Enshrouded (Early Access)

[00:00:10] [SPEAKER_00]: Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to another episode of The Pre-Order Manus Podcasts and

[00:00:14] [SPEAKER_00]: one of your host, Cameron Warren and I'm joined as always by the Pixel Professor.

[00:00:20] [SPEAKER_00]: Jacob Price.

[00:00:22] [SPEAKER_00]: Jake Itz August 29th 2024.

[00:00:30] [SPEAKER_00]: And we have entered the absolute on-pour.

[00:00:39] [SPEAKER_00]: Unending, barrage of relentless video game releases from now until basically the beginning

[00:00:45] [SPEAKER_00]: of December.

[00:00:47] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it is.

[00:00:49] [SPEAKER_02]: There is a lot.

[00:00:51] [SPEAKER_02]: There is so much happening.

[00:00:53] [SPEAKER_02]: I was just thinking about this.

[00:00:56] [SPEAKER_02]: I'm trying to figure out what games I'm going to end up playing in September.

[00:01:01] [SPEAKER_02]: How I'm going to split up by time.

[00:01:04] [SPEAKER_02]: Sorry everybody.

[00:01:04] [SPEAKER_02]: I'm going to be yawning a lot.

[00:01:06] [SPEAKER_02]: It's been a long day and I've been talking a lot, but I am excited to talk about what

[00:01:10] [SPEAKER_02]: we're talking about tonight.

[00:01:10] [SPEAKER_02]: But yeah, anyway, September man, it's going to be big.

[00:01:15] [SPEAKER_02]: I did the unthinkable today, man.

[00:01:17] [SPEAKER_02]: I pre-order the game.

[00:01:20] [SPEAKER_00]: I know the game you pre-ordered and if there was any game to pre-order, you picked what

[00:01:28] [SPEAKER_00]: is likely to be without hyperboleap the game of the year for this year.

[00:01:35] [SPEAKER_02]: It's like one of the easiest games to pre-order, which is rare.

[00:01:39] [SPEAKER_00]: I feel like I want to know what game was that Jake?

[00:01:42] [SPEAKER_02]: It is.

[00:01:43] [SPEAKER_02]: Dremel.

[00:01:44] Broom.

[00:01:46] [SPEAKER_02]: Broom.

[00:01:47] [SPEAKER_02]: Did why add in sound effects when we can just make our own.

[00:01:50] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, we don't need one.

[00:01:51] [SPEAKER_02]: It doesn't go.

[00:01:53] [SPEAKER_02]: You know, push your button.

[00:01:55] [SPEAKER_02]: Lame.

[00:01:58] [SPEAKER_02]: I pre-ordered Astrobot, man.

[00:02:01] [SPEAKER_00]: Dude, let me tell you.

[00:02:05] [SPEAKER_00]: That's the greatest pre-order that was ever.

[00:02:07] [SPEAKER_00]: That's the greatest pre-order decision you could ever make.

[00:02:09] [SPEAKER_00]: There's that's a guarantee.

[00:02:11] [SPEAKER_00]: That is a certified guaranteed 9 out of 10 minimum video game.

[00:02:19] [SPEAKER_00]: Probably 10 out of 10 to be honest.

[00:02:21] [SPEAKER_00]: It's going to game of the year content.

[00:02:23] [SPEAKER_02]: It's going to be really great.

[00:02:24] [SPEAKER_02]: And my kids are going to get a lot of my alleged out of it too.

[00:02:26] [SPEAKER_02]: I was just like, you know what?

[00:02:29] [SPEAKER_02]: I'm just going to do this.

[00:02:30] [SPEAKER_02]: I'm just going to do this right now.

[00:02:33] [SPEAKER_02]: Little, little impulsive.

[00:02:34] [SPEAKER_02]: I've been pretty good the past few years of not pre-ordering things super often.

[00:02:40] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, so man, that's what I've been doing.

[00:02:43] [SPEAKER_02]: I've been finishing some games and I have been actually starting some new games.

[00:02:49] [SPEAKER_02]: But if you are a long time listener in the pre-order bonus podcast, this isn't

[00:02:53] [SPEAKER_02]: news to you.

[00:02:54] [SPEAKER_02]: I'm always starting new games.

[00:02:56] [SPEAKER_02]: It's a curse that I'm afflicted.

[00:02:57] [SPEAKER_00]: Jake is typically playing about six to eight games in a time.

[00:03:02] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I am finished as all of it.

[00:03:04] [SPEAKER_00]: He doesn't just start him.

[00:03:05] [SPEAKER_00]: He's finishing him as well.

[00:03:07] [SPEAKER_00]: So I just keep that in mind.

[00:03:08] [SPEAKER_02]: I finish most games that I play.

[00:03:10] [SPEAKER_02]: I'm actually looking at my spreadsheet right now.

[00:03:15] [SPEAKER_02]: September is the month of PlayStation though, man.

[00:03:17] [SPEAKER_02]: For me, like, I'm going to be on PlayStation, like, pretty much exclusively while I'm

[00:03:22] [SPEAKER_02]: gaming.

[00:03:23] [SPEAKER_02]: I think this month.

[00:03:25] [SPEAKER_02]: Some cool things that are coming exclusively to PlayStation number one being Astrobot.

[00:03:32] [SPEAKER_02]: I'm sorry, console warriors, you're like, your ears are perked up.

[00:03:35] [SPEAKER_02]: Some things that are on PlayStation that there are on other platforms, but will PlayStation

[00:03:41] [SPEAKER_02]: will be my preferred platform of choices I'm playing in September.

[00:03:44] [SPEAKER_02]: Look at forward to it, man.

[00:03:44] [SPEAKER_02]: The PS5 controllers still very cool.

[00:03:49] [SPEAKER_00]: PS5 controller is cool.

[00:03:51] [SPEAKER_00]: PS5 is cool.

[00:03:52] [SPEAKER_00]: Xbox is cool.

[00:03:53] [SPEAKER_02]: Holy, PC.

[00:03:55] [SPEAKER_00]: Whoa, is cool.

[00:03:56] [SPEAKER_02]: Is it in 10.

[00:03:56] [SPEAKER_02]: No cool too, Cameron?

[00:03:58] [SPEAKER_00]: Nintendo is very cool.

[00:04:00] [SPEAKER_02]: No, that's four out of four.

[00:04:02] [SPEAKER_02]: Cool ways to play video games.

[00:04:04] [SPEAKER_02]: There are other ones out of it.

[00:04:06] [SPEAKER_02]: Play out.

[00:04:08] [SPEAKER_00]: Well, Jake, let me tell you what I've been playing.

[00:04:11] [SPEAKER_00]: I've so WooCon came out, which is on my list.

[00:04:14] [SPEAKER_00]: I decided to wait on WooCon, even though it is getting very, very high praise.

[00:04:19] [SPEAKER_00]: It's the highest concurrence single player game on Steam, like broke all the records for

[00:04:28] [SPEAKER_00]: single player.

[00:04:29] [SPEAKER_00]: I think it's an absolute monster in China, which is blowing it up.

[00:04:37] [SPEAKER_00]: Also big in the West, but anyway, I am going to play, I think we're both going to play

[00:04:40] [SPEAKER_00]: that at some point, but we decided to wait, I think we're going to play some other

[00:04:43] [SPEAKER_00]: stuff.

[00:04:44] [SPEAKER_00]: I'll tell you the thing that has been keeping me busy though, is tactical breach wizards.

[00:04:52] [SPEAKER_02]: Tactical breach wizards, which your big fan of tactics games anyway, right?

[00:04:57] [SPEAKER_02]: But what makes this one stand out?

[00:05:00] [SPEAKER_00]: So tactical breach wizards, I discovered this game during Steam next fest.

[00:05:05] [SPEAKER_00]: So shout out to Steam's next fest as being a great place to discover video games.

[00:05:11] [SPEAKER_00]: This is from suspicious development incorporated.

[00:05:17] [SPEAKER_00]: Their previous games, I have no idea that I didn't, I don't, I don't really say anything

[00:05:22] [SPEAKER_00]: that I think anyone really would know most likely.

[00:05:28] [SPEAKER_00]: But man, this game is really, this game is excellent.

[00:05:32] [SPEAKER_00]: This is an excellent video game.

[00:05:34] [SPEAKER_00]: It is a perfect Steam.

[00:05:35] [SPEAKER_00]: It will run on pretty much anything, any PC, like it will run on a potato, like for sure.

[00:05:42] [SPEAKER_00]: And basically what it is, it's a tactics game where the world setting is, it's like

[00:05:48] [SPEAKER_00]: basically our modern world, but there's like witches and wizards and like necromancers

[00:05:55] [SPEAKER_00]: and stuff.

[00:05:56] [SPEAKER_00]: So it's like, it's like military, punk slash wizard, wizard, medieval combination.

[00:06:07] [SPEAKER_00]: So it's this like really unique combination for a setting that's like pretty fun.

[00:06:12] [SPEAKER_00]: It has great witty writing and then it's a tactics game, but it's very much combined

[00:06:19] [SPEAKER_00]: with sort of a puzzle element.

[00:06:22] [SPEAKER_00]: And the reason it's called tactical breach wizards is because the way the game

[00:06:25] [SPEAKER_00]: plays setup is you breach and the breach mechanic is you enter into a room and in

[00:06:31] [SPEAKER_00]: the room becomes like a puzzle that you solve with your tactical combat.

[00:06:38] [SPEAKER_00]: And so each room will introduce like different variables, different enemy types, different

[00:06:42] [SPEAKER_00]: challenges you have to solve.

[00:06:43] [SPEAKER_00]: And then every room will have like a special bonus objective, like for example, clear the

[00:06:49] [SPEAKER_00]: room in one turn or in two turns.

[00:06:52] [SPEAKER_00]: And so then it makes you start to think and really makes you exercise like, oh, how would

[00:06:58] [SPEAKER_00]: I actually do this room in one turn?

[00:07:00] [SPEAKER_00]: That starts to get really tricky.

[00:07:02] [SPEAKER_00]: But it's just really well executed.

[00:07:04] [SPEAKER_00]: This is like, this is going to be in my like top list where it's that good.

[00:07:09] [SPEAKER_00]: It's an indie game very much so, but super, it's fantastic.

[00:07:13] [SPEAKER_02]: It's very cool.

[00:07:15] [SPEAKER_02]: So it's not a rogue like, is that right?

[00:07:19] [SPEAKER_00]: Not a rogue like, it's got a like short, like, great little story campaign.

[00:07:27] [SPEAKER_00]: It's got, it's not a rogue like, it's a tactics game with like puzzle mechanics.

[00:07:32] [SPEAKER_00]: I think you'd really like this one, Jake.

[00:07:34] [SPEAKER_00]: I recommend this is fantastic.

[00:07:37] [SPEAKER_02]: Got to throw it throw it on my list.

[00:07:40] [SPEAKER_02]: Nice, very nice.

[00:07:43] [SPEAKER_00]: This is going to be hard press to be to beat for me for indie game of the year for me.

[00:07:48] [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, you think this is going to be it?

[00:07:50] [SPEAKER_02]: Nice, very cool.

[00:07:51] [SPEAKER_00]: I think so.

[00:07:52] [SPEAKER_00]: I think so.

[00:07:52] [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, there's quite a bit, it's quite a bit of an indie game.

[00:07:56] [SPEAKER_00]: It was a series.

[00:07:57] [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if you know this, but Jake knows this.

[00:08:01] [SPEAKER_02]: Now he knows there are many, many games.

[00:08:05] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, so what I do for our indie pass and other patrons of subscribers is an indie newsletter.

[00:08:11] [SPEAKER_02]: This is kind of a new thing I've been working on and I just release it monthly in a

[00:08:16] [SPEAKER_02]: little looking at games that'll be coming out for the month, indie games that have

[00:08:19] [SPEAKER_02]: just caught my attention that I want to just talk a little bit about.

[00:08:23] [SPEAKER_02]: And every month, I feel like, oh man, maybe this will be a slow month for Indies.

[00:08:28] [SPEAKER_02]: And then I like start digging through like the notes that I've kept on my phone or

[00:08:32] [SPEAKER_02]: just like other things I've seen on Twitter or like other social media like looking for

[00:08:36] [SPEAKER_02]: things that I've just booked marked and man, it just when it rains, it pours.

[00:08:42] [SPEAKER_02]: The Indies are coming in there and not slowing down.

[00:08:46] [SPEAKER_00]: Jake, give me your top Indies that people should be looking out for this fall because I have a

[00:08:52] [SPEAKER_00]: list in front of me.

[00:08:54] [SPEAKER_00]: That's a massive list of probably like double a trip like games that I'm looking for too.

[00:08:58] [SPEAKER_00]: But what are like your, let's just let's minimize the list for the sake of the listeners.

[00:09:04] [SPEAKER_00]: Right?

[00:09:05] [SPEAKER_00]: Let's take it down to three games coming in the fall indie games that people should

[00:09:11] [SPEAKER_00]: be like really stoked for.

[00:09:14] [SPEAKER_02]: Let's see, let's kind of try and do this by a month.

[00:09:18] [SPEAKER_02]: I think this one is super high profile because developer has been marketing it and they

[00:09:25] [SPEAKER_02]: now so no long time ago and it was delayed.

[00:09:26] [SPEAKER_02]: This is the plucky squire.

[00:09:28] [SPEAKER_02]: It is coming out September 17th.

[00:09:31] [SPEAKER_02]: That one is going to be a must have.

[00:09:33] [SPEAKER_00]: Does that really count as an indie game, Jake?

[00:09:36] [SPEAKER_00]: Does that mean it's because that looks, it looks expensive.

[00:09:39] [SPEAKER_02]: It looks for no it is very expensive.

[00:09:40] [SPEAKER_02]: I mean it's funny because like indie is this, okay.

[00:09:46] [SPEAKER_02]: I'm going to keep this short telling myself to keep this short.

[00:09:50] [SPEAKER_02]: Indies a really awful term because it is actually really non-specific in a lot of ways.

[00:09:55] [SPEAKER_02]: It's trying to describe like the economic and marketing position of specific smaller studios.

[00:10:02] [SPEAKER_02]: But for example, if you have a small studio which from where I understand the plucky

[00:10:07] [SPEAKER_02]: squire is not very big studio.

[00:10:09] [SPEAKER_02]: But they contract with a massive publisher like developer digital.

[00:10:14] [SPEAKER_02]: They're getting a massive influx of cash, they're getting all the reputation that comes

[00:10:18] [SPEAKER_02]: with developer and they're getting all the marketing and distribution that comes with

[00:10:21] [SPEAKER_02]: developer.

[00:10:22] [SPEAKER_02]: It kind of almost feels like there are no longer indie because of that kind of access

[00:10:29] [SPEAKER_02]: that they have to the market and to people's attention and then to people's wallets.

[00:10:35] [SPEAKER_02]: So I would say technically, yeah the game is indie because it's coming from an indie studio.

[00:10:41] [SPEAKER_02]: But in reality it's an indie game with much bigger, I would say at least like double

[00:10:47] [SPEAKER_02]: a level of marketing distribution and in publisher.

[00:10:51] [SPEAKER_02]: So it is this weird fuzzy sort of gray area.

[00:10:56] [SPEAKER_02]: But then again when you think about publishers, I would say that yeah they're like quote-unquote

[00:11:00] [SPEAKER_02]: indie size publishers are just smaller.

[00:11:03] [SPEAKER_02]: I would say like no more robots in my opinion is probably they're still dealing with lots

[00:11:07] [SPEAKER_02]: of cash but it's not nearly on the levels like developer or anaperno or raw fury.

[00:11:13] [SPEAKER_02]: So a half yes would be my answer because I believe the studio and the game, like

[00:11:17] [SPEAKER_02]: the game is being produced or created by an indie studio.

[00:11:23] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean for all circumstances, yeah, now I think for I think the general

[00:11:30] [SPEAKER_00]: populist cannot tell the difference or they can't tell the difference but they don't.

[00:11:36] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's hard to define.

[00:11:37] [SPEAKER_00]: Boulders get through isn't any game.

[00:11:38] [SPEAKER_02]: I mean technically if you want to think about like independent as a like contractual

[00:11:43] [SPEAKER_02]: status and who has control over their IP and how it's handled and who they contract that

[00:11:48] [SPEAKER_02]: out to yeah, boulders get three, laments studios absolutely.

[00:11:52] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, there's an argument out there.

[00:11:54] [SPEAKER_00]: I think for me it's based on the budget.

[00:11:56] [SPEAKER_00]: That's my for me it's budget like if you have if you spent 200 million hours

[00:12:01] [SPEAKER_00]: to make it a triple I.

[00:12:05] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, there's a lot of factors to go into it now right but moving on that would probably be my

[00:12:10] [SPEAKER_02]: big.

[00:12:11] [SPEAKER_00]: Give me your next two so pointy squires.

[00:12:13] [SPEAKER_00]: Number seven.

[00:12:14] [SPEAKER_02]: Well the one for October folks that you have to have to put on your list is Neba.

[00:12:20] [SPEAKER_02]: This is the follow up to Greece from Nomadah Studio.

[00:12:24] [SPEAKER_02]: They're based out of Spain.

[00:12:27] [SPEAKER_02]: Greece or Greece because it is the Spanish word is absolutely remarkable beautiful game and

[00:12:33] [SPEAKER_02]: they've uped I think everything that they were able to deliver in Greece with Neba and so that one

[00:12:38] [SPEAKER_02]: is October 15th.

[00:12:41] [SPEAKER_02]: I believe we just got the announcement actually the indie world direct.

[00:12:47] [SPEAKER_02]: So that is one that I think you absolutely have to keep in mind.

[00:12:53] [SPEAKER_02]: And then let's see.

[00:12:54] [SPEAKER_02]: Alright give me one more.

[00:12:55] [SPEAKER_02]: One more um I don't know where do I now I'm like panicking I'm like trying to find

[00:13:02] [SPEAKER_02]: whatever the right one.

[00:13:03] [SPEAKER_00]: If you don't have one that's fire those like the top two.

[00:13:05] [SPEAKER_02]: I mean those are the two probably most the the highest profile indie games with

[00:13:10] [SPEAKER_02]: higher profile of these dates right other than that.

[00:13:13] [SPEAKER_00]: There's other stuff but it's it's okay.

[00:13:16] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah so if I add those to it one then I'm actually really excited for

[00:13:19] [SPEAKER_02]: is actually coming out in September as well.

[00:13:22] [SPEAKER_02]: As September 24th Bloomtown a different story is coming out.

[00:13:28] [SPEAKER_02]: I'm so excited about this because it's coming from the devs that may graveyard keeper which

[00:13:32] [SPEAKER_02]: is a really offbeat tongue and cheek dark humor farming sim.

[00:13:41] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah and Bloomtown a different story honestly I think it's going to be like to me it

[00:13:46] [SPEAKER_02]: feels like on the level of cassette beasts in terms of like polish and almost like in terms

[00:13:51] [SPEAKER_02]: of gameplay like it's a weird stranger things ask type of story.

[00:13:55] [SPEAKER_02]: It looks like you capture and level up monsters to like battle monsters from some like other

[00:14:01] [SPEAKER_02]: dimension or another realm or something.

[00:14:04] [SPEAKER_02]: It's going to be creepy it's kind of tons like loads of dark humor and I think that one is

[00:14:08] [SPEAKER_02]: is going to be a really really good one.

[00:14:14] [SPEAKER_00]: Awesome well there's three for you a plucky squire never Bloomtown

[00:14:18] [SPEAKER_00]: a different story there's so many games coming out.

[00:14:22] [SPEAKER_00]: I don't even need to bring up like the big ones I have this list and for anime of

[00:14:25] [SPEAKER_00]: and we're going to be covering lots of stuff folks on the pot so this is your first time listening

[00:14:29] [SPEAKER_00]: like we cover a lot of games we're starting to get a lot more codes for things we've got a

[00:14:34] [SPEAKER_00]: code out there for arco so we're going to be reviewing that on the podcast and today we're talking

[00:14:40] [SPEAKER_00]: about and shrouded early access which Jake just recently got a code for and I actually bought

[00:14:46] [SPEAKER_00]: retail so I'm just going to crap all over the game and Jake's going to be super nice.

[00:14:53] [SPEAKER_02]: I know you're just joking I just wasn't ready for the joke so it was very funny but now

[00:14:59] [SPEAKER_00]: we're going to be as analytical as always and less that's a Sony game in that case they can do

[00:15:07] [SPEAKER_02]: no wrong looking at you concord for people who don't know camera and technically works for Sony

[00:15:15] [SPEAKER_00]: yes I can say not much. We're saying nothing about our overlords yeah um well Jake let's

[00:15:22] [SPEAKER_00]: let's go ahead and jump in I think that's all for the news basically tons of games coming out

[00:15:27] [SPEAKER_00]: like I mentioned we are talking about today and shrouded early access it's not in 1.0 yet

[00:15:34] [SPEAKER_00]: but it is out on steam for all intents of purposes it's out right you know it is out yeah it's

[00:15:40] [SPEAKER_00]: like it's it came it's kind of like Valheim in that way the game is out it is going to have a

[00:15:46] [SPEAKER_00]: one not over least at some point where it'll kind of research again but it's out there on steam yeah

[00:15:51] [SPEAKER_00]: we're going to break it down for you today. Jake how are we going to do it? We will be talking about

[00:15:54] [SPEAKER_02]: and shrouded in three different categories the first one is narrative we'll be talking about the story

[00:16:01] [SPEAKER_02]: just kind of what's happening and what's going on in the world of in shrouded or at least what we're

[00:16:05] [SPEAKER_02]: able to sort of capture from what is happening in the game and then next we'll be talking about

[00:16:10] [SPEAKER_02]: the game design this is another like PC based survival game like co-op type of game

[00:16:18] [SPEAKER_02]: and there are a lot of these like a lot a lot of these and we'll be talking about what makes

[00:16:23] [SPEAKER_02]: and shrouded different and other things that we just kind of noticed in a playtime together

[00:16:29] [SPEAKER_02]: camera and I just to put this out there we've been playing and shrouded I don't think you've

[00:16:32] [SPEAKER_02]: played this solo like at all is that right? Yeah so we're speaking to the multiplayer

[00:16:40] [SPEAKER_02]: experience which is like the the core kind of experience of this type of game so if you listen

[00:16:45] [SPEAKER_02]: to this and you get interested in the game like grab a few buddies to play this one with and then

[00:16:49] [SPEAKER_02]: finally we'll be talking about impact on the industry now of course this is a game in early access

[00:16:55] [SPEAKER_02]: it has generated some waves though so there are some things to kind of discuss in terms of how

[00:17:00] [SPEAKER_02]: video game industry has reacted to or what it's thinking about games like and shrouded

[00:17:06] [SPEAKER_02]: and so we'll close out the episode talking about that but we're going back to narrative in

[00:17:12] [SPEAKER_02]: Cameron what do you I mean we've both played this game I don't know how many hours we've

[00:17:17] [SPEAKER_02]: probably played four or five multi-hour sessions together and what's happening in this world do

[00:17:25] [SPEAKER_00]: know but you put it around the spot here like if I were to not have just gone to the

[00:17:33] [SPEAKER_00]: and shrouded website to look at this inopsis I would not be able to tell you exactly what's

[00:17:39] [SPEAKER_00]: happening so basically this is breath of the world nice good start so I could that was just

[00:17:46] [SPEAKER_00]: well this read this the fools of the old world ruthlessly mind the earth for a magical elixir

[00:17:52] [SPEAKER_00]: and unleashed a ruinous fog the shroud as it were and corrupted creatures from the depths

[00:18:00] [SPEAKER_00]: the kingdom was lost but not before a few remaining warriors were placed in a long

[00:18:05] [SPEAKER_00]: dreamless sleep sound familiar until such time they could fight a new that time has come

[00:18:14] [SPEAKER_00]: and that is the story of shrouded um I've been shrouded yeah so you're a guy or gal who is put in a

[00:18:23] [SPEAKER_00]: deep sleep in like what amounts to basically like a magical tide pod nice and you become awakened

[00:18:35] [SPEAKER_00]: and you come out into the world into what essentially amounts to like a a

[00:18:44] [SPEAKER_00]: an apocalyptic world that has been destroyed basically like a destroyed kingdom and cities

[00:18:51] [SPEAKER_00]: and you find all these like cities and towns all over the map and your goal is to kind of like

[00:18:56] [SPEAKER_00]: save it and bring it all back from the shroud that is like corrupted the earth so you that's

[00:19:02] [SPEAKER_00]: basically the plot you kind of uncover there's actually deeper lore to this game I'm just

[00:19:09] [SPEAKER_00]: you discover this as you play you'll come across little pieces of parchment and books

[00:19:15] [SPEAKER_00]: and you can read and then you can gather sort of the background lore as you go I've read a few

[00:19:21] [SPEAKER_00]: of them they're very like peace milled they don't I think they do go together but it's one of

[00:19:26] [SPEAKER_00]: the situations where you're gonna have to go find like go on the inshrouded Reddit subreddit and

[00:19:31] [SPEAKER_00]: find a guy who patched all the lore stuff together or like a youtube video right that's gonna be

[00:19:37] [SPEAKER_00]: the full story of enshrouded but it's not a game where like it matters it doesn't matter it's just like

[00:19:47] [SPEAKER_00]: a setting that exists for the player to have a survival crafting experience the end of

[00:19:54] [SPEAKER_02]: that yeah I agree largely this narrative is just like how do we kind of come up with the heroes

[00:20:01] [SPEAKER_02]: journey chosen one story how do we get people into this world and how do we kind of set the stage

[00:20:06] [SPEAKER_02]: for this fantasy setting so it's mostly just providing a service to the game design and to the

[00:20:13] [SPEAKER_02]: gameplay there they're like and I honestly like I paid attention to the opening cut scene I was listening

[00:20:20] [SPEAKER_02]: to what was going on and as I progressing through the game it just felt less and less important I

[00:20:27] [SPEAKER_02]: think this is one of the things that these types of games these like survival games just struggle with because

[00:20:32] [SPEAKER_02]: yeah because because of the game design because it's designed around this grind and playing with

[00:20:38] [SPEAKER_02]: people and building a base and so the when what like when you interact with the narrative is

[00:20:45] [SPEAKER_02]: infrequent it's irregular like unless you're just cranking out the main quest line but these games

[00:20:50] [SPEAKER_02]: are designed so that you can't really just jump easily from you know the main quest point here to

[00:20:56] [SPEAKER_02]: next one to the next one so it's it's a really difficult balance to strike however there are

[00:21:02] [SPEAKER_02]: there are few details that I kind of like actually about and shrouded and the first one is that well

[00:21:08] [SPEAKER_02]: in my background in you know literary studies I'm a big fan of the way that my research really

[00:21:14] [SPEAKER_02]: comes down to different literature and how it talks about the environment and so hey you start a game

[00:21:19] [SPEAKER_02]: by telling me that people got greedy mining for a substance that's polluting the land I mean

[00:21:24] [SPEAKER_02]: that is going to scratch an edge for me so I'm like oh okay this is interesting it has it is

[00:21:30] [SPEAKER_02]: discussing like environmental and ecological issues from the get go there's something there

[00:21:36] [SPEAKER_00]: so yeah two two themes to highlight there then I think I'm I made your suit in your take on Jake so

[00:21:45] [SPEAKER_00]: what other properties or excuse me books movies or like pieces of literature at

[00:21:54] [SPEAKER_00]: we have out there that set the president for putting warriors or heroes of some kind like in

[00:22:02] [SPEAKER_00]: hibernation so that they can be used like later on to save the world and the idea of

[00:22:13] [SPEAKER_00]: going too deep in the earth and unleashing creatures that destroy the world I like

[00:22:19] [SPEAKER_00]: the rings like the minds of more of the more is a classic example of it and I just feel like

[00:22:24] [SPEAKER_00]: like that those are two kind of and I mean obviously the main one for the warriors thing is like

[00:22:31] [SPEAKER_00]: I think of like space movies where the astronauts are asleep for like several years and then they

[00:22:39] [SPEAKER_00]: wake up and because they're on my commission to save the world have you ever seen oh my gosh

[00:22:47] [SPEAKER_00]: I'm gonna have to look up the name while you're talking in a minute but it's uh it's got Chris Evans in it

[00:22:52] [SPEAKER_00]: early Chris Evans like pre-caps in America and it's a space movie where they're going to restart the sun

[00:22:59] [SPEAKER_00]: oh my goodness what okay so this is a movie if you haven't seen this movie I'm gonna look this

[00:23:04] [SPEAKER_02]: up in a second it is worth watching okay it's funny be you mentioned that because when you first

[00:23:09] [SPEAKER_02]: of Chris Evans actually thought of the movie Snowpiercer which also that is also a movie worth

[00:23:15] [SPEAKER_02]: watching it is also a movie that's based around environmental themes right they're on this never

[00:23:19] [SPEAKER_02]: ending train because the world is frozen over because of just human interference in destruction

[00:23:28] [SPEAKER_00]: so Chris Evans and Silly and Murphy no less

[00:23:32] [SPEAKER_00]: Killing Murphy really yeah has one of the worst endings of any movie that I've ever seen

[00:23:39] [SPEAKER_00]: sorry to spoil that but but it's worth watching anyway it's the idea the dashing

[00:23:46] [SPEAKER_00]: and it's like go to sleep and then they wake up because they're like flying to the sun anyway

[00:23:50] [SPEAKER_00]: those are two themes I just there's probably a lot more in like anime I just I was just thinking

[00:23:55] [SPEAKER_00]: like is there what other properties could I think of that I'm gonna throw this one out there

[00:24:00] [SPEAKER_02]: I think the most extreme slash wild example this and I'm kind of rolling in also like

[00:24:07] [SPEAKER_02]: bringing people back from the dead with this the craziest one I've seen is Mass Effect 2

[00:24:13] [SPEAKER_02]: with Shepherd like oh not exactly risen from sleep although Mass Effect and drama does start that way

[00:24:21] [SPEAKER_02]: Mass Effect 2 I think is the most like extreme wildest example I can think of

[00:24:26] [SPEAKER_02]: where like a hero is suspended for some reason and in this case like they like rebuild Shepherd from

[00:24:33] [SPEAKER_02]: scratch yes that's right because he dies right I mean yeah I guess he dies at the

[00:24:40] [SPEAKER_00]: end of Mass Effect 1 right but like I remember but they like reassemble him from his like DNA

[00:24:45] [SPEAKER_02]: yeah it's it's wild right so again this isn't exactly what you're getting at but I forgot about

[00:24:50] [SPEAKER_02]: that it was the most extreme example I could think of right as far as like I would say another

[00:24:56] [SPEAKER_02]: classic example of and I'm switching to the the other half of your question with

[00:25:02] [SPEAKER_02]: environmentalism and people like digging too hard and suddenly they're like unleashing horrors upon

[00:25:06] [SPEAKER_02]: the earth is Final Fantasy 7 like Final Fantasy 7 I think is one of the pre-eminent examples

[00:25:11] [SPEAKER_02]: oh yeah where you know Shinra just with the Mako energy and then the planet itself responds by

[00:25:20] [SPEAKER_02]: like sending these giant monsters called weapons into the world to kind of defend itself from

[00:25:25] [SPEAKER_02]: life-stream cycle being disrupted so those I'm just I was trying to think of like examples

[00:25:32] [SPEAKER_02]: and video games from big big franchises that kind of deal with those themes and those are the ones

[00:25:36] [SPEAKER_02]: that came to mind now those are both like really standard RPGs and so I think that they have a

[00:25:45] [SPEAKER_02]: lot more breadth to tell those kind of stories and let those stories gain nuance and gain traction

[00:25:52] [SPEAKER_02]: and snowball and change course and like become really interesting with something like and

[00:25:57] [SPEAKER_02]: shrouded to kind of get us back to the game it does start with that which I think is quite

[00:26:02] [SPEAKER_02]: interesting and the other thing I wanted to say about that is it actually kind of let's that storyline

[00:26:11] [SPEAKER_02]: breathe which I thought was surprising almost because I think of like when I played

[00:26:16] [SPEAKER_02]: new world or I'm trying to think of another survival game along these lines um I don't know I

[00:26:23] [SPEAKER_02]: can't think about but like new world is one that comes in mind when I'm like crap I really can't

[00:26:26] [SPEAKER_02]: remember a whole lot of why I'm a character doing this thing but at the very least and in shrouded

[00:26:32] [SPEAKER_02]: you very frequently come across these shroud myths and enshrouded areas and it what it did function

[00:26:41] [SPEAKER_02]: as a good narrative reminder of like oh yeah okay so this is my purpose here this isn't just I mean

[00:26:47] [SPEAKER_02]: it is game design and it's an interesting game design we'll talk about that in a second but I thought

[00:26:51] [SPEAKER_02]: to myself like thank you for like even though like I can't remember all the details of the story

[00:26:56] [SPEAKER_02]: and who I am and what my special name is and what I'm doing whatever at the very least like the

[00:27:01] [SPEAKER_02]: core plot point of this game is constantly there present in the game so I think that's a thumbs up

[00:27:09] [SPEAKER_02]: and in kind of a field of games where it is really hard to get players to remember or like

[00:27:15] [SPEAKER_02]: like really an invest in what the game story is yeah I think grounded does the absolute

[00:27:23] [SPEAKER_00]: by far the best job of this um it definitely has the best execution of a story built into a

[00:27:32] [SPEAKER_00]: Bible crafting game it's like just really well executed um and shrouded it hasn't shown to me

[00:27:41] [SPEAKER_00]: that it has the chops that the grounded does like in terms of its story and kind of its pieces

[00:27:47] [SPEAKER_00]: and like set up of kind of how that all works together and grounded grounded is uh that's good game

[00:27:55] [SPEAKER_00]: grounded does it very well but yeah they just do it very well this game does it doesn't do it quite

[00:28:00] [SPEAKER_00]: well but well enough for what it's trying to do as a video game yeah I think that's what I would

[00:28:05] [SPEAKER_02]: say is it like it's ahead of above most other games in its field which is which is a good thing right

[00:28:12] [SPEAKER_02]: if you could remember something about this or live and you can see visual reminders of like

[00:28:18] [SPEAKER_02]: wire in this world and what's wrong with this world then I think you've done a better job than

[00:28:24] [SPEAKER_00]: the most of the competition yeah 100%. Let's talk about the game design so in shrouded is

[00:28:32] [SPEAKER_00]: a rival crafting game if you're not familiar with these games there is um so that would be like

[00:28:39] [SPEAKER_00]: uh power old um valheim uh grounded uh does it kind of some of the big ones there's there's

[00:28:48] [SPEAKER_00]: literally hundreds of these core keeper uh so many and a lot of them are on this like I think of

[00:28:54] [SPEAKER_02]: new world I think of black desert yeah which new world's actually coming to consoles right

[00:29:00] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah yeah most of them around PC although some of them have come to consoles grounded as on

[00:29:04] [SPEAKER_00]: consoles with crossplay by the way on game pass who craft. Yeah so survival crafting basically you

[00:29:13] [SPEAKER_00]: have a what's the best way to show it's it's like a things that you show it's crafting stuff

[00:29:24] [SPEAKER_00]: and that stuff that you craft allows you to obtain resources that allows you to craft

[00:29:31] [SPEAKER_00]: other stuff which allows you to obtain newer resources that allows you to craft other stuff

[00:29:38] [SPEAKER_00]: which allows you to kill bosses and advance the story and that's basically the gameplay loop

[00:29:45] [SPEAKER_02]: and a nutshell yeah and honestly in shrouded sticks to that loop pretty pretty faithfully

[00:29:53] [SPEAKER_02]: however this is something that as we have been playing and we've been playing with a few of our friends

[00:29:58] [SPEAKER_02]: we have been joking about the leveling in this game is crazy slow like and that's gonna sound

[00:30:06] [SPEAKER_02]: like a negative but the more I've been thinking about it um i have been super impressed that

[00:30:13] [SPEAKER_02]: they were willing to take that kind of a risk because like if you play most survival crafting

[00:30:18] [SPEAKER_02]: games with your friends you're getting from level one to 15 one to 20 super fast you are gaining

[00:30:24] [SPEAKER_02]: levels you're getting those dopamine hits and you are just cruising in your skill tree is like

[00:30:30] [SPEAKER_02]: exploding and you're just unlocking all sorts of things and uh what i didn't realize until i

[00:30:37] [SPEAKER_02]: played and shrouded and i'm I'm compared this to new world again is uh by do it by taking it slow

[00:30:45] [SPEAKER_02]: and shrouded like gave me time to get used to it systems and it gave me time to kind of get used

[00:30:52] [SPEAKER_02]: exploring and the different things that i could craft and the just different ways that i could explore

[00:30:57] [SPEAKER_02]: and i actually really appreciated that kind of pacing because now when i level up it feels like monumental

[00:31:05] [SPEAKER_02]: like it feels like really significant and i think that's something that's kind of lost when you just

[00:31:11] [SPEAKER_02]: kind of level up super quickly at the beginning of a game and i honestly think it's actually kind of

[00:31:15] [SPEAKER_02]: giving me a little more longevity within shrouded because i'm like oh i'm not just busting my butt

[00:31:21] [SPEAKER_02]: to grind out levels i'm actually starting to think about the other systems of the game a

[00:31:26] [SPEAKER_02]: little more carefully rather than just see number go big and i don't know i was kind of surprised that

[00:31:32] [SPEAKER_02]: i wasn't as bothered by it as i thought i would be yeah i mean so when you talk about survival

[00:31:39] [SPEAKER_00]: crafting games you what you got to talk about okay what makes and shrouded stand out amongst like

[00:31:43] [SPEAKER_00]: the crowd of these games and and and i think the number one thing that's made it stand above

[00:31:49] [SPEAKER_00]: and just like stand out for me as i've as i've kind of watched it before came out and as i've

[00:31:55] [SPEAKER_00]: been interested in like playing it in the past few weeks as uh there's a i think there's a little

[00:32:01] [SPEAKER_00]: bit more of an emphasis on combat and i think combat is really probably arguably executed better

[00:32:10] [SPEAKER_00]: here than any other survival crafting game i don't think i'm shy about saying that like it's

[00:32:15] [SPEAKER_00]: really well executed and well to end and a lot of the design there's more of a design focus built around

[00:32:23] [SPEAKER_00]: engaging in combat engaging in quests leveling up and there's like jxa there's a massive skill

[00:32:30] [SPEAKER_00]: tree here which i can't think of another the i'm sure there are i just can't think of another like

[00:32:36] [SPEAKER_00]: survival crafting that has sort of this like fleshed out almost RPG level style skill tree with like

[00:32:42] [SPEAKER_00]: specific uh sort of subclasses that you can move into based on what skills you choose like i'm

[00:32:51] [SPEAKER_00]: playing like a wizard character and that's kind of what i'm choosing so i'm picking

[00:32:55] [SPEAKER_00]: this stuff in the skill tree that's given me bonuses to spell combat and in the emphasis on combat

[00:33:01] [SPEAKER_00]: one of the ways that the game does that is there's some resources that are that are tied against

[00:33:08] [SPEAKER_00]: killing groups of enemies you know like in mass specifically scrap metal yeah it's just a massive

[00:33:15] [SPEAKER_00]: pain to get and it's like really early in the game where you need scrap metal well the only way

[00:33:20] [SPEAKER_00]: to get scrap metal or the best way is to kill mobs yeah and so it kind of forces you to go on

[00:33:27] [SPEAKER_00]: the world into engage with the combat like an a pretty significant way and kind of level up and learn

[00:33:32] [SPEAKER_00]: to combat and the combat feels good like it does actually it feels really good i think it's well

[00:33:38] [SPEAKER_00]: executed um it it takes a page from i want to say Zelda i kind of want to make that comparison but

[00:33:48] [SPEAKER_00]: it's not like exactly one to one but i kind of want to make that comparison it's like it's a lock on

[00:33:54] [SPEAKER_00]: there's a dodge you have a shield you can block with you can be like a spellcaster or melee

[00:33:59] [SPEAKER_00]: or like an archer type character um yeah there's this kind of this fluidity around combat

[00:34:06] [SPEAKER_00]: and then addition to that loot in relation to cut like you can kill bosses and you can find

[00:34:13] [SPEAKER_00]: chest that give you purple gold like different types of rarity levels of weapons that you can level up

[00:34:18] [SPEAKER_00]: which is also unique i think to enshroud it in terms of the survival crafting games and i

[00:34:24] [SPEAKER_02]: just is a really good job with that yeah i've also similarly been impressed with combat so i have been

[00:34:29] [SPEAKER_02]: doing more of like a rogue slash ranger build so i mostly using a bow but i have daggers when i

[00:34:35] [SPEAKER_02]: have to do melee and what i my favorite part probably about this is how it does the skill tree i mean

[00:34:42] [SPEAKER_02]: if like you were saying like it's pretty much an RPG skill tree it feels really good to use i feel like

[00:34:49] [SPEAKER_02]: the different upgrades that i get are meaningful some of them will just be like different types

[00:34:53] [SPEAKER_02]: of damage so like i'm constantly looking for backstab damage with my daggers because that's why

[00:34:58] [SPEAKER_02]: my invested skill points and if i'm playing with camera and he's drawn somebody's attention away

[00:35:03] [SPEAKER_02]: for me and then i just run up behind them with daggers and i can get in a ton of damage and so

[00:35:08] [SPEAKER_02]: i feel like i feel like the skill tree is well done and it kind of webs in an interesting way

[00:35:15] [SPEAKER_02]: like i pick daggers and bow because those two skills are next to each other and so sometimes

[00:35:21] [SPEAKER_02]: those skills will kind of benefit both subclasses and so the game definitely just it does kind

[00:35:27] [SPEAKER_02]: of gently nudge you towards specific builds at the same time if you really wanted to you can invest

[00:35:33] [SPEAKER_02]: in something that is like all 100% range you can invest in spells and you could invest in bows

[00:35:38] [SPEAKER_02]: if you really wanted to but it is a little disincentivized to do so so i i really did enjoy the

[00:35:44] [SPEAKER_02]: and like Cameron said i think the unique thing to me is like tying resources

[00:35:50] [SPEAKER_02]: and not just xp to taking down enemies like in a more i would say fleshed out or in a more

[00:35:59] [SPEAKER_02]: direct way because i feel like in mostly survival crafting games it's like hey there's a wolf you

[00:36:04] [SPEAKER_02]: can kill the wolf you can get its pal you can get its bones you can get its meat and you can use

[00:36:08] [SPEAKER_02]: it in some way but like having scrap metal this isn't something that you can mine this is something

[00:36:13] [SPEAKER_02]: you need to get off of enemies like almost exclusively and i just thought that was a good way of

[00:36:18] [SPEAKER_02]: like okay well combat matters more than just grinding out xp and grinding out levels it's directly

[00:36:23] [SPEAKER_02]: tied into resource gathering so yeah smart thing to do and that's the thing about this is like

[00:36:29] [SPEAKER_02]: when i play one of these games and i log in and it dawns on me then i'm gonna spend the next two

[00:36:34] [SPEAKER_02]: hours chopping down trees or mining rocks i lose out it i lose steam really quickly whereas in this game

[00:36:41] [SPEAKER_02]: yes you still have to mine the things and you still have to cut down trees but you can do it

[00:36:46] [SPEAKER_02]: i feel like with much more fluidity you can do it while you're on the go or you could feel

[00:36:51] [SPEAKER_02]: like you get more resources on the go engaging in combat yeah there's a sense of speed here that

[00:36:58] [SPEAKER_00]: i really like and like a better rotation of combat with to your point a much more fluid

[00:37:07] [SPEAKER_00]: faster rotation and variety between like combat crafting building and usually i find that there's a

[00:37:17] [SPEAKER_00]: crafting part in these games there's like a buildup crap so valheim being a premonitor

[00:37:23] [SPEAKER_00]: example i just think of my head like you get to a new biome and there's this massive grind to

[00:37:29] [SPEAKER_00]: kind of establish yourself and and get stuff like your systems built up so you can have all the

[00:37:36] [SPEAKER_00]: resources and stuff that you need to like do what you need to do that area i feel like this game

[00:37:41] [SPEAKER_00]: just like moving a little bit at like a faster clip for me that just like feels good and and

[00:37:47] [SPEAKER_00]: tip of and we were like we were like moving pretty fast and the other thing that this game does

[00:37:51] [SPEAKER_00]: really well that a lot of these other games do is it gives you it's giving you a lot of stuff to do

[00:37:56] [SPEAKER_00]: like with quest markers and specific objectives which some people i know like just like full free

[00:38:04] [SPEAKER_00]: Rome style games that kind of drives me nuts i need the game to i need the game to kind of tell me

[00:38:10] [SPEAKER_00]: at least give me some kind of direction of like hey here's like the next good thing to do and

[00:38:15] [SPEAKER_00]: focus on and this game is kind of giving you a smattering of objectives taking you through like a campaign

[00:38:23] [SPEAKER_00]: that i really appreciate in a game like this where like having that campaign structure

[00:38:29] [SPEAKER_00]: just helps pull me along through and want and like feeling that desire to make progress where

[00:38:35] [SPEAKER_00]: Valheim for example like

[00:38:39] [SPEAKER_00]: for me personally it's too open ended it's like hey you have all these bosses here's these different

[00:38:44] [SPEAKER_00]: biomes go out figure out how to kill the bosses right some people love that level of

[00:38:49] [SPEAKER_00]: nanniness whereas i'm like hey can you just guide me like a little bit and so i think this game

[00:38:55] [SPEAKER_00]: does like good mix of like you can kind of go just do whatever you want if you want but the game is also

[00:39:00] [SPEAKER_00]: telling you hey here's these specific objectives we've also tied xp to those like huge chunks of xp

[00:39:07] [SPEAKER_00]: that will allow you to level up your skill tree make you better at combat and then that feeds back into

[00:39:12] [SPEAKER_02]: the loop yeah the way that xp is distributed in this game is just absolutely wild because

[00:39:18] [SPEAKER_02]: you're supposed to unlock NPCs that will unlock linked to different things that can

[00:39:22] [SPEAKER_02]: new back at your home base and doing that gives you a massive chunk of xp killing enemies chopping

[00:39:28] [SPEAKER_02]: down trees like you're seeing single-digit numbers sometimes and like i said at first i was like

[00:39:35] [SPEAKER_02]: really like i'm not gonna xp at all doing squat but at the same time it feels so much more

[00:39:41] [SPEAKER_02]: earned and so much more triumphant when you actually do level up and then having those quests being

[00:39:46] [SPEAKER_02]: good incentives like it is so easy i feel like to fall off of a survival crafting game because

[00:39:52] [SPEAKER_02]: it can be too open-ended but what i feel like enshrouded does well is that it borrows all the

[00:39:57] [SPEAKER_02]: right things from like open world RPGs by like still keeping the player like giving the player

[00:40:03] [SPEAKER_02]: just clear goals to make good like significant progress in the game i just feel like it's incentivized

[00:40:11] [SPEAKER_02]: all right though we've been we've been talking we've been singing its praises but folks

[00:40:16] [SPEAKER_02]: i have to bring something up that was driving me oh i know you're gonna bring a camera

[00:40:20] [SPEAKER_00]: nose needs it needs to be brought up because this is a this is a sand and this type of game

[00:40:28] [SPEAKER_00]: and developers if you're listening i know you already know i know you already they already know but

[00:40:35] [SPEAKER_02]: the dodge roll in this game feels down right oh that's not what i'm gonna bring i don't know

[00:40:44] [SPEAKER_00]: what other thing we've got two things jakery we've got two things the thing the dodge roll in this

[00:40:48] [SPEAKER_02]: game is slow it does not feel responsive it takes a massive chunk of stamina and it is it almost

[00:40:56] [SPEAKER_02]: feels punishing more than it is like getting out of the way of things and so that's it's a big

[00:41:04] [SPEAKER_02]: game because if you're in the middle of melee combat or you're like me and you're picking somebody

[00:41:07] [SPEAKER_02]: off with arrows and they're close enough where i need a dodge or something the dodge just never

[00:41:13] [SPEAKER_02]: feels like it lands properly and then you're just like getting mobbed and you're like why did i

[00:41:19] [SPEAKER_02]: knock it out of this i should have gotten out of this i man that needs a big like touch up i would say

[00:41:27] [SPEAKER_00]: overhaul yeah that dodge needs a little bit of a touch up i think it to your point like it doesn't

[00:41:33] [SPEAKER_00]: seem like seem like it works maybe the way it was intended i don't know if it like the animation

[00:41:40] [SPEAKER_00]: is too long or like the eye frames are not set up correctly over the cooldown like the stamina

[00:41:47] [SPEAKER_00]: cooldown is not quite calibrated right yeah there's something's tinkering this yeah i think

[00:41:51] [SPEAKER_02]: it needs a bit tinkered what were you gonna say what do you think i was gonna say so the so

[00:41:55] [SPEAKER_00]: cardinal sin of survival card i feel like there's some certain quality of life things and

[00:42:00] [SPEAKER_00]: all the times yeah that literally if you're gonna make a game of this type this is a requirement

[00:42:10] [SPEAKER_00]: this is a requirement yeah so i can literally guarantee you that this feature will be in this game

[00:42:17] [SPEAKER_00]: by one doto it is not currently in the game though and that is magic chess holy crap yeah

[00:42:27] [SPEAKER_00]: did magic like you got you just got to you just gotta have it and actually now that i'm saying

[00:42:34] [SPEAKER_00]: i remember jake i was gonna tell you guys i need to go look this up but i'm pretty sure

[00:42:42] [SPEAKER_00]: magic chest is an unlockable trait on the skill tree in this game and not just like a quality of

[00:42:51] [SPEAKER_00]: let me confirm that and you can talk about something but this is like so if you know you know

[00:42:58] [SPEAKER_00]: a magic chest is it's basically like if i'm in my base and i'm building or crafting something

[00:43:05] [SPEAKER_00]: rather than having to have all of the resources the craft that's specific thing in my inventory

[00:43:10] [SPEAKER_00]: most games what they've adopted is the system including ball-hime grounded like so on so far

[00:43:15] [SPEAKER_00]: they've adopted a system like we're if you're in the proximity of a chest or chest that have

[00:43:21] [SPEAKER_00]: those resources they will whatever you're crafting will just automatically be available to you and it

[00:43:28] [SPEAKER_00]: just is a massive quality of life feature that's just so critical in games like this because otherwise

[00:43:34] [SPEAKER_00]: what happens the the player ends up spending literally 30 to 40% of their time in any given play

[00:43:41] [SPEAKER_00]: session just picking and pulling things out of chess which is not if you're a designer or you're

[00:43:49] [SPEAKER_00]: creating a game like in my view i don't think you want your player spending like 30 or 40% of

[00:43:55] [SPEAKER_00]: their time just interacting with chess that's not a fun experience you just want to be able

[00:44:00] [SPEAKER_00]: to do the thing that you want to do and that's not present here which is super disappointing which is

[00:44:05] [SPEAKER_02]: a big shame because we were just praising like the fluidity of this game's gameplay loop like

[00:44:11] [SPEAKER_02]: and shrouded does it really well but then when you come back to base and you got to get

[00:44:15] [SPEAKER_02]: you got to do some housekeeping to be bogged down by like wait what chest had this item in it oh

[00:44:21] [SPEAKER_02]: I need this many of this item crap I forgot to pick up this item as well yes so my inventory's

[00:44:27] [SPEAKER_02]: full so I need to offload all this crap so I can get this one thing out so I can make this thing

[00:44:31] [SPEAKER_02]: dude yeah balancing inventory and chests is just a great way to suck the air out of a room

[00:44:39] [SPEAKER_00]: okay so let me clarify so this is because we're not far enough in the game so there are magic chests

[00:44:45] [SPEAKER_00]: so I apologize for what I said previously but they are a specific item that requires

[00:44:54] [SPEAKER_00]: specific resources to create so the basic chest doesn't give you magic chest ability but

[00:45:03] [SPEAKER_00]: the magic chest which you can I'm looking at right now on the wick yeah you can craft magic

[00:45:09] [SPEAKER_00]: chests that do give you that ability it I think it just should be every chest it's just a devout yeah

[00:45:16] [SPEAKER_00]: I don't love that decision just make it every chest and just get rid of the magic just make them all

[00:45:20] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah just like well why double that I don't that seems like an unnecessary

[00:45:28] [SPEAKER_00]: complication or I mean I could see maybe why okay like it's a it's a progression thing right like we

[00:45:36] [SPEAKER_00]: were making the player get a little bit more challenging resources that they can develop

[00:45:42] [SPEAKER_00]: a magic chest but the the outcome of you being able to make the magic chest is just convenience in

[00:45:48] [SPEAKER_00]: the game which is just a weird thing I think to make the player you're essentially making the player

[00:45:56] [SPEAKER_00]: grind and progress in order to achieve quality of life features I don't know like I don't know

[00:46:03] [SPEAKER_02]: is that I get what you're saying I'm not a game designer I get what you're saying and to the point

[00:46:08] [SPEAKER_02]: of like progression in a game I think it's already punishing enough to have this small chest that has

[00:46:14] [SPEAKER_02]: X amount of inventory slots versus something that has like yeah more inventory slots so like I

[00:46:20] [SPEAKER_02]: think the first chest you can craft is like 15 maybe 20 inventory slots and in crafting survival

[00:46:25] [SPEAKER_02]: games there are so many freaking items that you're gonna pick up that that is not very much at all

[00:46:31] [SPEAKER_02]: like a chest with 50 inventory slots now we're talking right and so I think that is like sufficient

[00:46:38] [SPEAKER_02]: progression like bottlenecking in a pacing type of way that not having like the magic chest just

[00:46:46] [SPEAKER_02]: be standard I think is it's just I don't know it's too much I don't want to spend a lot of time

[00:46:52] [SPEAKER_00]: in chest inventory's yeah I just think bottom line I it's not fun to spend time organizing chest

[00:47:02] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah I'd rather spend time dealing a bit you can organize your chest organizing your chest is one thing

[00:47:09] [SPEAKER_00]: but it's not fun like to go to six different chests but then you reward the player by oh okay I can

[00:47:15] [SPEAKER_00]: get the big chest if I go and I grind and I get I don't know that's controversial to me I

[00:47:22] [SPEAKER_00]: disagree with it I think it just it's not fun just make it standard anyway please yeah um other things

[00:47:29] [SPEAKER_02]: in term of game design yeah combat is is pretty solid I think I think there's I mean we've only

[00:47:35] [SPEAKER_02]: gotten so far into the game and I think there's a fair amount of like enemy variety and combat

[00:47:40] [SPEAKER_02]: scenarios that you can be in I think that's fine that the one mechanic that we've barely touched

[00:47:44] [SPEAKER_02]: on that I'm gonna this is kind of my last thoughts in this category is the shroud missed mechanic

[00:47:50] [SPEAKER_02]: right I actually like this because it does provide a good sense of urgency when you go into

[00:47:57] [SPEAKER_02]: shrouded areas there's just big timer and yellow bar of the top of the screen that's telling you how

[00:48:02] [SPEAKER_02]: much time you have until basically insta kill sudden death and it does make combat matter that

[00:48:09] [SPEAKER_02]: much more because when you get intact in the shroud you know you're juggling a lot of different things

[00:48:14] [SPEAKER_02]: plus this timer you know you're juggling your health and stamina and what food you have

[00:48:19] [SPEAKER_02]: and whether or not you're hydrated all you know typical things in survival crafting all those

[00:48:23] [SPEAKER_02]: different meters that are going on I like having this one though because it gave a good sense of

[00:48:29] [SPEAKER_02]: purpose and I thought it was a clever way to kind of cap what we're talking about that type of

[00:48:36] [SPEAKER_02]: progression you could go out and you could grind the heck out of the game get to a really high level

[00:48:42] [SPEAKER_02]: coming to some of these areas with like really good gear but if you just aren't smart like

[00:48:48] [SPEAKER_02]: you're gonna you got this timer that you're racing against and so I do feel like it's kind of like

[00:48:53] [SPEAKER_02]: a prevention or it's it's an added feature that prevents players from just brute forcing

[00:49:00] [SPEAKER_02]: different areas however you're also rewarded so like we've done a few elixir wells and these are like

[00:49:07] [SPEAKER_02]: key points in the game that you need to go to where there's a boss and there's a shroud root

[00:49:12] [SPEAKER_02]: and this is how you can help actually diminish the amount of shroud that's in the world and

[00:49:17] [SPEAKER_02]: after you kind of navigate into one of these areas before you go down into the boss arena it

[00:49:23] [SPEAKER_02]: gives you like a free space where you can recharge your en shrouded meter and so what I like about

[00:49:28] [SPEAKER_02]: this is that despite it having like a timer and giving that sense of urgency there's enough

[00:49:34] [SPEAKER_02]: generosity in how the game is built it's that like you're not just constantly running into the

[00:49:42] [SPEAKER_02]: running back out like you can they're checkpoints you can make progress while you're in a

[00:49:45] [SPEAKER_02]: shrouded area so it's incentivizing that exploration but it's also strongly encouraging you to be

[00:49:52] [SPEAKER_02]: really smart and tactical about your combat and how you use your time exploring shrouded areas

[00:50:01] [SPEAKER_00]: I think that's a good sense of this is on the design here Jake and again you know just to reiterate

[00:50:07] [SPEAKER_00]: we are at several hours in but we're not like crazy deep and also the game is still an early

[00:50:12] [SPEAKER_00]: access so because it looked vastly different at one or the which we will come back to this game

[00:50:17] [SPEAKER_00]: and one dot one dot and talk about it again let's move on to impact on the industry

[00:50:28] [SPEAKER_00]: survival crafting games are interesting this is a really pop like I want to say it's a popular genre

[00:50:33] [SPEAKER_00]: but it's I don't think it's a mainstream genre I think

[00:50:39] [SPEAKER_00]: power world so sorry I should take the bag minecraft

[00:50:48] [SPEAKER_00]: runescape minecraft and runescape so but yeah it's interesting right because I think minecraft

[00:50:55] [SPEAKER_00]: and runescape I don't even as runescape runescape some archie RPG right it's not is this

[00:51:01] [SPEAKER_02]: survival crafting I mean I don't know when I played runescape 3 billion years ago

[00:51:05] [SPEAKER_02]: it sure felt like survival crafting for the time I mean minecraft is the king here right minecraft

[00:51:11] [SPEAKER_00]: is kind of invented this the sort of basic gameplay loop we're seeing here of the like the

[00:51:19] [SPEAKER_00]: the crafting like it's survival crafting and minecraft is one of the biggest games like ever

[00:51:24] [SPEAKER_00]: I think minecraft stands on its own no because I don't think really any other survival crafting

[00:51:30] [SPEAKER_00]: game has even come close to the stratosphere it levels that minecraft has achieved

[00:51:37] [SPEAKER_00]: Fortnite has started out as sort of like survival crafting light and then turn into

[00:51:44] [SPEAKER_00]: the battle royale sort of metaverse thing that we see today last nothing to do with like survival

[00:51:48] [SPEAKER_00]: crafting anymore even though it has some of those bones in there especially like at the beginning

[00:51:55] [SPEAKER_00]: but this is an interesting genre I do think it's a popular genre on PC I don't think

[00:52:03] [SPEAKER_00]: on console I don't think really any other survival crafting game has broken through

[00:52:08] [SPEAKER_00]: in the way that minecraft has and become sort of this cultural phenomenon yeah

[00:52:15] [SPEAKER_00]: but I think these games are fun I think they offer like a really I think they offer a loop

[00:52:21] [SPEAKER_00]: and a loop is common across all these games it's it doesn't really change

[00:52:26] [SPEAKER_00]: between any of these games and there's dozens of them but that loop can be really satisfying

[00:52:32] [SPEAKER_00]: and really fun and I think it's it's one of the most fun types of games to play as a group

[00:52:38] [SPEAKER_00]: and it's one of the most accessible games for groups because usually these games are almost always

[00:52:44] [SPEAKER_00]: 100% cooperative and offers server sizes where you can play with like 10 15 20 of your friends

[00:52:51] [SPEAKER_00]: which I think is just a unique experience now in fact on the industry how does that change things

[00:52:57] [SPEAKER_00]: how does that touch anything industry wise I think the Blizzard survival crafting game that they were

[00:53:04] [SPEAKER_00]: developing was maybe the one that kind of had the chance to break through and become sort of that

[00:53:10] [SPEAKER_00]: mainstream commercial success in this genre but that game got canceled and so I think

[00:53:20] [SPEAKER_00]: we're kind of back to square one will there be another Minecraft level hit in this genre

[00:53:28] [SPEAKER_00]: I don't I don't know I think that's a good question I don't think anything can really come close to minecraft

[00:53:33] [SPEAKER_00]: maybe ever again I don't know that necessarily needs to but that's kind of where my head goes

[00:53:39] [SPEAKER_02]: I mean Minecraft is relatively simple in what it's doing or maybe it's simple not the right

[00:53:45] [SPEAKER_02]: word but straightforward right I mean speaking of narratives I mean like Minecraft survival mode really doesn't

[00:53:53] [SPEAKER_00]: have a narrative it has no has nothing it's completely freedom yeah which personally drives me in the

[00:54:03] [SPEAKER_00]: end I don't find Minecraft fun even though it's literally one of the biggest games ever

[00:54:10] [SPEAKER_00]: and it's a multi-bidgillian dollar title right and that's just because people just love the

[00:54:18] [SPEAKER_00]: unending freedom that that offers right it's just like endless creativity yeah and it's just all

[00:54:25] [SPEAKER_02]: gameplay loop and you are entirely in charge of that gameplay loop and I just feel like games

[00:54:31] [SPEAKER_02]: shrouded they they know they're not really competing with Minecraft um they're competing I

[00:54:37] [SPEAKER_02]: while I would assume as I can shroud is competing with something like power world it's competing

[00:54:41] [SPEAKER_02]: with something like new world right and it's interesting so I'm looking at actually the steam charts

[00:54:46] [SPEAKER_02]: now so when it came out it has this all-time peak of 160,000 which is amazing amazing right that's

[00:54:53] [SPEAKER_02]: a lot of player numbers and folks this is very normal right it has a dedicated player base it

[00:54:59] [SPEAKER_02]: looks like of about of 5000 plus um and that kind of just that's pretty solid that's really good I mean

[00:55:08] [SPEAKER_02]: and so you have a base there right and this is a game that's in early access and this is kind of the

[00:55:14] [SPEAKER_02]: trend of what happens with games like this right there's a massive spike when they first launch

[00:55:19] [SPEAKER_02]: people are interested they want to see if this is a game that they're going to stick with they

[00:55:22] [SPEAKER_02]: want to see if this is a game that they're going to end up playing with their friends which I think

[00:55:25] [SPEAKER_02]: is a big truth for our friend group, Cameroonized friend group but also just like the way that

[00:55:31] [SPEAKER_02]: these survival crafting games go and so I'm pretty optimistic actually here that and shrouded

[00:55:36] [SPEAKER_02]: is going to continue to do well just because they have a dedicated player base and listen if

[00:55:42] [SPEAKER_02]: 5000 people are playing your game and they've got you know when one point of it comes out

[00:55:46] [SPEAKER_02]: you already have 160,000 people who have bought the game and then from that you just have

[00:55:52] [SPEAKER_02]: a whole lot of word of mouth of like hey I'm playing this game hey I'm still playing this game

[00:55:58] [SPEAKER_02]: it's really good um and then you just kind of continue with it so I don't know I think it's

[00:56:04] [SPEAKER_02]: it's one of these games that it's made it like I feel like in in time of the industry where

[00:56:10] [SPEAKER_02]: it is super difficult to maintain an audience especially if you're a live service game

[00:56:15] [SPEAKER_02]: if you're a big multiplayer game like this it's tough to do so but this is one of the games

[00:56:21] [SPEAKER_02]: that's done it and so a part of me is kind of just like hey add your list to the I'd

[00:56:26] [SPEAKER_02]: your name to the list of successes here that's that's huge in and of itself even if I don't

[00:56:32] [SPEAKER_02]: think or I don't know this could change this one point oh if and shrouded it's going to be like

[00:56:37] [SPEAKER_02]: the next big innovative thing in this genre yeah I don't know it will be but it doesn't really

[00:56:48] [SPEAKER_00]: need to be till your point uh I think there's a lot of these games I think this game doesn't

[00:56:54] [SPEAKER_00]: to make it unique and make it stand out and I think maybe even stand above some of its competitors

[00:57:01] [SPEAKER_00]: Valheim being kind of the one that stands out uh grounded of course exists and is already out there

[00:57:07] [SPEAKER_00]: if you haven't played grounded I recommend that first but I think this would probably be

[00:57:12] [SPEAKER_00]: this would probably be second for me I think this this does just enough different

[00:57:19] [SPEAKER_00]: that to me is like compelling and kind of how it's structured obviously some things some

[00:57:25] [SPEAKER_00]: kinks to work out and some some a little bit of jank in there but that's to be expected yeah I mean

[00:57:30] [SPEAKER_02]: I what I foresee here is that like this game is going to do super well when one point over

[00:57:35] [SPEAKER_02]: it comes around and I think yeah it'll just be remembered as a game that pulled it off that did it

[00:57:41] [SPEAKER_02]: but you know there is plenty of time between now and 1.0 and I just hope that you know they're able

[00:57:48] [SPEAKER_02]: to do some things with this game that that make it do more and have like a really big impact on

[00:57:53] [SPEAKER_02]: the industry and the reason why I say that is because these games in my opinion there's a whole lot

[00:58:01] [SPEAKER_02]: of them and it is tough to get a super dedicated player base and it is really tough to innovate

[00:58:07] [SPEAKER_02]: on this genre and so any little way that you can innovate or you can add quality of life

[00:58:14] [SPEAKER_02]: or you can make this game easier to jump into which I actually think the slow leveling system

[00:58:19] [SPEAKER_02]: does make it easier to jump into because it's not like oh crap I'm missing a night playing with

[00:58:23] [SPEAKER_02]: my friends or all 10 levels above me I'm super far behind I don't want to do any solo grinding

[00:58:28] [SPEAKER_02]: therefore I'm gonna quit playing I feel like I'm shrouded that might be maybe its angle of being

[00:58:33] [SPEAKER_02]: like hey it's actually quite easy to hop back into this game with your friends if you missed a night

[00:58:38] [SPEAKER_02]: or if you fell off for a little bit and you want to come back to it which I feel like is

[00:58:43] [SPEAKER_02]: is a huge challenge with one of these games how am I gonna come back to this game if I stop

[00:58:48] [SPEAKER_02]: playing it and making that sort of reentry easier is something that really we really need to

[00:58:55] [SPEAKER_00]: game to figure that one out well Jake any other thoughts on shrouded early access before we end

[00:59:07] [SPEAKER_02]: the show for tonight I mean it's a great game in early access and so this is why I'm hopeful

[00:59:13] [SPEAKER_02]: that 1.0 might be able to make a really big splash because the early access is really solid just

[00:59:20] [SPEAKER_02]: please give us a better dodge roll and please give us magic chests like from the get go

[00:59:25] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah I have nothing else one thing we didn't mention if nothing else if you like the playhouse

[00:59:32] [SPEAKER_00]: part of these games this game has one of the most flushed out crafting elements in terms of like

[00:59:39] [SPEAKER_00]: creating beautiful homes and we've just barely scratched the surface of that I've seen some of

[00:59:44] [SPEAKER_00]: the stuff that people can make in terms of like buildings and like houses and all the customizations

[00:59:49] [SPEAKER_00]: you can make and it gets it gets nutty like you can make like a Hobbiton basically nice which is pretty cool

[00:59:58] [SPEAKER_00]: and ladies and gentlemen with that this has been another episode of the period of this podcast talking

[01:00:01] [SPEAKER_00]: and shrouded early access we thank you so much for listening if you like the show please leave

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[01:00:54] [SPEAKER_00]: when the scripture 18 thank you so much for listening and have a great night