40] and folks this is still within like the first

[00:36:43] 20% of the game

[00:36:45] so she takes you because the

[00:36:47] the center is gonna get shut down

[00:36:50] and she takes you to like her parents

[00:36:53] house I believe

[00:36:55] and that's where you have the conversation about

[00:36:58] alright BJ it's been 14 years

[00:37:00] and this is what the world is like

[00:37:03] and I gotta say that that conversation as well

[00:37:05] was man it was an incredible gut punch

[00:37:08] and so I feel like Wolfenstein in New Order

[00:37:10] does a really fantastic job

[00:37:12] of like dealing with themes of loss

[00:37:14] and grieving but also just like

[00:37:17] suddenly having to come to grip

[00:37:19] with what reality actually is

[00:37:21] and then you have to decide what you're gonna kind of do

[00:37:23] with this reality

[00:37:25] luckily BJ you know he's very likable

[00:37:27] and he has this finding rebellious spirit

[00:37:29] and so he's like

[00:37:31] there has to be resistance movement somewhere

[00:37:33] there has to be something that I can do

[00:37:35] I have to sort of finish this mission that I brought

[00:37:37] that I started

[00:37:39] I have to finish the job

[00:37:41] and so I think the game narratively does a really fantastic job

[00:37:43] of making you care for BJ

[00:37:45] but also care with BJ

[00:37:47] about like what

[00:37:49] the mission is like what the goal is

[00:37:51] and why

[00:37:53] not only why it's like

[00:37:55] captivating but why it's important

[00:37:57] to understand that Nazis are bad

[00:37:59] and that you need to take them out

[00:38:01] which I think the message could not be any more clear

[00:38:03] but just

[00:38:05] I think it did a really fantastic job of

[00:38:07] just digging its emotional hooks into you

[00:38:09] and be like alright

[00:38:11] we're gonna have to keep dealing with this

[00:38:13] I loved it

[00:38:15] I love the way that this game began

[00:38:17] if you couldn't tell

[00:38:19] just absolutely

[00:38:21] riveting beginning

[00:38:23] and it's just

[00:38:25] a fascinating look

[00:38:27] at

[00:38:29] it's that like what if game

[00:38:31] that played super well

[00:38:33] like you know what if this happened

[00:38:35] like what if the Nazis take it and they go even deeper

[00:38:37] into that idea

[00:38:39] in the second game

[00:38:41] because this part of the second game takes place

[00:38:43] in America

[00:38:45] where like the Nazis have made headway

[00:38:47] and it's like

[00:38:49] it's just a super fascinating

[00:38:51] they just do a really good job at like

[00:38:53] visualizing and communicating this idea

[00:38:55] of like okay what would actually

[00:38:57] happen if the Nazis

[00:38:59] took over and not only

[00:39:01] if they took over but if they were just completely

[00:39:03] unstoppable

[00:39:05] like they were just absolutely unstoppable

[00:39:09] and then you know they present this like wild

[00:39:11] wild

[00:39:15] crazy

[00:39:17] superhero super soldier

[00:39:19] who can just kill thousands of Nazis

[00:39:21] and like just do crazy crap to save the world

[00:39:23] and so it just makes

[00:39:25] that part of it as a goofy

[00:39:27] and as like

[00:39:29] bombastic as it is and unrealistic as it is

[00:39:31] it's just fun

[00:39:33] and it kind of

[00:39:35] fits into this sort of bombastic

[00:39:37] narrative but it kind of

[00:39:39] it toes both lines though where you have like the

[00:39:41] goofy almost like Duke Nukem-esque

[00:39:43] moments

[00:39:45] but then you have the super visceral

[00:39:47] like emotional

[00:39:49] violent like hey look at the

[00:39:51] reality of like if Nazis took over

[00:39:53] like this fricking sucks and this is wild

[00:39:55] like what they could

[00:39:57] what they would have done if they had

[00:39:59] you know just technological prowess

[00:40:01] above and beyond anything the world has ever seen

[00:40:05] and they really dig into that

[00:40:07] they also dig into themes of like

[00:40:11] what it means to hold on to hope against

[00:40:15] just impossible odds

[00:40:17] when they get into like

[00:40:19] and we're just spoiling this game because it's really old by now

[00:40:21] so go play it but

[00:40:23] when you finally like

[00:40:25] find a resistance group

[00:40:27] that kind of has a handle on maybe

[00:40:29] an idea of how they can possibly

[00:40:31] win

[00:40:33] you know you get a sense of like okay here's this

[00:40:35] here's this hope

[00:40:37] that you can hang on to

[00:40:39] despite impossible odds and Anya does a really good job

[00:40:41] I think communicating to the player

[00:40:43] she's like that vehicle of like

[00:40:45] hey there's actually hope here

[00:40:47] there's hope for like having a life

[00:40:49] there's hope for like defeating the Nazis even though it seems like

[00:40:51] literally impossible

[00:40:53] yeah it's interesting

[00:40:55] the game with BJ

[00:40:57] I thought he was a really fascinating character

[00:40:59] because in some moments

[00:41:01] he's like the super hyper

[00:41:03] masculine just like hyper violent

[00:41:05] person

[00:41:07] and in other moments you see him

[00:41:09] trying to

[00:41:11] come to grips with like okay

[00:41:13] but this is the right thing to do

[00:41:15] I thought that he was a little more nuanced

[00:41:17] than just like the Duke Nukem character

[00:41:19] and only bring it up because

[00:41:21] for sure more nuanced but

[00:41:23] there are definitely those moments you can see the roots

[00:41:25] of where this game comes from

[00:41:27] Wolfenstein's a really old IP

[00:41:29] and a lot of those like Doom guy

[00:41:31] hyper masculine right just

[00:41:33] strong silent I'm just going to kill them all

[00:41:35] because it's the right thing to do you know

[00:41:37] but yeah I liked him

[00:41:39] I liked Anya as well too

[00:41:41] I just thought like a lot of the characters

[00:41:43] and the voice acting in this game just like

[00:41:45] really caught me off guard it's like

[00:41:47] wow these characters really feel

[00:41:49] you know you could feel this type of investment

[00:41:51] and there's a lot more complexity

[00:41:53] I feel like with the main characters

[00:41:55] of the resistance group

[00:41:57] than most stories

[00:41:59] that are just like hey we're ragtag

[00:42:01] group of heroes and we're going to take down

[00:42:03] the big bad

[00:42:05] because mainly because of what you're getting at camera

[00:42:07] there is

[00:42:09] there's doubt there's hope

[00:42:11] there are highs there are lows

[00:42:13] and the sort of one thing they have

[00:42:15] in common is like if we

[00:42:17] don't do something about this

[00:42:19] who else will

[00:42:21] it's like we got to step in these shoes

[00:42:23] and we got to step up and we got to do something because

[00:42:25] we all know that this is wrong

[00:42:27] we cannot let this continue to happen

[00:42:29] which I think is a really important

[00:42:31] and powerful message when it comes to

[00:42:33] justice like being

[00:42:35] a vehicle of justice when you see injustice

[00:42:37] in the world because

[00:42:39] if the injustice that you are witnessing

[00:42:41] might not impact you directly

[00:42:43] right and you might just be a witness

[00:42:45] to it rather than like a victim of those injustices

[00:42:47] man it's easy

[00:42:49] to brush it aside and just be

[00:42:51] you know be sad that it's happening

[00:42:53] and not do anything and so I feel like

[00:42:55] the new order does a pretty good job of being like

[00:42:57] nah we could be sad about this

[00:42:59] it's awful what we're witnessing

[00:43:01] but we have

[00:43:03] abilities within us here

[00:43:05] to actually try to do something we should do that

[00:43:07] you know so I thought it was really cool

[00:43:09] I thought it was interesting too I mean this is

[00:43:11] a European developer which

[00:43:13] I think kind of makes sense

[00:43:15] the more I watch like different World War 2

[00:43:17] films like American World War 2

[00:43:19] films versus European ones

[00:43:21] they present that war in

[00:43:23] entirely different ways and I feel like

[00:43:25] that this one you could feel kind of the

[00:43:27] European side of it a lot more right

[00:43:29] because when you think about World War 2

[00:43:31] Cameran anywhere both Americans here right

[00:43:33] it's very easy to think about World War 2

[00:43:35] as an extremely foreign war

[00:43:37] rather than something that impacted

[00:43:39] like the United States directly

[00:43:41] because there wasn't a direct attack

[00:43:43] and so a lot of our film

[00:43:45] in literature reflects that

[00:43:47] whereas European

[00:43:49] I think literature and film

[00:43:51] that deals with World War 2 tends to be a lot more

[00:43:53] visceral and it tends to be a lot

[00:43:55] more in your face

[00:43:57] and so I thought it was really good to see

[00:43:59] that I feel like in

[00:44:01] Wolfenstein the New Order just that

[00:44:03] how close to home it really feels

[00:44:05] let's talk about the mechanics

[00:44:09] this is the first person shooter

[00:44:11] pretty much all the way through very

[00:44:15] honestly like pretty buy the numbers

[00:44:17] first person shooter aside from

[00:44:19] like a couple different things like there's

[00:44:21] some dual wielding involved

[00:44:23] there are like quite a few different weapons

[00:44:27] you do end up

[00:44:29] if I'm not mistaken getting

[00:44:31] a couple special abilities

[00:44:33] but they're more like speed boost or

[00:44:35] like health boost they're not anything like

[00:44:37] super creative I think

[00:44:39] there's also one I think that makes you taller

[00:44:41] wait what is that it

[00:44:43] I'm saying this wrong

[00:44:45] I'm saying this wrong I have to look this up

[00:44:47] well I mean as you play

[00:44:49] the game and as you kind of

[00:44:51] accomplish many achievements within the game

[00:44:53] you might like

[00:44:55] get increased abilities

[00:44:57] like pistol handling

[00:44:59] I feel like or knife throwing

[00:45:01] like you're able to

[00:45:03] hold more knives or dual

[00:45:05] wheel knives so you can

[00:45:07] kind of build it's not really like RPG

[00:45:09] ability skill tree at all

[00:45:11] not even close

[00:45:13] it's very much

[00:45:15] like a

[00:45:17] I mean even 10 years ago sort of an old

[00:45:19] school first person shooter

[00:45:21] I mean it's still fun but I felt like

[00:45:23] it was still pretty rudimentary

[00:45:25] right I don't think

[00:45:27] the dual wielding drove me insane

[00:45:29] and the weapon wheel

[00:45:31] here also kind of drove me insane

[00:45:33] but gunplay

[00:45:35] I thought was fine par for the course

[00:45:37] I think you said buy the numbers

[00:45:39] I didn't feel like there's anything super innovative

[00:45:41] here

[00:45:43] but hey you get to shoot a lot of dudes

[00:45:47] there are a lot of dudes

[00:45:49] and there's some interesting enemy types

[00:45:51] I would say as well

[00:45:53] yeah but there's like perks

[00:45:55] there's like dual wielding

[00:45:57] there's a few sort of

[00:45:59] sort of minimal

[00:46:01] special abilities but like mostly it's

[00:46:03] literally just like

[00:46:05] see person shoot person

[00:46:07] you get new guns as you go

[00:46:09] they get like increasingly larger

[00:46:11] so like very much like the old school vibe

[00:46:13] of and that's very much

[00:46:15] what they were trying to do like similar to doom

[00:46:17] which funny enough

[00:46:19] was from id software

[00:46:21] which is also under Bethesda or was under

[00:46:23] Bethesda

[00:46:25] but I do think doom like did a better

[00:46:27] job with their combat to be honest

[00:46:29] this is probably my biggest critique of Wolfenstein

[00:46:31] is that it's a little bit too by the numbers

[00:46:33] it's just like a teeny bit too by

[00:46:35] the numbers and I don't think the second

[00:46:37] one actually fixes that very much to

[00:46:39] be honest

[00:46:41] it does like a couple things better but

[00:46:43] yeah it'd be nice to have like a little bit more

[00:46:45] a little bit more

[00:46:47] with the combat with the fighting but

[00:46:49] all in all like this is sort of

[00:46:51] a this is sort of just

[00:46:53] play through

[00:46:55] set play through really cool

[00:46:57] set pieces in between like really

[00:46:59] interesting cool story moments

[00:47:01] and shoot stuff and that's pretty much it

[00:47:03] yeah I would agree the other

[00:47:05] mechanic I want to talk about was just

[00:47:07] you have to it's like cover shooting right so

[00:47:09] you're taking cover a lot

[00:47:11] of the time and then you could take pop

[00:47:13] shots and then you kind of have to judge

[00:47:15] when and how and when you're going to shoot so it does feel like

[00:47:17] a shooting gallery kind of

[00:47:19] play man I just kind of felt like

[00:47:21] as I was playing this

[00:47:23] I was like did

[00:47:25] did Halo do this better

[00:47:27] did Gears of War do this better

[00:47:29] and yeah they absolutely did

[00:47:31] and I kind of felt bad because I was like

[00:47:33] I shouldn't be making so many comparisons to

[00:47:35] other games but it just

[00:47:37] kind of felt like it was

[00:47:39] okay what is popular in this type

[00:47:41] of first person shooting how do we adapt

[00:47:43] it to the story and

[00:47:45] I actually ended up

[00:47:47] I can't remember if I started the difficulty

[00:47:49] on normal but at one point I just

[00:47:51] bumped it down to easy I was like listen I don't

[00:47:53] really want to think about

[00:47:55] this strategy here because it's not that

[00:47:57] engaging I was

[00:47:59] way more interested in the story way more than

[00:48:01] I expected but yeah that's how

[00:48:03] I played it

[00:48:05] yeah it's the story is good enough

[00:48:07] is the story really pulls it

[00:48:09] all together you're not there

[00:48:11] I mean I'll be frank like you're not there

[00:48:13] for the gameplay it's not even like

[00:48:15] Doom where you're sort of

[00:48:17] it's not Doom's different

[00:48:19] and that Doom I think has

[00:48:21] a little bit of a better just a

[00:48:23] little bit more fun like mechanical shooting

[00:48:25] style to it that's

[00:48:27] that I think does just some some better

[00:48:29] thing like I think what Doom

[00:48:31] did so well was that

[00:48:33] embracing

[00:48:35] like the up close in your face melee

[00:48:37] combat and kind of make like

[00:48:39] encouraging you in its design

[00:48:41] to like get up close and personal with

[00:48:43] people and then that kind of gave you

[00:48:45] more ammo and then you had that cycle

[00:48:47] that was like a really fun

[00:48:49] Wolfe's Dine doesn't even do that it's

[00:48:51] like you say it's like a shooting gallery it's just like

[00:48:53] people coming out of the woodwork and then

[00:48:55] you hope you kind of have enough ammo and

[00:48:57] like bigger guns than they do

[00:48:59] I think turning down to easy is definitely

[00:49:01] I've actually played this game on hard and

[00:49:03] beat it up which

[00:49:05] yeah which because I like the

[00:49:07] story so much and it's similar

[00:49:09] to my approach with like Uncharted 4

[00:49:11] which

[00:49:13] that also has you know

[00:49:15] as fun gameplay and like pretty decently

[00:49:17] fun shooting but

[00:49:19] you're kind of there for the story but I like the story so much

[00:49:21] is like I want to do this again but I want to have a slightly different

[00:49:23] experience so I turned it up to hard

[00:49:25] but to your point

[00:49:27] it wasn't like a super engaging

[00:49:29] from like a strategy

[00:49:31] mechanical perspective

[00:49:33] yeah last things I want to say about mechanics

[00:49:35] would be there is quite a lot

[00:49:37] of stealth in this game and you

[00:49:39] can could maybe for the most part

[00:49:41] play this game with like

[00:49:43] well okay there are some sections where you can't really do stealth

[00:49:45] but stealth is encouraged

[00:49:49] and

[00:49:51] again I really don't want to compare this to

[00:49:53] other games but it made me miss Dishonored

[00:49:55] 2 because Dishonored 2 has such

[00:49:57] remarkable abilities

[00:49:59] sort of built into

[00:50:01] how you approach stealth in different scenarios

[00:50:03] and it changes the level design

[00:50:05] quite a lot

[00:50:07] and stealth was

[00:50:09] okay

[00:50:11] then whenever you got into like

[00:50:13] a knife fight with somebody

[00:50:15] it kind of just felt like and maybe this is because I was playing on easy

[00:50:17] just two people like a giant slap

[00:50:19] fight

[00:50:21] just two it's like gold man

[00:50:23] yeah exactly like how fast

[00:50:25] can you just whittle down this person's health

[00:50:27] but here's the thing that

[00:50:29] was also weird to me is I felt like Wolfenstein

[00:50:31] the new order it's like okay you could do stealth

[00:50:33] or you could do mid range guns

[00:50:37] and that's really where the game sits

[00:50:39] there's not a whole lot more with melee or close range

[00:50:41] there is sniping

[00:50:43] and I actually used a sniper quite a lot just because it was super powerful

[00:50:45] but

[00:50:47] I don't know

[00:50:49] you didn't need it

[00:50:51] the game was most comfortable

[00:50:53] when it came to the combat in the mid range

[00:50:55] which is fine

[00:50:57] but it would have been nice to feel like

[00:50:59] I had more viable options

[00:51:01] because like the pistols for example

[00:51:03] really sucked

[00:51:05] I really hated using the pistols or anything close range

[00:51:07] really like the knives

[00:51:09] I just felt like it would have been great

[00:51:11] if the variety of weapons

[00:51:13] that you had

[00:51:15] as a equate to different distances in which you're engaging

[00:51:17] in combat were more viable and more

[00:51:19] interesting

[00:51:21] let's talk about the gameplay loop

[00:51:23] again this is very

[00:51:25] very much old school

[00:51:27] it's linear level to level

[00:51:29] gameplay

[00:51:31] moment to moment set piece to set piece

[00:51:33] you know similar to like

[00:51:35] if you've ever played like a call of duty campaign

[00:51:37] very similar to that

[00:51:39] I think you can return to levels

[00:51:41] if I'm not mistaken

[00:51:43] later on I think you get the ability to do that

[00:51:45] I'm like struggling to remember

[00:51:47] yeah and you can like get collectibles

[00:51:49] you can get collectibles and you can like

[00:51:51] farm kills and different stuff

[00:51:53] for perks

[00:51:55] because you can add perks that give you

[00:51:57] faster reload

[00:51:59] and basic stuff like that but for the most part

[00:52:01] it's like it's very straightforward

[00:52:03] but it's the story again

[00:52:05] that pulls you along and hooks you along

[00:52:07] like you want to know are they going to succeed

[00:52:09] are they going to figure out how to fight back against this

[00:52:11] you know

[00:52:13] crazy and you want to honestly

[00:52:15] you want to see what the next set piece is

[00:52:17] because every set piece

[00:52:19] is so crazy

[00:52:21] awesome

[00:52:23] everything from a

[00:52:25] prison camp

[00:52:27] to huge spoiler

[00:52:29] here so if you don't want to hear this skip ahead 30 seconds

[00:52:31] to a moon base

[00:52:33] a freaking moon base

[00:52:37] one of the best lines from the game is

[00:52:39] BJ Blasquez is like I'm on the effin moon

[00:52:45] yeah so anyway you go to freaking moon base

[00:52:47] and like you're fighting Nazis on the moon

[00:52:49] with like

[00:52:53] just crazy crazy set pieces

[00:52:55] and that continues like you go to London

[00:52:57] and the Nazis have built this like

[00:52:59] crazy weapons facility in London

[00:53:01] that you know it's like completely leveled

[00:53:03] and you go there

[00:53:05] that's such a cool set piece too

[00:53:07] and just set piece to set piece

[00:53:09] and that's what pulls you along

[00:53:11] yeah um yeah

[00:53:13] so I'm going to play an additional level based

[00:53:15] game

[00:53:17] which I like I mean

[00:53:19] I think it's always refreshing just to know

[00:53:21] that you have very definitive start and end times

[00:53:23] to like how you're going to be playing a game

[00:53:25] so I played this game mostly

[00:53:27] I think it's divided up into like 15 or 16 chapters

[00:53:29] something like that

[00:53:31] in most play sessions were defined by playing

[00:53:33] two chapters a night

[00:53:35] or a session whenever I played it

[00:53:37] um

[00:53:39] yeah I think this is great

[00:53:41] and I'm going to go through a little bit of the loop

[00:53:43] like Kim and I have both said multiple times at this point

[00:53:45] it's the story man

[00:53:47] the story was

[00:53:49] interesting and that is the biggest reason to be pushed

[00:53:51] forward

[00:53:53] every now and then there were some

[00:53:55] I would say weapons that you got

[00:53:57] um that were like ooh yeah

[00:53:59] this weapon is fun I'm going to use this a lot more

[00:54:01] in this next level

[00:54:03] but that's really what it is

[00:54:05] unfortunately I feel like this game came out

[00:54:07] like in the heyday of everything as gray scale

[00:54:09] so this is a little bit of a random sign note

[00:54:11] so the set pieces are

[00:54:13] amazing and I'm glad that they were

[00:54:15] because otherwise you're looking at a ton of gray scale

[00:54:17] um

[00:54:19] there are several levels

[00:54:21] one I'm thinking of that is later in the game

[00:54:23] so I won't mention it but essentially

[00:54:25] it almost feels like

[00:54:27] you have to do a little bit of platforming in there as well

[00:54:29] which I think actually worked

[00:54:31] pretty dang well for the level

[00:54:33] um but yeah

[00:54:35] a lot of levels felt like

[00:54:37] labyrinths I felt like the level design was

[00:54:39] really solid and it did a good job of pushing you forward

[00:54:41] um

[00:54:43] but yeah I would say

[00:54:45] it'd be I didn't ever feel

[00:54:47] the desire I felt really satisfied to finish

[00:54:49] like two chapters a night I never felt like

[00:54:51] I wanted to blitz through the game

[00:54:55] let's talk about impact on the industry this is a 10

[00:54:57] year old game now

[00:54:59] um yeah

[00:55:01] like

[00:55:03] I don't know if there has been a big impact

[00:55:05] to be honest because

[00:55:07] we haven't seen very many of these I feel like

[00:55:09] machine games and ID and

[00:55:11] software are the only teams that really make

[00:55:13] games like this I mean we got

[00:55:15] Doom

[00:55:17] 2016

[00:55:19] well are these being

[00:55:21] are people calling these boomer shooters now

[00:55:23] I think so I think these are boomer shooters

[00:55:25] high octane

[00:55:27] so maybe that is the influence

[00:55:29] is like this was sort of I think this is

[00:55:31] pre-doom right this is

[00:55:33] yeah do it's pre-doom 2016

[00:55:35] came out later

[00:55:37] I think this came out in 2013

[00:55:39] I was a 2014 yeah

[00:55:41] yeah so this this started it

[00:55:43] which is from a obviously

[00:55:45] this is like the late late sequel

[00:55:47] to the original Wolfenstein games

[00:55:49] which are definitely boomer shooters right

[00:55:51] um

[00:55:53] Doom and quake being the ultimate

[00:55:55] boomer shooters then those got remade also

[00:55:57] under Bethesda from from mid

[00:55:59] software like I said and now you

[00:56:01] have

[00:56:03] boomer shooters appearing on steam like

[00:56:05] bolt guns a recent one which is like a

[00:56:07] warhammer style

[00:56:09] doom game and there's other games like this

[00:56:11] so there's definitely an audience

[00:56:13] for games like this I really like these I

[00:56:15] didn't get a chance to play

[00:56:17] bolt what is it called bolt gun

[00:56:19] bolt gun

[00:56:21] there's other ones on there's other

[00:56:23] like really highly

[00:56:25] accolated ones on

[00:56:27] steam that do like different

[00:56:29] cool things so this is like its

[00:56:31] own category to do your

[00:56:33] point Jake and I don't I think this

[00:56:35] this is one of the games that kind of started that

[00:56:37] trend and I honestly hope we see more of these

[00:56:39] and it makes me wonder what

[00:56:41] the next

[00:56:43] like I think

[00:56:45] I think there's a quake something going on

[00:56:47] you know they obviously did doom

[00:56:49] maternal like the sequel right to

[00:56:51] to doom which was

[00:56:53] um which was good

[00:56:55] it was a solid game like it was fun doom

[00:56:57] like a really fun game they added like cool

[00:56:59] mechanics to it

[00:57:01] and now machine games is working on the Indiana Jones

[00:57:03] game where you're killing more Nazis so I'm

[00:57:05] curious to see like

[00:57:07] knowing what we know about how amazing

[00:57:09] of set pieces and like visceral

[00:57:11] storytelling they can do what can they do with

[00:57:13] an Indiana Jones game

[00:57:15] yeah actually playing through Wolfenstein the new

[00:57:17] order got me really

[00:57:19] excited for the Indiana Jones game

[00:57:21] and I know I know there's like

[00:57:23] honestly

[00:57:25] most of the complaints about sort of that most

[00:57:27] recent reveal from Xbox have kind of

[00:57:29] dissipated but

[00:57:31] listen

[00:57:33] I think it is a good creative

[00:57:35] challenge for the Wolfenstein team

[00:57:37] for machine games to have Indiana Jones

[00:57:39] because he has a very

[00:57:41] specific weapons arsenal

[00:57:43] right the dude punches

[00:57:45] he's got a revolver and he's got a whip

[00:57:47] right he's really not using

[00:57:49] much else in any of his

[00:57:51] combat and so

[00:57:53] I feel like

[00:57:55] they can make an FPS game

[00:57:57] and they can make a game about killing Nazis

[00:57:59] but I feel like this we talked

[00:58:01] about this I can't remember what episode was maybe Helldivers too

[00:58:03] I think this sort of limitation

[00:58:05] of what Indiana Jones's arsenal is

[00:58:07] will actually breed a lot of really good

[00:58:09] creativity that will help shake up

[00:58:11] the moment to moment gameplay and the mechanics

[00:58:13] in a really positive way

[00:58:15] and after beating this game I went

[00:58:17] back and I watched the trailer and I was like

[00:58:19] yeah okay I think that they

[00:58:21] actually are really going to do the whip really well

[00:58:23] I think that these things are going to feel good

[00:58:25] and so it got me a lot more excited for Indiana Jones

[00:58:29] but yeah let's see the boomer

[00:58:31] shooter kind of trend

[00:58:33] the fact that this term is becoming a thing

[00:58:35] definitely

[00:58:37] speaks to the fact that this is a trend

[00:58:39] and that I think machine games

[00:58:41] Bethesda more generally

[00:58:43] have an opportunity to really capitalize

[00:58:45] on this moment

[00:58:47] and what they need to do

[00:58:49] is follow up with Phil Spencer's

[00:58:51] tease of wearing that Hexen shirt

[00:58:55] give us

[00:58:57] give us Hexen, dude give us the original

[00:58:59] Hexen

[00:59:01] on modern consoles just like a

[00:59:03] remaster that thing probably could play

[00:59:05] 240 FPS

[00:59:07] right it's a 90-95 game

[00:59:11] I mean I also just want Wolfenstein 3

[00:59:13] is that okay it isn't

[00:59:15] I haven't it isn't

[00:59:17] it's been developed right like it's been announced

[00:59:19] I mean I don't

[00:59:21] I don't know if they've actually confirmed it

[00:59:23] but I've been predicting it for a while

[00:59:25] there was Wolfenstein

[00:59:27] Youngblood which was sort of a

[00:59:29] offshoot from the main

[00:59:31] games that features

[00:59:33] BJ Blasquez's daughters

[00:59:35] like and then they go kill Nazis

[00:59:37] and stuff

[00:59:39] which didn't was wasn't critically well received

[00:59:41] because it like

[00:59:43] it did it did things a little bit differently

[00:59:45] it wasn't well received

[00:59:47] so yeah I want to see the third game

[00:59:49] super bad I've actually wanted it

[00:59:51] for years and years and I've kind of lost steam

[00:59:53] on it I was like

[00:59:55] really hyped thinking that it had

[00:59:57] to be coming out anytime

[00:59:59] like at any moment and now I just have

[01:00:01] no idea where it's at and obviously with them working

[01:00:03] on Indiana Jones like who knows

[01:00:05] when we'll see

[01:00:07] Wolfenstein 3

[01:00:09] yeah I feel like what kind of happens

[01:00:11] sometimes is um

[01:00:13] when game studios suddenly

[01:00:15] get a chance to work on a

[01:00:17] really cool extremely popular IP

[01:00:19] you know you have to

[01:00:21] jump at that opportunity and you kind of have to leave

[01:00:23] all other projects in the dust

[01:00:25] I feel like this has happened also maybe

[01:00:27] with um

[01:00:29] Arcane getting access to the blade IP

[01:00:31] right whatever they were working

[01:00:33] on is on the back burner

[01:00:35] as soon as that deal went through it's like

[01:00:37] alright full throttle full steam ahead on this

[01:00:39] this one project right even just

[01:00:41] thinking about most recently from the triple I initiative

[01:00:43] right you have I think Evil Empire

[01:00:45] which is an indie studio that

[01:00:47] has some of the original creators of Dead Cells

[01:00:49] in it you get an opportunity

[01:00:51] to work on a Prince of Persia game whatever

[01:00:53] you're working on kind of gets

[01:00:55] sidelined for a little bit so

[01:00:57] it's interesting to see I would love

[01:00:59] to know more the details about how

[01:01:01] machine guns was able to

[01:01:03] get this deal made

[01:01:05] to make an Indiana Jones game

[01:01:07] but um yeah I don't know

[01:01:09] I think impact on the industry yeah we've

[01:01:11] talked a little bit about boomershooters but I think

[01:01:13] overall from

[01:01:15] what I understand of course I came to this

[01:01:17] game super late 10 years after

[01:01:19] it released is that

[01:01:21] people always talk about this game

[01:01:23] fondly but I'm not

[01:01:25] entirely certain that it made

[01:01:27] waves in game design

[01:01:29] in game development I'm not

[01:01:31] sure in camera and I here we're both struggling

[01:01:33] to think outside of

[01:01:35] you know games that run basically on

[01:01:37] the doom model

[01:01:39] what games are drawing a lot

[01:01:41] of inspiration from Wolfenstein I do

[01:01:43] think part of this is

[01:01:45] um

[01:01:47] and I am a little annoyed

[01:01:49] that I have to say this but I think there's a little more trepidation

[01:01:51] now to make games where

[01:01:53] it's so obvious that Nazis are bad

[01:01:55] maybe I'm being really cynical here

[01:01:57] maybe

[01:01:59] maybe being really cynical we'll

[01:02:01] see how on the nose it is in Indiana Jones

[01:02:03] I mean I hope in Indiana Jones just like

[01:02:05] yeah we're punching Nazis in the face

[01:02:07] and that's what we should be doing to

[01:02:09] Nazis Nazis are morally

[01:02:11] repulsive folks right um

[01:02:13] so I don't know

[01:02:15] I don't know is anybody else making a game

[01:02:17] about

[01:02:19] Nazis and about how bad Nazis are

[01:02:21] I mean I feel like this is

[01:02:23] it's never

[01:02:25] you know never goes out of style to kill

[01:02:27] Nazis right I think that's just

[01:02:29] right I don't know

[01:02:31] maybe I'm being cynical and I'm probably reading too much into

[01:02:33] to contemporary politics

[01:02:35] when I say that so take that with a grain of salt

[01:02:37] but yeah I don't know

[01:02:39] um it's just

[01:02:41] so interesting because

[01:02:43] I feel like a lot of

[01:02:45] current media I'm thinking most recently

[01:02:47] Top Gun

[01:02:49] Maverick which was a great movie

[01:02:51] but the enemy

[01:02:53] in that film is so purposefully non-descript

[01:02:55] even when they were doing like the red

[01:02:57] dawn read make

[01:02:59] movie which whatever

[01:03:01] right um in the original red dawn from the

[01:03:03] 80s it was so obvious

[01:03:05] that they were like okay the bad guys

[01:03:07] are communists from these

[01:03:09] countries like specifically

[01:03:11] right and then with the remake

[01:03:13] of red dawn they were

[01:03:15] originally going to make them Chinese

[01:03:17] but then they're like oh shoot

[01:03:19] this film's going to tank in China if we say that

[01:03:21] the Chinese or the enemies we'll just make

[01:03:23] them North Koreans because the film's not going to show

[01:03:25] there anyway right which

[01:03:27] kind of problematic we don't need to dig

[01:03:29] into that too much but I just

[01:03:31] kind of wonder if it's

[01:03:33] time to not play it so safe

[01:03:35] I don't know

[01:03:37] little bit I mean not with Nazis

[01:03:39] I think that's free

[01:03:41] game for yeah

[01:03:43] it's easily it's like easily

[01:03:45] right it's like you look at the old school James Bond

[01:03:47] movies and like even like

[01:03:49] Indiana Jones is like who are the bad guys

[01:03:51] so Nazis it's the Nazis

[01:03:53] right in some the future the future

[01:03:55] Nazis that came

[01:03:57] I don't know

[01:03:59] I'm going to end that sort of conversation

[01:04:01] you can we could talk about it

[01:04:03] it's sad that we live in a world where we even have to

[01:04:05] like ponder that that's a thing

[01:04:07] because if you're like 10 years ago

[01:04:09] even five years ago like you wouldn't even

[01:04:11] thought about that

[01:04:13] right now like you kill the fricking Nazis

[01:04:15] and now it's like oh there's actually people who

[01:04:17] are it's like no no let's just

[01:04:19] actually no

[01:04:21] right so we'll see I

[01:04:23] you know we'll see what happens with Wolfenstein 3

[01:04:25] it's gotta be in the works

[01:04:27] but I'm sure it's really early

[01:04:29] I think Indiana Jones is obviously taken

[01:04:31] that that's taken a backseat

[01:04:33] which hopefully

[01:04:35] it

[01:04:37] hopefully that turns out to

[01:04:39] be super positive that

[01:04:41] Indiana Jones is fantastic

[01:04:43] and then they can piggyback off that success

[01:04:45] and and go finish you know

[01:04:47] Wolfenstein trilogy which I think would be awesome

[01:04:49] so yeah

[01:04:51] well Jake any other thoughts on

[01:04:53] Wolfenstein a new order

[01:04:55] a new order if you haven't

[01:04:57] played this game

[01:04:59] I think the one thing I would like you to take from

[01:05:01] what I've said and don't take it with a grain

[01:05:03] of salt just take it for what it is

[01:05:05] this was a good game to go back

[01:05:07] to I think it held up pretty well despite

[01:05:09] sort of Cameronized misgivings maybe

[01:05:11] about the gunplay not being necessarily

[01:05:13] innovative but it's not bad

[01:05:15] it's not hampering

[01:05:17] the experience either right

[01:05:19] so if you are on the fence

[01:05:21] if you have game pass

[01:05:23] play this game you know

[01:05:25] and let us know what you think

[01:05:27] like I said earlier we will be doing an episode

[01:05:29] on Wolfenstein the new Colossus as soon as

[01:05:31] I get around to playing it

[01:05:33] so

[01:05:35] yeah I think it's a fine time to go back

[01:05:37] and revisit these games they're fun or this game

[01:05:39] I should say

[01:05:41] well ladies and gentlemen this has been another episode

[01:05:43] of the pre-order bonus podcast talking

[01:05:45] Wolfenstein

[01:05:47] the new order a new order

[01:05:49] I can't remember

[01:05:51] the new order

[01:05:53] the first new Wolfenstein game

[01:05:55] came out in 2014

[01:05:57] it's on Game Pass check it out

[01:05:59] they're making Indiana Jones game so it's a good time

[01:06:01] to do it you could play this game

[01:06:03] and play the second game to get yourself prepped

[01:06:05] for whatever they're going to do for Indiana Jones

[01:06:07] later this year

[01:06:09] if you liked the show leave us

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