Alan Wake 2

[00:00:00] Ladies and gentlemen welcome back to another episode of the Pre-Order Bonus podcast. I'm one of your hosts Cameron Warren and I'm joined as always by the intrepid Jacob Price It's me folks. I'm here again. Wake Jake Jake Jake

[00:00:32] That's on theme for today's episode it is it really is yeah Yeah, welcome back Jake. How you doing? Doing let's see came out of a pretty stressful week, but uh Jake Jake Alan Wake, you know the take in Alan week and wake Intrepid Jake

[00:00:57] I've been haunted this week. No. Yeah, um Come on. I'm coming on with a kind of pretty stressful week but nearing the end of the semester and

[00:01:08] The end of the semester is always a ton of fun because for folks who are new to the podcast or don't know us that well so I teach right and I teach literature and

[00:01:18] Right now I'm teaching three sections of like an introduction to literature course and the last unit that I have is on video games And so we're starting that unit and it's it's always a ton of fun for students

[00:01:28] It and for the class. It's a great way to end the semester and so Yeah, about to start that up. I've added I've shaken up the curriculum a little bit this semester

[00:01:37] I'm looking forward to it so coming out of stress into fun and yeah can't can't complain too much How are you doing Cameron? I'm hanging in there man. Um, I Am in a gaming ret

[00:01:54] I think I I think we talked about this last week, but I am I'm at my like I Think I Mentioned like I came off the high of all the fall releases and then just came way down and I've just been

[00:02:08] Download, I'm literally going through steam downloading everything in my backlog I've probably spent five to ten minutes at about 25 games in the last like two weeks Just trying to find something that's like hitting emotionally, right? That's like triggering something inside

[00:02:25] Yeah, and just I feel nothing. I have like nothing. I feel nothing. That's bad. How many games is it about 20 25 games? Yeah, yeah for sure like totally I've just been like my libraries right now are completely full of games. I've downloaded

[00:02:40] Literally everything in my backlog so far as to I bought dragon's dogma one thinking that it might I might feel something It's like five bucks on the xbox. Yeah Yeah, I felt nothing. So

[00:02:53] Um, yeah, I don't know what I think there's some stuff coming on game pass soon Um, obviously I'm I'm you know nearing the end of alan wake 2 which we're talking about today Uh, which is really good. But I don't know. I'm looking I'm looking for something

[00:03:09] I'm looking for something and I think there's a few things in december and like some recent game pass announcements I think I'll get something soon that's gonna like

[00:03:17] Hit but yeah, it's I'm in a weird this happens to me every once in a while. I'm not sure what it is It's like a state of mind or Usually happens around this time of the this time of year or

[00:03:27] Sometimes like in the spring and I think that's just maybe a natural like you get all these really amazing game releases And then you kind of come off that and it's like, uh, do I want to go back to the backlog? I don't know

[00:03:37] Yeah, yeah, I am riding the the remedy entertainment wave right now Um coming off of alan wake 2 Um two people from our discord actually a rosebud and freddy go boom They are planning or rosebud has just started a playthrough their first playthrough of control

[00:03:55] And um, very nice. That's one of freddy's favorite games. I know and he's doing a playthrough that actually a lot of people in our Snacktaku, I think mentioned beating control and really liking it a few other people and anyway So

[00:04:09] Control ultimate addition. So that's the the next gen upgrade Plus dlc was only 10 bucks on the black friday sale Uh, so I grabbed it too But i'm starting to dig into my backlog and I've I'm over halfway through quantum break

[00:04:26] Um, I'm really playing a lot of spirit tea. Does that hold up? Almost like It's such a that's enough It's a shame because there's a lot there that I really like

[00:04:41] But dude give that game needs a remaster. There's just um a few things about it that don't don't hold up very well Um, I see some like cut scenes are super choppy um And then movement just feels really off uh gunplay is like

[00:04:59] Not nearly as tight as it is in control or alan wake 2 So it's like You know, it probably will never get touched ever again But I think if quantum break You know if there's a game out there that deserves a remaster

[00:05:12] I I kind of think it's quantum break give us some of the I mean it still looks good But make it look closer to like alan wake 2 and make it play a little better

[00:05:21] And it would be a phenomenal experience, but I am enjoying it. I'm going to beat it Um, but yeah, so i've been playing that i've been playing a lot of spirit tea um I've been playing an indie game called under the waves

[00:05:33] That i've almost done with and then i'm gonna start alan wakes american nightmare because i'm just like Fully into the remedy connected universe right now. Um Yeah, I I've been tempted by that For sure

[00:05:51] I've I've got my eye on a few things. I'm I think steam steam world dig Steam world build yeah is hitting game pass tomorrow, which I've been interested in me too um

[00:06:03] Roller dome hit game pass a couple days ago, which I've had on my list for a long time. Um I'm not if you're familiar with that one um roller dome. Yes. I I haven't installed. I think Dude game passes on fire right now

[00:06:18] Yeah, they just shadow dropped. That's probably the biggest news is they just shadow dropped remnant 1 and 2 actually Just out of the blue like on the same day, which is crazy huge one of the probably one of the best games of the year um

[00:06:33] And to your point jake the probably the biggest snub of the game awards is that remnant 2 is not going to walk away with anything You know including best multiplayer game, which it should probably win

[00:06:42] Yeah, I like a lot of the games in the best multiplayer category. I'm I yeah, this is my one snub that you know My personal vendetta right is man remnant 2 should have been in there and should have been a top runner but

[00:06:54] Anyway, if if you want to find that out for yourself and you have game pass It's on there Which I think is an awesome awesome win for game pass Yeah, uh Yeah, I don't know what's Really what we have to look forward to the most is that

[00:07:12] Is announcements? Uh, and that's that's kind of the place my head is at 2024 is filling out. It's starting to form Already, which is kind of nuts Uh looking at kind of the list February is just ridiculous It's just insane for releases not all like huge massive hype situations

[00:07:32] But if you're into Japanese games specifically jrpg's and the like like you are in for a treat In february and then we have obviously dragons dogma 2 coming in march, which Dude, dr. Gman's dogma 2 it does doesn't look like it's messing around dude. It looks pretty insane

[00:07:51] Um that is definitely one of those games that I know people love the original And they've been waiting for this for a long time and there's been a lot of buzz about it

[00:07:59] I've been kind of standing back from it. So I was like, you know what? I'm not like super into the I don't know this franchise And then the recent spotlight that I got I was like, oh dude, this actually looks amazing I was like this looks really good

[00:08:14] Yeah, it totally does. Um Lots of other stuff. I mean there's there's definitely stuff coming like a dragon infinite wealth Um, that's another one actually that I pulled back out of the backlog to see if I could like finish it Oh, yeah I don't think I can

[00:08:30] Dude, I'm looking at the february list. Um, yeah, dude, you weren't kidding. Uh, there's a lot of stuff Obviously final fantasy seven rebirth is in there. That's huge. Um Let's say I'm not huge. Oh mario versus donkey kong. Remember when Nintendo announced that Helldivers 2 that's also february

[00:08:49] Um, is suicide squad still coming out in february or no? I can't remember if I got delayed again Uh, I think so. Yeah, that's also coming like early next year and Apparently the latest news on suicide squad is that it was play tested by some relatively prominent

[00:09:07] streamers or people like in the public gaming sphere And they came away super positive. Nice. So Yeah, I mean look, I hope every game was a banger. So like I Obviously it's been kind of nuts how they've

[00:09:21] presented this game and I still don't understand why we're doing a suicide squad Yeah, I still don't get that but if the game's fun, it's fun I would love nothing more than to see this game like just come out and everybody loves it

[00:09:31] Yeah, um as far as indie games that are coming out there are two on my radar the sequel to turnip boy commits tax evasion Which is I think turnip boy robs a bank got announced Oh nice got announced for january 18th. Um, and then

[00:09:45] Pacific drive which is a super wacky Like paranormal horror game where you drive a car and run over enemies in a storm in washington Did you see this? That's that's got a release date for february

[00:09:58] Which I at first I was like this game looks ridiculous and then the more I saw about it I was like, you know what this game actually could be really cool So that's coming soon Well, I don't think there's any other Significant news other than next week

[00:10:14] Uh on december 7th today is november 30th, but next week december 7th. We will be Uh watching The game awards. That's right Gathering together with some friends. So if you happen to be in the state of utah that evening, you're welcome to come to my house

[00:10:30] Shoot me a note on discord We'll be watching together with a group and then are we doing reactions right after we are is that what we're doing? That evening playing as reactions immediately afterwards Awesome. Well, that should be really fun. I'm seeing some teases out there jake

[00:10:45] I'm seeing the xbox is going to be there in a pretty significant way like There could be some pretty legit stuff. I think I am losing my mind about the xbox stuff actually because um, there's a whole lot of rumors percolating regarding Clockwork revolution

[00:11:04] Like more information on that. Yes Um, the game uh south of midnight, which was just teased supposedly it's like maybe way further in development than we think Um, really? Yes, and then Hellblade 2 and avowed are the are the two big ones that are expected for 2024 that

[00:11:22] If we could get launch windows or release dates for those ones at the game awards, that would be amazing Yeah, that would be insane. Uh, that would be Very unexpected. I expect like basically every game at this point is not coming out for like five years, but

[00:11:39] If they surprise me, I mean map booty has said like They're pretty confident they're release late at this point. Yeah, they feel like they've made it through sort of the haze of Covid and like all the delays and like they've got a strong footing

[00:11:53] I also saw some stuff on stalker 2 like a lot of new information Which makes me think that we will see some sort of big trailer game awards and then get like hey, this is coming q1

[00:12:04] Uh for the xbox slate is q1 been slotted for the game pass like mage because you know, they're doing the quarterly plan, right? Or one big game per quarter for game pass, right? I can't remember. I think we have a fairly good idea of four games for 2024 Um

[00:12:24] I mean one of them is going to be hellblade and then I would assume stalker 2, right? Right, um shoot I don't know what the other two could be shoot man. What were the

[00:12:37] I'm totally I don't know if it's locked in to be honest. No, it's it's not let's see, uh But I remember seeing something about About what they were planning on releasing

[00:12:51] xbox was a valid in hellblade 2 the only ones I can think of but I think that there are some others so I think avowed and hellblade 2 are Sorry, not about I think hellblade 2 and stalker 2 are for sure next year. Yeah like 100%

[00:13:06] Yeah, and I wouldn't be surprised if avowed is also in there potentially late in the year, right? That's kind of But later in the year. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, but um Yeah, I'm excited. It's it's always a super fun time. Love watching the game awards

[00:13:21] Obviously, you know, you get the cheese you get the ads you get all like the weirdness with that But yeah, it's it's fun to watch. That's super fun. Yeah, it's always always a good time I'm looking forward to it And uh, yeah, I don't know No

[00:13:35] The games keep coming and they don't stop coming Well video games are cool. Uh, and We have reached Jake For this episode our last regular episode of the year that's right because as jake mentioned next week

[00:13:51] We are gonna talk we're gonna do our reactions to the game awards And then I think the week after that are we doing our game of the year? Is that right?

[00:13:57] So we'll be doing our game of the year a little uh like I think a week earlier than we did the last two years, but Yeah, it's time and then we will be taking a holiday Christmas break. Oh, yeah

[00:14:09] So you're gonna have to find other podcasts to listen to which is not hard Or go back, you know, we have a pretty extensive episode list. We got a pretty big library Yeah, yeah for sure if you have stuff in your backlog, you're not sure about

[00:14:22] We have most likely played it and have an episode on it So if you're like wanting a breakdown of what you're getting yourself into Like just go look at the list because it's a big list. Yeah Um

[00:14:36] Or you could just go play wasteland 3 you said clock clock work a lot revolution that made me think of wasteland 3 which That's a good game Oh, man

[00:14:46] Well, let's with that. Let's get into it. This is our again last regular episode of the year and a fitting one because we're Going to be talking about Alan wake 2 from remedy

[00:14:57] This is has become one of the biggest games of the year a game of the year contender nominated for a game of the year at the game awards Jake how we're gonna break this one down? Uh, this uh

[00:15:08] This is mostly for those of you who are tuning in for the first time to the podcast What we like to do here the period of bonus podcast is we like to talk about

[00:15:16] Games into four different categories and the first one is the narrative. We love talking about the story plot A lot of times we talk a little more thematically in this category

[00:15:25] And we don't really do spoilers. So you don't need to worry too much. We'll cover probably the first fourth of the game here Um, and just leave the rest up to you

[00:15:35] Next we'll be talking about the mechanics. So this is you know, how you're actually interacting with the game What systems are baked into the game? Um, how gunplay looks feels if it's a gunplay like game like alan wake 2 stuff along those lines

[00:15:47] Um is what we'll be doing in the mechanics category third We'll be talking about the gameplay loop. So this is you know, the systems the cycle sort of built in of play time A lot of times we talk about what defines a play session

[00:15:58] And just overall like what keeps you engaged in the game And then lastly we'll be talking about impact on the industry Cameron and I like to speculate We like to think a little bit more about okay

[00:16:09] What exactly do we think is happening like in the games industry because of this game? Or how did the games industry come to the point to produce this type of a game etc And then that's how we will close out our episode on alan wake 2 this evening

[00:16:24] All right. Well, let's dive in alan wake 2 narrative. Um Wacky What other words would What's a short word for describing this narrative? This is an extremely meta narrative about narrative Yeah about narrative It is

[00:16:46] Listen folks, I know that like we're in a trend like uh in terms of art to do postmodern and really meta narrative stuff And I kind of think we've hit the fever pitch with alan wake 2 it is so on the nose meta

[00:17:00] Um and what it is trying to accomplish some points. I was kind of like, all right We can dial it back a little bit. We get it. It's a game about you know about a story about a game about a writer making a You know story

[00:17:13] So it does it and I think it does it well. Don't get me wrong But I definitely need a break from like hyper obviously meta narrative Games after playing this one I think what this game has achieved in terms of narrative

[00:17:30] And as an audio, this is one of those games that I would put on a pedestal As a shining example And this is something we talk about often on the show

[00:17:40] Shining example of what the video games medium only can achieve right and no one else can I think I think this is like probably Maybe the premier example of that It's a triple a budgeted crazy game with live action visuals in it with

[00:17:59] You know incredible triple a graphics That is just really This team is just absolutely flexing across a lot of different mediums here graphically technically Story narrative You know meta narrative, right like as its own category. I think here in this game

[00:18:23] And then it just the only place where I think maybe they're not flexing as hard as maybe they have in other games This is in the mechanics department in my opinion But you know, you can't can't always have it all Um

[00:18:35] But yeah, this this is uh just to kind of break this out This is like this is the direct continuation of alan wake one which is a game that came out. I think back in 2012 It is 2010 even longer gosh 13 years ago um

[00:18:50] How to remaster remake in like what 2014 I am blanking on that year Not too long ago Anyway story of alan wake who is a fiction horror novel writer he goes to the town of I can't remember the name. What is it twin lakes?

[00:19:11] It's bright. It's bright falls although bright falls. Yeah twin peaks is what i'm thinking of in my head Which honestly is a is the right kind of mistake to make because if you like twin peaks, you will love alan wake too

[00:19:24] This is that vibe very much twin peaks is the vibe here. This is northwest washington logging town Creepy and jake and I are both from the pacific northwest. So like yeah You know, we've been in the forest that you play go in this game and it is

[00:19:39] Almost it is as creepy as you think it is. Oh, yeah Anyway, so story of alan wake he goes He's trying to like get inspiration to write his novel and some crazy stuff happens in alan wake one

[00:19:53] Without going too much into detail because it's very convoluted. He ends up At the end of the game. This is spoilers for alan wake one warning spoilers for alan wake one

[00:20:01] So skip ahead if you don't want to hear this he ends up in something called the dark place And he's like trapped there and so on alan wake two you begin the story and You start off as saga who is an fbi agent who's solving

[00:20:19] Who's going to the town of great falls to solve a murder there's been a murder of of a former fbi Agent who's been in the town Had his heart ripped out had some crazy stuff happens

[00:20:33] And so she goes down there to investigate this cult that has killed this guy. Yeah with her partner and then that kicks off What proceeds to evolve into

[00:20:45] This narrative slash metanary where it starts off you think that it's going to be this detective story in the Pacific Northwest But then they uncork it and they're like, okay saga's discovering pages that literally sitting on the ground

[00:21:00] And somehow saga determines and this is where some of the story things like Some sometimes don't work crazy well for me I mean Sometimes she determines somehow like

[00:21:12] Decipherers that she is actually inside of a narrative that is being written in an unfolded by alan wake who is in the dark place Yes, and then at some point it switches you end up as alan wake and then it kind of reveals. Okay

[00:21:26] You're alan wake playing as You're playing as alan wake playing as saga And you're these two narratives are kind of they're intertwined Moving forward simultaneously each side affecting another towards this ultimate end goal Of you know alan wake trying to escape from the dark place and then saga

[00:21:46] Obviously unraveling this this mystery um It's very complicated It's very complicated. I think yeah, the story goes in a lot of directions And there are a lot of different levels to sort of what's happening

[00:21:59] I think cameron's got us down to like what it what we really need to talk about for that episode, right? You have saga anderson and then you have alan wake and this is all stuff that's in the trailers, right? So this is not really spoiling

[00:22:11] But essentially they it feels like they're two sides of the same coin And but one is alan wake stuck in a different dimension if you will underneath cauldron lake of bright falls washington And then you have saga anderson as fbi agent Who was called into bright falls?

[00:22:26] um to investigate a series of ritualistic murders and so Things get pretty hairy and just you know this this game is pretty gross. I would say at the beginning, right? Like there's some pretty You know pretty gross images, you know murders and stuff but um

[00:22:43] what I love about this game and folks I loved this game's narrative is uh That it I think it pairs incredibly well the detective story of saga anderson And the horror story of alan wake and a lot of times like these types of

[00:22:58] Technically they're two different genres, right? Like in a detective story. You don't have to have horror per se, right? They could be like highly cerebral and psychological but without like horror elements

[00:23:09] And then in a horror story, you don't have to have detective oftentimes like the venn diagram is You know, there's a lot of space where they share things in common So it makes sense to sort of have these two stories being told from this these two different perspectives

[00:23:22] about one sort of phenomenon that's happening in bright falls But this is kind of My my summary of why I love the game so much as a sequel, right? And so if alan wake one is an interesting game because alan wake as a writer

[00:23:39] Is creating reality out of the fiction that he's producing, right? Like and that is the main theme there and that is the world building device like that is what pushing That's what's pushing forward alan wake one

[00:23:52] What I love about alan wake two is that it takes that theme and then it makes it much more personal And without spoiling anything. I'll just say this one of the major themes of alan wake two is

[00:24:03] What happens the other way around like what happens to any one of us when we read fiction or we participate in art And it fundamentally changes us, right? Like I think a lot of us can think back to a specific movie or a specific book or poem or

[00:24:19] Or whatever, you know an art piece is sculpture whatever it was That really had a profound impact on you and that made you think differently that really opened your eyes up to maybe like hey

[00:24:30] What are there more movies like this like hey? Are there more books like this? You know, we've all had that kind of moment and I think alan wake two Absolutely embraces that where it's like

[00:24:39] To what degree if I open myself up to a piece of art. Well that artwork Actually do something to me like will have some what function as a subject with agency and impact me in some way and can

[00:24:51] Fundamentally change me and so I love that about this because saga Anderson and alan wake They have wonderful character arcs and they come to certain realizations about who they are and what their limitations are and how they

[00:25:04] Need to overcome those in order to achieve something that's greater than themselves and their own desires And so I'm speaking vaguely and I apologize a little bit for that But a lot of that stuff thematically really like comes to fruition later in the game

[00:25:18] So I can't give you specific details without spoiling but yeah huge fan of this like huge huge fan of of how the the game Is telling a story about art and and really resonating with our any and creating are obviously as part of that as well

[00:25:38] Yeah, this um I think my reaction to this narrative is that I'm Very impressed by it while at the same time did not enjoy it that like as much. I think as you did jake I think it was maybe a little bit too meta for me um

[00:26:03] Yeah, it's weird because I I risk this is one of those games where like I absolutely Respect what it's doing to the point where I'm like, yeah, absolutely. This deserves incredible accolades for what it's doing just You know across a lot of different spectrums, right?

[00:26:20] It didn't always work for me. I think one big confusion point that happened to me was In the beginning like I kind of went in knowing that it was going to be sort of this meta narrative with allen wake type You know dictating reality

[00:26:33] But when saga corna stumbles upon and I mentioned this earlier when she sort of stumbles upon the pages and then is just sort of Easily falls into like oh Yeah, this is this weird reality that's being controlled by some entity like in a different

[00:26:52] Parallel universe and she's just like oh, yeah totally. Yeah, I get it I feel like it was weird like the emotional reaction of that wasn't it was I don't know It just it was kind of it was very jarring

[00:27:03] And so it didn't get him to give me a chance as the you know consumer of it to kind of understand The line that like saga was crossing where she was like, okay I've exited reality and now I'm in something different

[00:27:17] And I got used to it after a little while and I think you know Obviously you do as as you play more but that was kind of jarring because I was really interested

[00:27:26] In just the FBI agent like mystery right and I was like really invested in that and then suddenly It's like oh wait a minute. Actually none of this is real. It's all being dictated by it's all being like created by

[00:27:39] Alan Wake and this you know in this parallel universe And so I don't know it's like took out the um We talked about this via text and I don't know if I'm saying this right

[00:27:52] But it sort of took away the emotional core for me where it was suddenly like the story was about The meta narrative and like what interesting things they could accomplish within the context of the meta narrative and like the parallel universes versus like

[00:28:08] What was happening to the individual characters and how they were growing and progressing like as individuals and Does that make sense? I'm kind of all over the place, but it's I'm having a hard time communicating That makes total sense so what I'm understanding from what you're saying

[00:28:20] And I honestly I agree with this right? I think this is an absolutely fair criticism Is that the barrier to entry? To the alan wake 2 narrative is too high

[00:28:31] You know what I mean? So like part of the reason why I enjoyed this game and I don't mean this like there's no Intellectual barrier. I think any player is capable of understanding the meta narrative and the hyper you know Meta artistic critique that it's doing

[00:28:44] What I mean by the the barrier to entry is too high is that one You have to play alan wake one before you play this game like I think yeah anybody who's telling you any different. I'm sorry. I strongly disagree like I think it

[00:29:01] It all clarified that I watched a like 25 minute alan wake one recap before starting this game I own alan wake one and tried to play it, but it just it's really old. It doesn't hold up in my esteem

[00:29:16] Enter like so I just couldn't do it, but I did watch a video. I don't know if that was enough though It maybe right so I wonder because I actually did play alan wake one for the first time a few weeks before playing alan wake 2 So

[00:29:31] Camera night. I mean take it just take it with what you're hearing folks Like that was camera's experience was listening to a recap and mine was playing alan wake one weeks Just recently before playing alan wake 2 So I think that's part of it right because

[00:29:45] Characters locations to me. They're more than easter eggs to me They kind of depend on a specific amount of pre knowledge before going into alan wake 2 And so barrier to entry for this narrative is a little high And I agree with you Cameron what you're saying is

[00:30:00] These characters are likable. Don't get me wrong. There's nothing wrong with these characters or way that they're written I think they're fantastic characters and they're well written But with a detective story Um, if if the detective doesn't hook you, you know, it's a the case had better be

[00:30:17] Super compelling to keep you interested in the story, right? So there are kind of two opportunities within that genre to hook the reader And if one doesn't work or they you know, if they both don't work then you can get bounced off it and Cameron

[00:30:32] I agree with you like the game starts with a super interesting fbi case And that case evolves in spirals much further away than from like a standard fbi case Even like a one was supernatural elements does

[00:30:48] Quite quickly. So this that I think that's like the second barrier to entry is that like You kind of get a bait and switch like a little bit in terms of what type of story you think you're getting out of the game So

[00:31:01] Yeah, I agree with you. Um, I would say but for my me going into it. I was fully prepared and I loved it Yeah, and I think I think that's still somewhat there

[00:31:12] You just kind of have to get used to it and yeah, you kind of have to get used to it And I did eventually get used to it and kind of figured out. Okay. I know what this game is now And I know like what I'm doing

[00:31:21] But I found that I cared less about the characters in a weird way for some reason I don't know why that is but that's just kind of what happened. Um, but Um, I will say though that like Beyond that this game is just dripping with atmosphere

[00:31:38] Just absolutely dripping with atmosphere and it I it's even hard to communicate Just how exceptional like of a job they do and just engrossing you in this weird freaky world Right. It's it's obviously a combination of visuals but

[00:31:57] There's just so many elements, right? There's the profiling when you're as playing a saga This is a little bit of them talking about mechanics, but it ties into the narrative very deeply Where you go into her mind palace

[00:32:09] And you're profiling and then you have like these dialogues, right? And then you have dialogue where she's reading the pages that are describing how Alan Wake is writing the world And you know and then just the location itself, right this like northwest washington sort of

[00:32:26] mysterious logging town that I don't think actually exists because I'm from there and I think if you Have you been to like a Aberdeen, you know that it's not it's Aberdeen's not like that. No, no, it's Aberdeen's too big. This is more like, um

[00:32:44] This game yeah, this game is more like folks and you have to understand forks before twilight right before before Forks before pre twilight. Yeah, I remember going to forks once when I was like seven or eight years old

[00:32:54] Like and it was it was a crossroads and it was like grocery store sheriff station school city hall Ice cream stand and that was like it that's like And that's very much this type of A location. I think they nailed that for sure

[00:33:12] Yeah, no, they they nailed it for sure and it's again like just dripping with it Like the whole thing is just there's so many so much detail And just all the elements and then there's sort of like weird

[00:33:23] Scandinavian influence that just like permeates throughout the whole thing, which but it's great. Like it totally works um Yeah, so all that just There's this element and I don't even know how to describe it, but just the vibes right

[00:33:37] There's this element of just vibes and like atmosphere that I think this game Just does exceptionally well like better than anything I can recall and like recent memory just making you engrossed and kind of the place that

[00:33:50] The game puts you in this place and they just it just engrosses you in that in and kind of what it is Yeah, and it just yeah that works really really well. Yeah, I honestly think that the setting is just absolutely perfect

[00:34:02] I remember playing, you know, allen wake one takes place in the same location bright falls and cauldron lake And yeah, I mean it definitely had like those vibes, but man did they do their research this time around to make like hyper realistic rainy pine forest

[00:34:17] I was explaining this to somebody else, but like There's a this game evoked a very specific feeling that I had as like a teenager I did a lot of camping out in you know the rain on the olympic peninsula or just in the cascades of washington state

[00:34:32] And the terrifying feeling every time like you're camping. It's cold and rainy at night It's pitch black right because the trees are covering the sky And it's 1 a.m. You think it's like midnight

[00:34:44] Whatever late into the night and you got to pee really bad and you're like crap I have to go outside and pee and so you grab your flashlight this game depends so heavily on a flashlight, right? You grab you pull on your hoodie you slip on some shoes

[00:34:58] You grab your flashlight you pull your hood over your head You put on that flashlight All you see is sort of that like ring of light Reflecting off all the ferns and the pine trees and you're just like terrified because it is so dark

[00:35:11] And the noises are all creep you know creepy and drippy because of the rain and I was like do they nailed it I I think I was like this reminds me of all those times

[00:35:20] I had to pee in the middle of the night as a teenager being freaked out out of my mind Because I was like, oh my gosh. I'm gonna die some things are gonna come out here and kill me Uh, yeah, they absolutely nailed that for sure um

[00:35:35] Yeah, I mean there's there's a lot to say like going deep. I you know, obviously we don't want to spoil This is a brand new game I think this is one of those that I could see us circling back to and doing like a spoiler

[00:35:45] episode because the narrative is like It just it goes a lot of places uh and like unpacking it. I think almost Really like I think you almost I think when I fin when I get to the I'm I'm

[00:35:59] Getting close to the end. I think I'm like three quarters way through but when I'm done I'm gonna have to go back through And probably watch some youtube videos and like read some articles to like unpack everything that's happening because that's just

[00:36:11] There's so much happening all the time That it's hard to keep track of all I I I found that And this is kind of just where my state of mind is that right now as well you know working

[00:36:25] Relatively long hours like getting engrossed and then at the end of the day You're like, I just want to chill and play games and you play this and it's like a mind Yeah, like it's it's really Out there right. It's doing a lot of stuff. It's really stretching

[00:36:39] Your ability to kind of wrap your head fully around the narrative in my opinions You have to really sit down and focus on what you're doing and like pay attention And if you don't like it's easy to miss stuff because there's so much going on

[00:36:52] there's somebody hints and like subtleties And obviously it being a meta narrative like understanding that part of it also I think not necessarily like tough is the wrong word, but you have to be in the right mindset

[00:37:03] I think to capture everything that it's doing. Alan wake 2 is the exact polar opposite of a cozy zen game like I kid you not I was playing this game almost always because I was so engrossed and so into it almost always in gamer position on the couch

[00:37:21] You know feet forward fat on the flat on the floor elbows on your knees controller raised up like you're staring intently at the screen like That that this game kind of like I agree it demands that of you the narrative folks. It's complicated

[00:37:35] There are a lot of dense layers to it. It can be opaque. It can be really abstract And weird this game gets weird as heck. You have to be really like this is why

[00:37:46] We we mentioned twin peaks you have to be okay with mystery murder in weird as heck, right? And I think if that's your jam you're really gonna love alan wake 2 and what it does narratively

[00:37:58] Like Cameron said, I just want to repeat this is one of the best if not the best multimedia type of experiences that I think is out there It's just the combination of different types of artistic mediums and genres Within this game is just unreal. It's unparalleled

[00:38:18] And then but I do promise that towards the end of the game There are a few moments, you know the the big reveals are relatively clear So if you're feeling lost into the game, there are moments that it's like, oh

[00:38:30] Got it. That's what this means. And so I feel like Even if you can't wrap your head around everything that's happening in the game You'll finish the game with some clarity and with some resolution Let's jump into the mechanics This is where I

[00:38:49] I don't know. I had a rough time in a few spots. I think So mechanically, there's a there's obviously it's third person. There is shooting and combat There is a weird dodge button where you kind of like duck and back up

[00:39:07] You pick up like mo and then you have a flashlight flashlight and a weapon, right? Like a shooting weapon And then you're You're fighting like these basically these like darkness

[00:39:19] Creatures and you shoot them with your flashlight to kind of stun them and then you shoot them with whatever ranged weapon you have that felt fine to me. I think that was that was Pretty well done. I think the shooting was like pretty relatively impactful

[00:39:33] There's a decent variety of weapons not like a huge variety, but there's a you know, they all there's like a crossbow and it feels good And I thought I thought that all felt fine But overall like this is really straightforward

[00:39:47] Combat and then I also already mentioned like the mine palace which is In saga side of the story like you're taking time to take clues due deductions profile witnesses And they're sort of this like series of so basically when you hit hit the back button

[00:40:04] You enter the mine palace, which is basically like a miniaturized version of like essentially like your hotel room in great falls Um not manager. It's like a version of your hotel room like in your head

[00:40:15] And then you have all these photos like up on the door. This is a cool concept I do think the execution falls a little bit flat because it ends up turning into like place the tiles on the board without That much interact like not really interesting interaction

[00:40:31] It's almost one of those things where I was like, maybe the game should just do this for me because it felt like a teeny bit Like I'm gonna do this anyways. Just maybe you could like speed this up. It's like a little bit too slow or it's not

[00:40:45] Like it's it's it's not a mechanic that involves a lot of It's just not that it's an interesting mechanic, but it's not a very fun mechanic. I think is the right Maybe the right way to put it. Um, but those are those are like the two big

[00:40:59] Things I can think of mechanically sometimes these felt like a slog for me Which Yeah, it just didn't help when I would kind of get lost in the narrative And then I'm kind of slogging through a little bit of the gameplay

[00:41:13] And then there's obviously puzzles that you solve by finding clues in the environment as well Which is a big part of the game. Yeah, I would say mechanically this game is leaps and bounds ahead of allen wake one

[00:41:24] Yeah, yeah, dude allen wake one. That is where age is terribly right I feel like anyway, we don't this isn't a podcast about on wake one though. This is about on wake two Um, actually texted Cameron this this is Cameron's biggest win

[00:41:37] Related to to convincing me to play games this year um I texted him and I said I would not have enjoyed this game nearly as much if I hadn't played resident evil 2 remake And I do think that the combat here borrows quite a lot

[00:41:51] And again, that's not only resident evil game I've played But I assume also just the more recent resident evil stuff where the dodge button is kind of like this weird strafe crouch, you know

[00:42:04] Guns feel like, you know, each bullet is important and there's quite a lot of sway You know, you really have to be considerate about your shots Um And and you know combat feels really intimate right despite they're not really being a melee weapon in this game

[00:42:19] Which I thought was interesting, but um yeah, so Cool deliberate gameplay. It's not innovating by any means though like the combat And I think that's fine for this type of game where the focus isn't necessarily like hey, let's make this like

[00:42:36] Center this game around combat. No, this game is centered around narrative and that's where it needed to Really shine and so the combat here works. It does what it's supposed to Um It can feel a little weird and it does take some getting used to

[00:42:51] I personally love the flashlight mechanic. Um I love that where it's kind of like your best defense is a strong offense You stun enemies and then you shoot them down if they get close to you There's no melee weapons. You kind of just got to

[00:43:05] You know dodge out of the way until you can get a stun on them Or you can get a few more rounds into them, etc So combat was fine, right? Like I honestly don't think it was bad. I didn't have any problems with it

[00:43:16] There were some boss encounters that felt a little funky to be honest Um, I couldn't quite put my finger on why I don't know if it was Kind of the toolkit that you have as a player or just the way that the bosses themselves were designed

[00:43:33] But a little funky. I think if I'm gonna have any complaints about combat, it would be in the boss encounter In moments those ones were just I don't think that there was a really memorable boss here

[00:43:46] But like I said, it's easy to kind of give them a pass because it's not super important To what's happening. But yeah, dude that that sag I understand mind play stuff Um at first I was like cool. We get to be a detective

[00:44:00] Right. Um, but they needed that's what you think that's what you think and at the beginning Like when I first doing it was it was cool

[00:44:06] But they needed to let up on the gas I think uh the further you got into the game and they do that because With with allen wake side of the story. So he has something similar

[00:44:17] But instead of like working a case board, he's working like a plot story, right where he has different scenes and um The thing about his side is that like there's he'll he'll discover different scenes for a story that he's writing

[00:44:31] And then he'll discover like different plot moments and you can kind of swap in plot moments on top of different scenes And it will change The reality of the scene and it'll reconfigure the room and passages that were

[00:44:43] You know previously blocked will be opened up to you and stuff I found that to be infinitely more interesting and it had way more staying power than saga anderson's case board Right where the case board was just like

[00:44:55] Crap I can't progress in the story until I managed to pin all the right three by five cards next to the right photos And it just turned into a slog And like I said, it doesn't let up on the gas like you still have to like

[00:45:08] Fill out what sometimes felt like a dozen or so these cards before you could get the right prompts to move on Whereas with the allen wake side of things at most you had was four different plot points per scene

[00:45:18] If you if you felt stuck you just cycle through all four real quickly And then you find the one that was that makes the most sense But so yeah unevenness for sure. I think in those cases unfortunately

[00:45:31] But otherwise like I like it wasn't too big of an impediment for me Yeah, I agree. There's also puzzle solving. I don't think there's anything like crazy innovative here. There's um You know find the fuse

[00:45:44] Turn the power back find a fuse look at symbols on the ground and then match them to like a lock There's a lot of those. Um Those are fine. I don't have any issue with them

[00:45:55] I think that it does hit a point where that's like, um doing this again And then you just kind of look it up on your phone because you want to keep going right?

[00:46:01] That's that like that's what I do. That's the biggest problem. I think with like games like allen wake 2 Where the narrative is so strong and interesting There there comes a certain point where the mechanics simply Cannot impede your progress. Otherwise it gets a frustrating

[00:46:18] And I think for the most part allen wake 2 succeeds the mechanics like you said like the puzzle solving and stuff and Navigating flooded basements and creepy forests and whatever the locale is right The stuff isn't really hard and it's not like things are hidden

[00:46:33] Like super in weird and obscure places But if you hit a snag it hurts more than than it should or than it would in other games Yeah, I think it edges on the border of Like gameplay being

[00:46:53] An obstacle to just get to the next part of the story Where you're almost like can I just watch a tv series about this instead? Yeah, and that's like the borderline. That's might be my biggest criticism of this game is that I did find myself feeling that way

[00:47:10] In certain parts of the game Not always but definitely in certain parts. I'm like, okay Like just can we just get to the next part? Like I don't want to run back to this area and like solve this other puzzle grab a fuse

[00:47:22] Blah blah blah blah, you know what I'm saying? It just didn't it didn't do quite enough for me in the mechanical area Yeah, it is very par for the course I think when it comes to the mechanics in my experience

[00:47:34] It sounds like I ran into probably less snags than you did The biggest ones I got were towards the end of the game with saga anderson's case board A part of me was like, okay, please. Don't make me place a dozen three by five cards right now

[00:47:46] Like that's not what I want to be doing. I want like especially when you're deep into the game It's like no, I I just want to continue at this point, right? Um

[00:47:56] But yeah with alan wake side of things the the last sort of section you do with him This isn't like a big spoiler, but it's less

[00:48:03] It's actually much less than some of the preview sections and I was like, oh my gosh. Why didn't you do this with saga side? Then I think they would have nailed the pacing throughout the entire game. Um, but yeah

[00:48:14] Mechanics, I mean there's inventory management, but I actually found Extra inventory pouches quite easily. I was actually shocked. I thought I was gonna have to do way more inventory management Then I ended up having to do

[00:48:27] Because I had plenty of space and then in each of the sort of safe houses You could there's like a shoebox where you can put extra stuff And so I was never sure on supplies now bear in mind most of the time I played this game on story

[00:48:41] I did play on normal for a little bit Um, which I found that enemies to become too much of a bullet sponges So I went back to story and it was way more fun that way for me

[00:48:50] But anyway, I didn't have that shortage so mechanically. I think everything was fluid But when it wasn't you realized how Mechanics were the weakest section of this game. Let's talk about gameplay loop. Um This game is set in like distinct chapters. Yeah

[00:49:10] So it's it's sort of an interesting gameplay loop I think there's so you have distinct chapters, but then you have two different protagonists You can switch between them by going to Basically like a room and then you can switch realities, right?

[00:49:26] So I believe you can even stop like midway through a section with one character and like switch whenever you want Yeah Sort of Um, which I don't know why you would do that because like when you're in the because the game is in chapters You're like, okay

[00:49:41] I'm gonna stick with this person to like get to the next chapter and then switch to the other person right uh And then at the end of the chapter there's these like insane music videos that are like pretty wild

[00:49:52] Or like not music videos, but like play this like soundtrack that is like It's dude. I loved it. It was so weird. Yeah Yeah, it's super like out of nowhere. Anyway, so it's parts in the chapters. I think

[00:50:07] There's there's usually like some sort of calm. It's it's like tv episodes Like there's always some sort of reveal or some sort of like accomplishment or thing that happens like at the end of each chapter yeah typically there'll be like a boss fight like jake mentioned although

[00:50:22] Boss fight like it's not always fun because you just kind of want to know what happens, but Yeah, that's that's sort of the loop. Yeah, what I would add to this gameplay loop is I actually feel like

[00:50:33] The alan wakeside was a little more defined than the saga anderson side, which I think I actually kind of liked that they had different types of Pacings just because there are different stories that needed to be told differently

[00:50:46] Right and so I kind of like that the game wasn't so like Cut and dry or have such obvious cycles Like I feel like they did a really good job good job planning the pacing of like, okay

[00:50:55] Well, this needs to happen for alan or this needs to happen for saga So it needs to take this much time or this little time But essentially like for alan side um

[00:51:05] You would do like what felt like a mini dungeon and then you would do like a dungeon And then you would do like a narrative section and then repeat right up up until like you're you're done with the game

[00:51:16] For saga side because the goal was I feel like to make it a little more detective like It wasn't quite so clear. It was much more like You would traverse a specific area You gather clues in a specific area once you've

[00:51:32] You know unlocked or deduced the correct thing on the case board Then you would move to the next section and kind of repeat So I did like that. I thought that was good, but dude

[00:51:43] I am I don't think I liked actually I know I didn't like the fact that you could kind of switch between saga and alan's story willy-nilly Um, it kind of felt pointless to me to be honest

[00:51:58] Uh, I understand that it gives some like openness to and it gives a little more agency to the player Like if you're really into an alan story is doing you can just kind of keep going through it um Instead of going back to sagas or vice versa

[00:52:11] And so I think I am a bit of an outlier. I think for the majority of players are gonna like that like oh man I'm really into what saga is doing right now. I'm just going to keep going with her storyline right now

[00:52:20] Um, I kind of wish that the game was just linear and was just like, you know what? Okay, you've accomplished the saga anderson section now. You're going to do an alan wake section mainly because it was really hard to gauge

[00:52:31] Where I was at in the story because these two stories interconnect, you know, and so If you go if hard on saga side, you're going to get a bunch of information that um, doesn't exactly spoil but

[00:52:46] I don't know you you can I guess it does help you predict in a sort of way like where the the other side of the story is going to go So I don't know. I think for a lot of players this is going to be fantastic

[00:52:57] I think for me, I would have liked a little more cohesion. I wish remedy would have just made that choice for me I agree guide me by the hand. Don't give me freedom

[00:53:07] This game like I think it would have been fine. Like make it more like make a more streamlined make a more linear I don't think people yeah, I I agree tell the story in the way that you want to talk because it's a very complicated story

[00:53:19] Like you got to show me in my opinion. You got to kind of show me how you want me to see it unravel I think yeah, just take me through the story that you've crafted for me

[00:53:28] Was definitely what I wanted here. Jake. Let's talk about the impact on the industry Remedy does it. I think like nobody else does. I think they sort of do their own thing

[00:53:42] They do unique interesting weird stuff and they use a lot of different like visual mediums to do so There's a lot of interesting music. There's a lot of interesting things they do with voice acting

[00:53:54] There's a lot of like jump scares and like interstitials they throw in and like Weird crazy visuals and they really push the visual super hard. It's a technological This is maybe one of the best-looking game definitely one of the best-looking games of the year for sure

[00:54:11] Lots of ray traced lighting and like all that sort of stuff They're pushing the envelope. I think in a lot of ways maybe except for mechanics. Yeah, which again, they're just going back to And yeah, I'm not sure if this

[00:54:26] It'll be interesting to see like how well this does financially. I think because it was so critically acclaimed I think it'll do well well enough for the studio

[00:54:35] I don't know that it's going to it's not going to be the game that like every parent buys for their kid or every And I don't think it's for everybody to be honest. I do think people are gonna buy it because of how critically it ranks Um

[00:54:52] But yeah, I don't know what the impact on the industry is going to be I actually don't know if it'll have like that crazy of an impact because it's really so much so much its own thing

[00:55:02] And I don't think that's a bad thing at all. Right, but I just think this is just what the studio does and I just think they do it like nobody else really Can or or wants to I don't know. Yeah, I would say I'll unweigh to like

[00:55:16] If you want to make a game that's hyper realistic, please look at this game's environments and please look at this game's characters Obviously, it's not pure realism because it's supernatural and all all that but like

[00:55:29] I I kind of believe that Alan wake 2 should be the standard for ps5 xbox series xs game Like if you want to go hyper realistic in your triple a budget your game's got like alan wake 2 Like that should be your goal

[00:55:43] Make it look like alan wake 2 does this game looks phenomenal and I switched back and forth between quality and performance mode I preferred performance mode because 60 frames is way smoother than 30, but like

[00:55:56] I think that this is this should be the goal to me. This is a standard right if you are triple a hyper realism You have to look at this game Now this alan wake 2 Is an amazing game And it is deeply tied into the remedy connected universe

[00:56:15] And I don't think remedy has this problem, but they could have the same problem that the mcu has Which is wait what games do I need to play in order to understand this game that i'm about to play You know what I mean? So like

[00:56:30] I feel like alan wake 2 you have to you have to do homework before you play this game and that is Going to deter some people from from playing this game now

[00:56:43] I think it like getting all these accolades and and high praise is still going to help people buy the game but it It would just be ashamed for the for remedy to paint themselves into a corner here because we know control 2

[00:56:58] Is in the same universe in that it's down the pipeline. We know alan wake 2 is dlc coming And um, there's a whole lot of speculation in terms of what remedy can produce next within the same universe, right?

[00:57:09] And so alan wake 2 needs to function as a way for onboarding into this universe And that's risky. You can hear the hesitation in my voice like as much as I love this sure I'm bought in and I'm a fan, but how do you get like you're saying like

[00:57:25] alan wake 2 might Still feel a bit too niche because it is so deeply tied into this remedy universe um That might inhibit like how many people get into it It's almost I would say alan wake 2 Would have been remedy's Elden ring moment

[00:57:47] Except that it's a sequel so deeply tied into Uh a specific universe, you know what I mean? Like if it had been a brand new ip and it had been this good and received this much attention It would have been random remedies elden ring moment

[00:58:00] They make a specific type of game and they made one that broke records, but it isn't that one for them Yeah, and I don't think it has to be right. It doesn't need to do that Uh

[00:58:13] You know, it's always fun or cool when a game does do that like boulders gate 3. Yeah, right? I think did that um But you know boulders gate for even how quote-unquote niche people thought a turn-based rpg was you know

[00:58:30] People love like fantasy right and they loved what that game was putting out and then you know, it got all the critical claim and so it's Yeah, that's true. Um No, but it's it doesn't need to and I think remedy probably likes it that way, right?

[00:58:43] It's like you want to be successful, but maybe not too successful because then it was like too mainstream Uh, I don't know. I feel like there's probably like the people Uh, what's his name? Who's the creator over there? Sam?

[00:58:54] Sam like yeah, he's kind of a weirdo. I bet he he doesn't Yeah, exactly Yeah, I don't like to yeah Jake any other thoughts on this game I mean just to continue that final thought there like

[00:59:12] What I would love to see is like triple of games take some risks and make stuff weird like Really go out there and with with multimedia stuff like really push what this medium can do

[00:59:24] Um, and I just love how Alan wake 2 just really went hard on what the video game medium can accomplish Um, it's not you know, just a carbon copy of cinema

[00:59:37] But you interact with it, but it's incorporating like cinema live action moments in interesting ways and I just think like I just think that um that sort of aspect of this game people

[00:59:48] There is a market for weird and I think Alan wake 2 is is proof of that absolutely Um, so I would you know, I'm obviously looking forward to whatever remedy comes up with next

[00:59:59] I think they're going to do something phenomenal. I do think that they're in this really unique position, right? Where they're not beholden to anybody But they have now budget and prestige and you know

[01:00:12] Reputation to kind of put out these bigger and bolder things and I just love that and I And I wish that there was a way that I could trace right like that sort of path to success and unique identity that remedy has

[01:00:25] For other studios as well. Like I think it's totally possible And maybe that's maybe the biggest impact of remedy is just that like hey It is possible to make a studio that is just big and bold and weird and successful, you know what I mean like

[01:00:39] Um, so yeah, that's that's what I'm really hoping for um in the industry More stuff like that Well, Jake, this has been ladies and gentlemen. This has been our episode on Alan awake 2 Uh again one of the best games of the year

[01:00:58] Uh nominated for a game of the year at the game awards. We will see we will see what happens next week That's right. Will it take the crown? Dude, it's a no it won't because it's up against boulders gate 3 um

[01:01:14] If you enjoyed this episode, please be sure to leave a review Please leave a review. That's how people find this show. That's how algorithms work for podcasts. You leave a review You like it and then when people type in video games or they're looking for gaming podcasts

[01:01:29] We show up so if you like it and you want more people to listen to it Please do that on your podcast of choice. You can also support us on patreon.com slash period or cast you can sign up

[01:01:39] For one dollar or five dollars one dollar. That's the tip jar you get access to our early Uh, you get early access to our regular episodes We haven't been doing early access for the last couple. I apologize for those of you sign up for that

[01:01:53] Just because we've had so many episodes. I've been backed up getting them out But we will we will do that soon, uh, so you'll get early access to those But if you sign up with the five dollars here, you are a digital deluxe edition member

[01:02:04] So you'll get the early access you'll get jakes in the impressions You'll get extended editions that we do relatively often talking about various things and any other new Things that work thinking up all the time you will get access to all that at the digital deluxe edition

[01:02:20] So sign up there Find us on twitter slash x at Pre-order cast you can find me at mass generic Jake at jakeup underscore chipped up 18. Thank you so much for listening and have a great night