Are AAA Games Becoming Too Big to Sustain?

Hello everybody, and welcome to the Elder Trolls Gaming Podcast. We are three brothers who get together and talk about gaming. We also talk tech, TV, movies and anything that comes up. Really, I'm your host, John O and with me my two brothers, Nasty Night and dand Off the Wise and to date, I think we're going to have some good conversation here about the future of large scale triple A games. Okay, where they're going, where it's headed. Because recently we heard something, we heard something in the news that might it's not it's not good. Let's say that. Let's say it didn't sound good. Okay, but first, what is up? How are you? How are you doing? It's a trash bag shit day in the Ottawa Valley, rainy and perfect crappy. But I'm not gonna let that get my spirits down. How about you? That's a perfect day for gaming boys that it's true. But I'll be working. I'll be working in the basement after this for like three or four hours and then I'll game. Wow, that sounds gaz You said you were done the basement. No, today, today it's the trims I got. I gotta paint the trims in the window sills. That's pretty much it clean up, and then on Monday we're gonna do one more trim above the closets, finish that up, and then we glue the stairs. Then we're done. Oh you're gluing your stairs on? Yeah, like Mark like home Home alone. He puts the glue on the stairs with the nails, the nail with a big nail for intruders to hold those intruders back. But yeah, we bought this like no nail stuff. But I just tested it out today or tested out last night, and I clamped a piece of flooring to the wood piece that I was testing and it doesn't glue anything. It's like just comes off. Came off this morning. So no name. I heard it was a good brand. No no nail. It's called no Nails, No nails, no name, glue, no no nail, stallion nails, nail Apollo. Oh shit. All right. Other than that, it is definitely raining. I uh, I will probably not be gaming this afternoon though. I've been putting in a lot of work in the studio crunch time because we're getting close here too, having um Nathan come in and sing vocals, which is really exciting because that means like we're on the last leg of this whole thing. Wait okay, yeah, to finish the vocals, to finish recording vocals. We've recorded some and the arrangement is like pretty much done. So I haven't really been doing much other than that. I mean every when it gets crunch time, I feel it. I can feel it down in my plots. Oh I want I want to go see the Mario movie. Oh oh yeah, since last we spoke. Damn it was it was good. I don't see like it was good, Like it's a good movie. Yeah okay, but like I don't like it's made like how much money now, like almost a billion dollars. It's like it's breaking records, I think. I mean it was that good. I mean yeah, it's just it's a Mario movie. So like it's a Mario movie, and it's like this one is going to go see it, obviously. And it's the first animated Mario movie, right, the first one, I think. So it's gonna make money obviously. Yeah, and Nintendo's gonna be like, oh, we've made a billion dollars on this fucking movie or whatever, like time to make a shit ton more Nintendo movies. Yeah, you think is it better than the original with Bob Hoskins and John Luizanna no no way and Dennis Hopper as a terrible no fucking way bowser. I need not so. How many Marios are there? Well, there's Mario, Mario and Luigi Mario. Three that's last. Will get me that rock, Princess, that rock. What was what's your rating for the new Mario movie? Out of ten? Nathaniel like a seven and a half. I'd say, okay, mm it like it moved very fast, like it. I was like, very fast. But what are you gonna do? You gotta keep people's interest, right an hour and a half. You have to keep kids interests. Yeah interested, Everything has to happen, and I mean it still it still didn't work because they were all talking at the theaters. Charlie Day played Luigi right. Yeah, he wasn't as annoying as as he is in like everything else. He's very loud. It's funny though, he's got that funny high register. No, I can't stand that ship. I can't stand him. He's funny. I like him like in Philadelphia. I can't even watch that show because, oh man, well I look forward to seeing it. I don't know if i'll see it in the theater or if it comes out. Oh, it'll looks sick on the old d for sure. Maybe I'll wait then. Well, yeah, I'm not in a hurry. Well, um, let's move it on over to game time. How about that. Welcome to game time. We're going to talk about what we're playing currently. Actually, I watch something recently. You talked about the Maria movie. I think you should have talked about it there, but I'll talk about it here. Fuck it, I actually saw the I watched the Tetris movie. Tetris movie. Um, it was very cool. I would say it was better than the Marria movie for sure. I think of the gentleman guy, guy from the Guy from the Kingsman kan Oh Young. Yeah, but it's more like a biopic, right about the inventor of Tetris. Yeah, and the guy who brought it over to Japan. Okay, okay, it's look some cool nostalgia. It's based obviously in a true story, and there's like some international political intrigue because you know, the inventor was in The guy invented Tetris was in Russia and he worked for the state, right he worked for the government and made he made the game. Um, and then back then you couldn't make any money off of anything that you did. Everyone kind of just made the same thing, right Yeah. Yeah, so like he couldn't really sell it and make money. He It's just a story of the license and how the licensing worked, and everyone wanted to get the license for Tetris, you know what I mean. So that's kind of what it's about. And it's about like the Russian government kind of trying to trying to make deals because the Soviet Union was collapsing, right, and the people kind of want they wanted something, right because they're getting nothing, you know, they wanted to get something out of it. So there's all these different parties who are trying to get the licensing rights, and that's what it's about. And it's about the guy who who's trying to get it and bring it to Japan, like the license for Tetris to Japan. Nice. I would watch that. I was actually interested when I saw the trailer. What year was that? Then? What of that? What year would that have been? Oh? What year was it? Late eighties, late late seventies, early eighties. Oh, there's another one about the pinball Wizard. Did you see that one? No? I think Prime who plays him? Willing to follow wizard? No? No, the trailer looked sweet, so I'll be shot in the dark. Checkout Tetris though, like anyone who's a gamer would like it, and there's lots of cool things in it. There's a cool little Nintendo Nintendo tidbits in there that are that are sweet, and I laughed at nice. Um. I was also playing. I played a game. I saw this game on game Pass. Okay, the artwork caught my eye. The artwork on the post, the poster, Oh my eye. It's called Homestead Arcana. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, that sounds familiar. I might have seen it. It's like it's a cozy game. Yeah yeah. But once I launched it, I launched it up, I spun it up, and the art style was nothing like the thing caught my eye. Right, So I'm just like, ah, this looks kind of shitty. But I played it for like an hour and a bit. Um, it's pretty intriguing. I'll continue to play it. I think it's like, um, you're a you're a witch or wizard. You're a witch. I guess they call you a witch, and it's kind of like in Harvest Moon where you have to go and you take over your uncle's farm or whatever, but it's it's kind of like that, but this the world is being taken over by what's called the Miasma. It's like a dark, kind of weird gas um or energy. And they send out these young witches to um to kind of cultivate land and and send resources back to the to the main city. And I guess this thing has taken over like almost the whole planet, so like there's very little human populations left. And you play one of these witches to cultivate the land and send and do quests and send things back for money and all that stuff. And then I'm guessing there is a there's a story. Um, it's kind of started already. There's a story that kind of alludes to maybe that you can push the miasthma back and maybe you can take back the world back the land. Yeah, so that's kind of I think what it's about. It's now they have to like they have to start adding sort of like a threat to these cozy games a little bit. I'm not sure I like that they're supposed to be cozy Okay, let's be careful with the dark calamities and the threats in these cozy games. It's a half harvest Moon. Maybe it's a half game, half cozy. Yeah. Yeah, I guess it's a half cozy harvest. Stella went down. I think it's fifty percent off of the Nintendo Store right now. Yeah, I guess it would be similar to that. Yeah, yeah, which I almost bought it, but I didn't because I have no money. I have no money left. Okay, I mean I guess, okay, there's no money left, Mica, they there, I think, though, star Do, I like when there's like an option to fight with the danger, right, because star Do, you don't have to fight any thing. There are just beasties out in the wilds, right, pretty sure in the minds, I think, yeah, so that's okay, there's an option. I don't need to fight. I don't want to fight. But if there's something that encroaches on the coziness of the story of the game, you're encroaching on my coach, You're encroaching my coziness. No, that's all for me, though, I mean, other than getting worse at Apex, I'm just getting worse and worse. You're getting older, man, I think that's what it is. I'm just getting worse. The eyes slaying an hour of Coachy game. I love it, don't understand, but um yeah, Well, I've also been playing Harstone Battlegrounds. I had enough of Standard play. I'm no longer playing that shit. I'm going back to Battlegrounds and I got my rating up to five thousand, and I'm justing slower to six thousand. Pretty that. Speaking of Herstone, the Standard, I the Death Night, the Blood. There's a blood build right now. It's so unbelievably ope, Like I can't even get to his face. He just he's got like fifteen board wipes and he just keeps fucking doing them over and over again until I'm out of cards, and he's like there it is, and he doesn't even hit my Like, he doesn't even hit my face, Like he'll just keep clearing board until I'm out of cards, like it's insane, and then he'll just sit there and I can't do anything. It's insane, Bigger. I can't do that in this one because I'm using the Pure Paladin, which is you can't use decks outside of the Paladin class. Or you don't get the bonuses. Yeah, so like I've got these sweet combos in these sweet plays. I'm like, ha ha, deal with that. And he's like pah, like okay, and then I'll put him out, like deal with that because I've got divine shield on and he's like oh, then he does that corpse explosion that never ends and just destroys everything, like three, and then he'll discover more corpse explosions. He's discovers like four corpse explosions to the whole fucking match. I'm like, so right now when STE know it's so fucking stupid and they just came out with a bunch of um nerves and Death Night was not even touched. It wasn't even touched Death Night. I was crazy saying this since I started playing again. Yeah, so now I jump into a match if I see Death Night, it's autoconcede next, because I can beat anything else but Death Night. So I just autoconcede Death Night. Go in. Oh, it's a Maine no problem, rogue, no problem, Death Night autoconcede. So it's like I win too, and then I autoconcede. Isn't bad. Nobody's playing, right, I haven't. They've got this. They've got a cool little like steal rogue thing going on right now. It's fucking annoying. But like, you know, what's annoying is when priest steals your cards. That is so stupid, Like, why is priest stealing my cards? It doesn't make any sense to me. Rogue. I understand he's like a thief, a rogue, but what is a priest stealing my cards for? It's fucking dumb. You're donating it, You're donating as a tithe to the pres Oh, I see it. I was gonna say, I'm still stuck. I'm still stuck at platinum four. I was able to get the four. That's interesting. Do you guys think that? Do you guys think that? Well? I mean, because I don't know. I'm kind of a card player nube. But is that a thing where certain classes shouldn't do certain move types because it doesn't really suit that class? Well, back in the day, they kind of stayed in their lane, right, But now today now it's just like does it even matter what class you choose? No, it doesn't, right, Okay, gotcha? Because everyone can just because everything can, everyone can either discover or steal cards from other classes, so it's like, yeah, there's more cards that you have that happened to me with some fucking I didn't even know what I was playing like a shaman. I was like, how did you get one of my spells? Yeah? I have no idea how it even happened either, and it it fucking totally changed the game and I lost because he did it. I was like, how how did you get that? Where did it come from? You can't steal cards. How did you get a priest's spell? I think like, what, Yeah, I don't know. Maybe nature like he can discover a nature spell which might give him like a Druid spell or something like that. But I don't know how you'd get a holy spell. I have no idea how it learns. And he just buffed. They just buffed that Holy nova? Did you see that? No Holy nova? It was like, what was it? Five mana for a four mana? It's like three manna now or something good. It's so stupid. Why is that stupid? That card was? It used to be five? It was horrible. It was horrible. You guys want to know how I got Breath of Tears of the Kingdom for thirty dollars off. Sure, do we want to know? Is this legal? Yes? Did you do this by legal means? So what I did was I got my wife to drive to Costco. She went to Costco interesting and she saw that they have those Nintendo gift cards one hundred dollars and Nintendo gift cards for ninety dollars. This is all Canadian, Okay, Canadian money. So I got one hundred dollars and Nintendo money for ninety bucks. Okay, so I saved ten bucks there. Okay. Tiers of the Kingdom is the first game that is going to be eighty nine dollars plus techs Canadians, so it's going to come out to one hundred and one dollars like God awarded, right right right, So I've saved ten dollars. I bring it home. And now Nintendo's running that voucher deal thing where you could buy two vouchers where you buy or pre order any games that are on their voucher list, which Tiers of the Kingdom is on their voucher list right now, so you can buy these vouchers. Two vouchers is one hundred and fifty bucks taxes in Okay. So I've already saved ten dollars on that one hundred and fifty because I went to Costco. Right, So I'm at one hundred and forty dollars for two vouchers. That's seventy bucks a piece, taxes in. And so I pre ordered my Tiers of the Kingdom with one voucher, which is worth seventy dollars taxes in. So I saved thirty one dollars on Tiers of the Kingdom, and I have another voucher that I can use to buy any other game on the voucher list. So I'm just gonna wait to see if there's any cool pre orders that are going to come out for seventy dollars value the game on the voucher. So you like, would you have to pay more if it's over seventy dollars or do you just get one game? Yeah? You get one game? Oh okay, Yeah, it's like a ticket. Yeah, it's like, yeah, a ticket. And I might get the Skyward Sword Remaster, which is on the voucher list and that retails at eighty thus tax Yeah, such a joke. Um, Or I might wait for the next I don't know, next Big Nintendo game that might get put on the voucher list, like the pre order. So I'm gonna wait, you have I have three hundred and sixty five days, leave it to Nintendo. Yeah, give us your money. You know what. You don't have to use it right now. But that's that's the best way I found how to save money on Tears of the Kingdom. Just pretty good. But you had to spend an extra seventy dollars. But I'm gonna be buying games no money. You actually spend an extra seventy dollars what wait? What bad? Just like math flying around. I don't know. I will be buying it full price. I guess. Oh, because like I'm gonna need I'm gonna need to do something in Florida. For two weeks, I kind of thought about it, and I was like, oh my god, you're gonna You're gonna be a Florida Man. Hopefully I don't hear the fucking news about yea, hopefully we don't for you. On the Florida Man podcast, Florida his own face, that's Florida Man. Florida Man dropped switch in in swamp goes after it rests alligator. I'll probably bring uh, I'll probably bring Animal Crossing and Breath of the Wild and here's the Kingdom. Just keep me sane. They got instruments there though, I'll do some writing and ship. Speaking of Breath of the Wild, I finished it. Oh m, yes, good, very good, very good game overall. The gann In fight was a bit easy. Took me a couple of tries, but it was fun. It was a fun fight. I I was having fun playing the fight. Well that's good to hear. Yeah, Daniel, did you beat you? Uh? No, I've done. I'm I. All I have to do now is fight him. I beat it before you. Wow. How does that make you feel? Dan? Probably like a giant loser, I would imagine. No, I'm actually unaffected by that. I'm on a phase beat that, and I've been playing more Wild Frost, which I'm fucking obsessed with. Um Me and Aaron from Super Pod Saga are going to do some kind of co op content with it next week, so look out for that. It's gonna be pretty fun. We're gonna try to get through the game together. We're gonna put our two big mushy brains together and co op this bitch wet brains smooth brains. What is hold say it should be mushy and something about Jake's like, oh god, oh I just spun up that new Hanakai Star Rail game. Oh yeah, I keep seeing ads for that. It's like another it's it's another Genshen Impact kind of thing. But the the art, like the the graphics are sick like they're very well done. It looked pretty cool and um, it's locked at sixty fps right now and it's only on PC, so I just cranked the graphics. I'm playing it at five k upskilled resolution like the resolution scale, free to play to play it. That voice acting is not terrible. M it's like not good, but it's not awfully bad good, you know what I mean? So, like I actually kept it on English. Wow, I'll probably check out. I'll probably check out the Japanese and I'll probably stay there. But it's not too bad the English voice acting, Um, the animations, the style, like the art style, the graphics, it's very cool, very cool looking. And it's like a turn based RPG. It's not an action like engine Impact is okay okay, okay, yeah, I haven't played it turn based. Oh no, that's not true. I played Octopath that was the per turn based but that's yeah, it's pretty cool. Oh and I've got it streaming since I can't since you can't get it on the PS five yet already console, I have it streaming down to my PC through an app called Moonlight. Okay, so Moonlight is an app that connects to your video graphics card for the thin for the game stream. But now GameStream is being phased out, so you're not going to have GameStream anymore with the video cards. So there's an app on GitHub called Sunshine which someone has made to replace the GameStream app and it's sick, very nice. So I've got all that hooked up. So I've got a few games that I can stream down to my TV through the Android TV. Great it's an open source yeah awesome. Yeah yeah, And I was playing Star Railed down on my TV and it looked so fucking good and it was playing sixty fps five K streamed down to my TV, like, awesome, it's awesome streaming five K. Yeah, wow, five scale. It's two K resolution on my computer, but it's render resolution in game to five K and then down scaled to four ka. It looks good. It looks all right, Dan, what are you doing? Well, let me start with this. I in light of Jedi Survivor's release, I downloaded Star Wars Jedi Fallen Order played about three hours. I played about three hours to get a feel the graphics, the mechanics and the story. That's one boss right, one boss play. Well, we'll see. I don't know yet. It's not enough to gauge how difficult it really is, but I am really really impressed so far. It's a great old game, that's for sure. The frigging lightsaber and the lights and like Star Wars is just always full of lights, right, the dash lights and all the ships and the consoles and all that stuff. It's really engaging and charming. Like it feels like an uncharted game. But Star Wars, I mean, that's the best way I can put it in terms of it's the way you move and the kind of the level, the mechanics, I guess, the way you move through regions and the map and stuff. They definitely one huge problem I've already seen is they definitely need a frigging auto saving feature. Like, come on, just put auto save in the game. Man, what are you doing? What is the problem with just putting auto save it save in the starts punishing. It's a punishing how do you how do you save? Uh? You have to find meditation spots where you can rest, which responds enemies, and you can right, you can put in your skills in like a your skill tree at the same place. But like if you go freaking, they're so easily missed, if you just caught up in the action and the flow of the map region and then you just die without thinking, oh shit, I didn't have a saved for twenty minutes, and then it just brings you back to the last save point and you're like, oh my god. Yeah, it's just but but but it's not even like those games are hardcore, so you kind of understand it's it's just a Star Wars game, man. But if this game is that's what they wanted to do. Yeah, really, why I'm not getting that. That's why I stopped playing it. Weird, Okay, we'll see, I guess. But anyway, free Yeah it was on game pass Okay, yeah, right, definitely feels like a game I'll keep playing, like I want to pick it a back up again because that's how into the story I was The story is nice and clear, nothing convoluted. It's right there. They tell you what your mission is at the very beginning and whatever. So I want to pick it back up. And so there's that fallen Order Breath of the Wild. Yes, I am close to fighting Gannon. I mean, I could just go do it right now, but I might want to upgrade my gear first, because like I don't really I seem to die a lot, but I have like a lot of hearts, and I've already upgraded my High Rule gear. I want to I want to wear the like the High Rule clothes. I've collected all eighteen memories. Okay, so I did the twelve the twelve Album memories, the four Divine Beast memories, the Master Sword Memory, and the final memory in what I'll call I guess the Guardian Graveyard in High Rule where you learn spoiler alert, where you learn Link actually dies in battle against the Guardians controlled by the Great Calamity, and Zelda has him brought to the Shrine of Resurrection to be restored, the process taking one hundred years at the cost of his memory. I didn't know that. That's why you play these memories right by the Hills Links Memory what the folk am I doing here? That's what happens. Well, we knew he died, didn't we I don't think so. I think that's the memory that reveals it, because I don't remember unless it's been because I played it so long, over so long a time. Maybe they told me before. I don't know. If there you have to do the memories, Well it's the Shrine of Resurrection. You're going to assume that he died and he's going to be resurrected in this too, But I don't know that they tell you that's where you start the game though, I don't know. Anyway, it was news to me in short, so I thought that was really cool and I was like, okay, well that is nice to know because then you're like, oh cool, and you kind of just get a better picture of what like links function was. Anyway, So I've done that. Uh, that's really it just kind of Fallen Order Breath of the Wild prepping to fight Gannon. That's what's next. M hmm. Maybe I'll get Fallen Order or try a get I don't know. Yeah, because he played it a bit right, I remember you being like this is hard, and I think Briscoe my Buddy Matt also said it was very hard, and that's probably why I haven't played it yet. Just put it uneasy, but I might just it. But I just found like, like there was the boss plight. I guess it's a it's a hard one, but there's this giant frog dude, this frog boss when how far in I don't know, I don't know, I don't know, like giant frog creatures last night, and they were harder than the boss. It was a boss like this frog boss dude, Okay, and I might it just the controls were just not good. I found like, like you dodge and you don't dodge, you still get hit like you know what I mean, You never actually dodge, you just roll away and he just goes straight at you where you where you roll to. I just hated it. It was like it was like he was he knew where I was going and he just hit me. Like you have to dodge it the the the very very very last second, yeah, to do anything like and it was just overly hard for no reason. I hate that. If a game is like that, I fucking hate it and I'll not play. Daniel. Since I signed it on your PlayStation, you have all my catalog of games. Speaking of frog Boss, frog Boss, you have my catalog of games on PS five, so you should play Demons Souls. That one very cool and it looks sick, very dark, very very dark. Interesting, but definitely give that a try. After pretty sweet, well, I mean, I said, but for my New Year's resolution on the show, I want to play a little bit more games, and that's what I'm trying to do, even again, even if it's just for a few hours to get the feel of them. But I do want to keep playing this one and hopefully play Survivor because I'm liking the main character. I'm liking the character so far. The voice acting I think is great. The main character looks exactly like Connor mccog oh just cal Kester I think is his name. I find the voice acting in these American games are so good. Like the like the big I like, I like the production, I like the story, I like I was intrigued them like, oh, this is gonna be cool. A Star Wars like adventure that says exactly what at the time, exactly what I wanted to play. Very cool and I was excited to play it until I, you know, experience Okay, I do I have found I'm on I'm playing Jedi Night difficulty, which is like all the sliders or all the meters in the middle, so it's like the balanced challenge. Maybe I should just fucking play it, turn it all left. Yeah, yeah, I know. I don't want to be I don't want to be a hero that'll be a hero mite. I might have to turn it down. I don't know, brig. All right, well should we move on? Yeah, we're gonna do some gaming news. You got anything to talk about it? I got a couple of things. Yeah, all right, let's hit Oh yeah, some gaming news. All right, gaming news? What did you want to talk about? First? We talk about unrecord First, guys, we should talk about on record this new gameplay trailer that came out for I'm talking about five. Everyone's talking about this. Although it's gonna be like the benchmark Unreal Engine five game that's like currently in release. I don't know, have you seen other games that look like that. I'll trick some like camera trickery, you know, camera trickery, and we'll talk effects. I got notes about that. That's what I feel anyways, because like the lens, it's like a fish shy almost looks like an old skate video. The guy with the camera shake, yeah, yeah, let me talk. Okay, let me start with this. Then it's like it's like Lloyd. It's like Lloyd when he tried to shoot that guy and you're horrible shot or horrible shot. Let me start with my notes here because this directly relates to that, I think. So I watched the trailer and I think the coolest thing about that, you know, issue, if you can call it that, uh is it? We'll call it actually, let's call that a practical narrative tool. That's what I have written down here. Okay, they're using in this game. They appear to be using practical narrative tools that allow the game to intrinsically kind of mask the reality that this is in fact a video game. So these include the fishy camera lens that you're talking about, right, the lens distortion, the chromatic aberration around the edges, and the fact that it's like the perspective is really skewed. So it can mask a lot of artifacts or artifacts and you know that graphics may produce and things like that. Also another one, I watched a video, another video of an analysis of it, and this guy brought up a great point. They're using blurred faces for the perpetrators, which is a really cool tool because character faces are probably the hardest to get right with video game graphics, right, so they're usually the first thing to remove us from immersion if they don't look right. But blurred perpetrator faces completely removes that problem. So you're not distracted by Oh that that guy looked a little weird. But that's really cool. I really think like they're pretty far away from you. Yeah, but it but it plays into that you know, you're you're yeh, It doesn't take you out. Yeah, I think it's cool. I think because you've never really seen that. But I don't need to see the guy's face. All I need to do is fucking point at him and shoot him and want to I don't need to be personal I don't need to personalize him. I need to make sure that they're not human. So I thought that those kind of little effects were really cool. Um the sound design too, Did you guys notice this is the really cool sound watched much other than on Twitter, and it's on my phone, so I don't hear. Oh, well, you gotta listen. I was watching and in the studio on my monitors and the EQ curve on the shitty like can't body cam Mike. Um, it has a lot of like low end wrestling. Does it wrestle a lot? Yeah, yeah, because you're running and stuff, which is cool. But the way the audio distorts with the gunfire, it's like, it's that's really cool and it's probably my favorite part, like trailer spikes it. Yeah, I mean it sounds cool and it doesn't like distort like crazy, so it's just annoying. You still hear the gun but like you can tell it's it's all chopped off right with the distortion. Very very cool, and you hear like a lot of that kind of boxy low end um because it's like on you know, it's like you're when you're jumping over sure, it's like when it's like rustling. Really cool, um, which I am looking forward to because I haven't heard anything quite that unique. But you guys, like the aiming in the recoil I thought looked really refreshing. I was like, I can't. I feel like it looked like horrible recoil to me. He's like, no, but that's imagine. I mean, I haven't shot a gun. You guys have You went to Vegas, You went to the Ranges, So I don't know what that's quite like not but to me, cysts are cheese, But to me, glock. That's probably the same gun he's using. Yeah it looks similar. It wasn't similar. I don't sure. But what I did, surprisingly, the triggers are surprisingly hard to press. Do you remember that? Yeah, yeah, it's no, they're not like it's it's it's not easy to pull those. Gotta squeeze. Gott a fucking squeeze. I shot the nineteen eleven cool. It was fucking sick. It was so fucking it would be my choice, crack crack. And then I shot the a the AK forty seven. That shit got so hot, like on the handle because it's just like a wood covering the barrel, right, so like those are so fucking loud, it was. And then I did the swat and I did the swat shotgun. Yeah, that fucking thing kicked my ass, that thing, dude, video, I don't have it anymore. Of our cousin Matt Deech, who was on the on the show a few like Wild Act last year. Um, I have a video of him doing the pump act that Shotgumes at the same shotgun. It's just like he pulls the trigger and the audio disappears yeah from the video, and then comes back and it was like his hair is like blowing back like it was so like concussive. It's just good word, good word, fucking brutal and like the snow sound in the video, but disappears like I couldn't. I couldn't believe how loud even the M four I thought, Yeah, the M four was so loud, Like it was way louder than I thought it would be just playing it. I mean, they're all just loud. They're just now out there, but like more than I thought they would be, you know what I mean. Like I feel the M four was louder than the AK, like it was at which I did not think, hmm, wouldn't. I don't remember that. I just remember the AK burning my hand after like unloading the whole fucking clip into zombie Osama Bin Laden. I shot ah. I think I was shooting aliens like you guys are plucking. You're playing a fucking shooter on like new Grounds was sweet. I shot a glock in an MP five, which is sweet because m F MP five is I used that gun in war Zone like all the time. That's really cool. Yeah, also shot use this gun. But it did jam up on me because she said and she was like, yeah, these guns are shit, that happens to them all the time. I'm like, fuck, But the MP five had no recoil, man nothing. It was just like that could be why they because I think that's like standard issue for a lot of like Navy seal and it would make sense because it's extremely practical that way. I guess, Yeah, it's just I don't know that is cool, but I would definitely start with handguns because I just don't trust myself or the fun guns. I don't know. Anyway, Anyway, we digress. As cool as that is, as fucking awesome as that is, so but I was gonna say but but still the fact remains that the recoil of the firearms firearms looks very refreshing and is guaranteed, at least for me to make this an extremely satisfying game to play. I can just tell when I play it and I start, you know, getting kills and whatever, that that's going to be way cooler than most first persons I played. I think that's the key point here is it looks really unique um and different. My concern with the graphics though, is like, how well is this really gonna run on new gen consoles? You know what I mean? Because like, will it look like this trailer? Will it have to be downgraded? Yeah? For a high frame rate is a huge part of the realism of this game I think is going to be fine. Like the tricks that they're using, it should be wow good and like that that chest cam isn't gonna be one hundred and twenty hurts, you know, It's gonna be sixty hurts at chest cam so they can walk it at sixty fps. Yeah, it might realist thirty even thirty? Yeah, would it chess cam? It's probably sixty. It's like a GoPro probably or something. Yeah, maybe, yea, yeah, that's what That's what I think they're going for. Is that really smooth buttery kind of anyway, I'm excited. Unfortunately, the fanel for for Nasty Nate here, it's not the It will not be out for var Um, at least at least not yet. I don't know if it will in the future, but I don't you can't do it in VR though, because you would be looking through being in VR is not looking through that lens through the camera. Yeah, maybe it's it's holding the gun. It's concutually there, Yeah, like you're seeing what's actually happening, not that effect. Or I saw this a while ago on Twitter. I remember, I'm like, oh, I thought it was I did not think it would be a game eventually, like you know what I thought it was. I thought it was going to be It was just a thing someone did, like that Japanese subway thing, right, That's what I thought it was, because I saw it like a while back, like months ago, and I was like, oh, that's fucked up. But I didn't think it would it was actually becoming a game, right, just so we know for a fact it's actually becoming a game. Yeah yeah, oh yeah, that's what it sounds like. Okay, that's I don't remember the name of the developer or whatever. I'm sure it was mentioned in the videos that I watched, but I have to check it out. It's cool how it has us guessing, like, that's how crazy this stuff looks. You're just like, this won't be a game. It's just like and there's damn too realistic. It's like, what are you talking about? Games have been shut up? I know. I can't stand when people say that I fucking can't too good for this video game. Shut up. The whole point of going back to playing fucking sixteen bits so that I don't have to leave my house. I don't have to go outside. That's the whole point of making video games, so I don't have to go become a police officer and do this myself. Yeah, exactly, I don't have to go to a firing range now, I mean I probably may in the future. Anyway, What about did you have anything for gaming news? Microsoft? An Activision deal got blocked by the Yes, of course, yes, everyone thought this was going to sail through no problems, but nope. So Microsoft is going to try and appeal. But yes, I heard right now it is blocked and Activision will not be swallowed by Microsoft. Sony. Damn it did its job. Hey look at that. Did you guys hear Did you guys hear about these like the clauses in these ten year deals that Microsoft was offering Sony for the call of duty? No, so, so it's like, oh, we'll give you call of Duty for ten years on your platform and all that, but we will take one hundred percent of the sales what and all the profits from any in game sales of like all the profits, so you can have the game to sell consoles, but the game profits and everything sold in the game is coming to us. And Sony was like, no, I'm not gonna do that. WHOA so no wonder Sony said no, just to reiterate, the deal's not going through at all. Is that what you're saying? Correct? Wow? Crazy, it's been blocked. I mean, did I really care? The only thing I really wanted out of this was for Microsoft to make Activision less of a ship bag company, I believe, is what I said on Twitter, Like that's all I really wanted. That was I don't care about Call of Duty. I don't give a shit. I have a PS five, I have a PC. I'm I'm playing Call of Duty on PC. Either way, I don't give a shit. So I'm playing Call of Duty nowhere nowhere. You bought last Call of Duty? Yeah? Never again? Will I end the one before that? You you bought I bought Vanguard. You had Cold War two? You had Cold War two, didn't you? Yes? Yes, you did, you fucking idiot. I still have to beat that one. Did you buy You're just denying buying. I didn't buy the latest one, okay, but what about Modern Warfare twenty nineteen? Did you buy that one? I think you did? You did? You had it on Xbox, Yes, you did, you just didn't have it on PC. Oh I sold it? Yeah, but you bought it three and the last far College Duties. No, I don't play Call of Dude. I don't block College Dude. What was the I keep asking this, I'm never gonna remember Modern Warfare. What was the one that I liked the trailer of with the ships? Since that was the new one, what's what's it call? I'm modern warfare too? Has already been a Modern Warfare too? I don't understand this ship? Yeah, it's just called And I do want to play at MW. I would be interested in playing the campaign. I haven't played it yet. I own it. I haven't played the campaign yet. Oh really. I bought it because I was gonna be like because wars On two point I was coming out, and I was like, Okay, I'll buy it so I can like all the guns because wars On. Because wars On two point has to be better than the first one, right, that's what we were thinking. So I'm sure, and it's not. It's horrible. Wars On two Point is trash and everybody, and they lost a lot of players stream are not playing Call of Duty anymore because this game is just not good. It's not as good as the first one. And they're in season three now, they're still trying to tweak it. So people like, there's a lot to do. I guess it's good. Take all the guys that left, put them in a room and say tell us what we need to do to make this game good, and then give them a list of fucking things to do and get it done. Yeah, because what the thing is there? They have the money. What they did was the the engine, right, They made a unified Call of Duty engine that all the developers are going to use now for whether it's Infinity Ward or who's the other one? Infinity Ward end it starts with an eye, Infinity Ward that starts with an eye, the other one starts with something else then is tra Arc. Yes, okay, so Infinity Ward and Treyer. But they're was gonna be using now the same engine to make their games, okay, so they can all so they can, so it can cohesively integrate with war Zone two. That's that was the idea. But they're starting at zero, right, They're starting at fucking zero and sounds like a good idea. Yeah, the idea was good. But like the thing he created for war Zone is just it was too slow. It's still kind of slow. They increase the movement speed a little bit, um that kind of thing. It's just people just don't like the way it handles. It's very funky, not as fast and snappy as like the last one was, which was sweet in the beginning. And also just bring back for dance and fucking people will play the game. That's all you got to do. That's the original map boom. Anyway, what what the fuck were we talking about? What was I going to say? Oh? Here Microsoft? Oh yes, um, well I want Now that has been blocked, I can pre order Diablo four and not worry about it showing up for discount somewhere on a Microsoft Game Pass bullshit. So I'll be doing that soon, getting two copies of that fucking game. Gonna spend two hundred dollars all right, next Yeah, I don't know if I will will I what? I gotta get two copies out of gets five and I got really, you're buying two copies? Yeah, I'll just play Alma's playing, although it was good on PS five, So there you go. I gotta get two copies. I do have to get two copies. God damn it. Okay, well, uh, we have some more gaming news, but it's actually today's topic. So why don't we head over there? Now? Is it getting too big? That's what she said about Triple A games. That's what she said at the Game Developers Conference last month. There was a roundtable discussion among industry veterans. Okay, now, this is from an article that was a GameRant dot com that I read and it caught my eye and I said, wow, we should talk about this on that bi weekly podcast thing that we do. Okay. So a senior member of Cyberpunk twenty seventy seven's development team, that is to say, Powell Sasko he is. He says that the increasing scope and complexity of Triple A games are making them steadily more expensive and harder to make. Obviously this is not shocking, but it seems that others that were present agreed with him that these big triple A cinematic RPGs may not be long for the world, but may not be long for the world world. I don't understand that they're getting too big. Space long not one word be space. Long for the world means not part, means not destined. H Why couldn't they just say that they are not long for this world because they knew you were reading the article. They're like, let's confuse nasty Nate. They're getting too big, too complex and expensive to be sustainable. He believes there's going to be a crash. He thinks there's going to be a crash. I don't know what that means, but I assume it's just the point in time where no one will make these types of games anymore because of the resources that it requires to do so. So what do you think about that? What do you think about that? Man? Think about they just can't do it anymore. Game can't taste Skyrim and games used to take two to three years to make. It takes a long time. Now it's ten plus years. Do you know how many hours these guys work too? Like, it's crazy. This is the amount years working on an RPG for ten years, like seventy our sixty hour days. Maybe listen, I think that it's like sixty hour days on what planet? Yeah, some kind of time warp, some kind of back paper backlog chamber, just like it just turned the knob. That's slow down. But yeah, you know what it's like, Like this is craziness and a great ambition, the ambition of these projects. You know, they can't they can't match it. Look at Star Citizen. Remember Star Citizen is perfect example of this. Yes, that's a great example. But I think it's important to note that this is with I think this is the case with all video game types though, with the amount of technology, or I should say the progressive height that technology has reached software, hardware or whatever. All games are becoming really expensive to make, I'm sure, and time consuming. What are they going to do? They're gonna start making a shooters that they can finish in six months and that's it. Like they can't do that. I don't think. I don't think there's going to be a massive crash where they can't make triple aarpgs anymore, because personally, I think what will have and is it'll probably plateau where they can only be so much, but maybe that so much is enough for that type of game because personally, and this is coming from the single player, open world RPG enthusiasts like I love these games. It's why a game I don't always need more or more, more, bigger, bigger. I just want a great game. I want a great experience. Starfield will be more than enough. It's bigger than it needs to be. So that's on them. If they have the money, whatever ambition, the ambition, the ambition has to be limited as well. Though yes, Hogwarts Legacy was enough, Cyberpunk was enough, That two was enough, Skyron Oblivion was enough, Like, I don't need more than that. So all probably took a long ass time to me. Did we see how long skyrims are expensive? You know what I mean? But the point is their scope is focused. I think my when I was reading this article is thinking about all this. I was like, I think, if I mean, ultimately, if developers feel like they need to deliver more, humans have been you know, we've been successfully pushing boundaries in our fields and innovating for centuries. So I don't think video games is going to be developed an issue at video game development. I think that they're going to find a way to sustain it. They're going to find a way to do this, and it's got to probably start with a strong sense of scope and direct and quest direction. Like developers can always deliver extremely impressive and immersive RPG games. The question of budget and time is nothing new, you know. Let me just finish this sense here. Developers just need to zero in on their games focus because it doesn't need to be vast and infinite to be great. It just needs it can still be innovative and original while being limited to whatever degree. Okay, well, I have something to say that pertains to exactly what you said now. And you think it's going to be scope and direction related fix like whatever could fix this? Okay, but picture this on my and my mind. In my mind, it's going to be something technologically, something something that is developed, like a like a method or something. Okay, oh okay, interesting, And I'm thinking here, I'm thinking, listen to this, picture this something soon. It's gonna come along. It's gonna come along, whether it be you know, I don't know when, I don't know what it'll be. You know, hardware software. We did we did talk about Unreal Engine five we thought maybe it was going to be that thing that is going to do this like hurl everything into the next air, is what I wanted to say. It's definitely gonna help. But I don't think that's at the magnitude I'm thinking. I'm thinking something bigger, you know, something is gonna come and it's gonna change the way they make games and they can do this stuff make I don't know, that's what I'm saying. It could be a piece of a new piece of software, a new cell technolog being innovative. Yeah, innovative, and it's gonna come and it's gonna maybe solve this and it makes make it easier, make it take less time, you know what I mean. Someone will think of something like yeah, someone will think if it don't think it's obviously this crash could certainly happen. But I don't think it. I don't know. No, I don't think so either. So like the bigger, the better. First of all, I was gonna throw some facts at you. So Skyrim took six years to make, six years six years. Oblivion start in two thousand and two, was released in two thousand and six, so that took four years. Okay, So Oblivion took for Scarum took six, okay, Starfield or what's yeah, what's called Starfield ten years? Okay, Yeah, you see those increments of going up. Now, the more the technology, like, the better the technology, the more artists are gonna want to push it to create. Yeah, right, So the more tools they get, the more freedom they get. It's just it's human nature to push it and push it to the limit. Stars baby, right exactly. So what I was thinking was with Unreal Engine five bringing all this like together, and I think Unreal Engine five will will shave maybe a year of development time just because all the tools are there. It's it's being developed by this company that is giving all these tools in the same spot. They're all like, everyone's going to be using this engine. It's going to help move those games further faster. With all the assets that you can like pour in there and use for multiple projects. If you're using under Engine five for multiple projects at your studio kind of thing, I think that's definitely gonna help. But I think the more technology that comes down the pipe, the more artists are gonna want to use and push that technology. So I think it's just going to keep going and going and going. What they need to do is what Dana was saying is just like you know, bring it, rain it in man a little bit, like you can have an amazing story, amazing graphics, amazing all this. The world doesn't have to be so enormous, Like it doesn't have to be so fucking huge, like Hogwarts did such a great job, Like I found that world was how much did Hogwarts? How long did it take to do? Yeah? It's but the thing is, that's what he's saying. I think he's saying, like these big games, including Cyberpunk, including this, they they he might be reflecting back and saying, oh, this took way too long. This years. Yeah, because five takes five years of your life to work on one project. Like that's a long time. Yeah, And that's what he don't depend on what he s type. Yes they can do it, but yeah, will they continue to Yeah, because they're gonna have just takes too long and it's so expensive, you know what. I like, I wonder how long does like a first person shooter take? In comparison, Let's say, like should we look up a call of duty? Let's say like the latest called come over one every year, man, rearly, yeah, because they're staggered, right, so while one's getting worked on, one's releasing. But then think about but then think about the gravity of those games in comparison, is something monumental like Hogwarts and whatever? These games are fucking breaking ground. Isn't that what they want to do? I mean, who gives a shit about another fucking Call of Duty, another first person shooter unless it's on record being a great example, right, limitation, I know, but I'm saying the idea limitation is where creativity thrives. Right, So if they if they box themselves in and they think, I mean, Starfield is a crazy example because it's like a massive idea, a concept where it's like you can explore these different planets in different worlds. It's gonna be huge. That's kind of on them for taking that on. It depends on the game, I guess the type of game it is, right Like, if it's a game that takes place in one world, then then man like just just rein it in, think about your focus, your story, you know. But bringing it back, CD Projects read made their own engine for Cyberpunk, which probably took That's another thing another handful of years just to do the engine and then start developing the game. Right, is now everyone's gonna switch. Everyone's going to switch to an engine that's already made and that's been out, that's and tested with Fortnite and all that shit. It's going to save quite a bit of time. Because what else did he say? Pa Pavel? Pavel, I don't remember his name, Sasko. He's the I think he's the quest director or whatever. Ce Pretriott. He said that like they had to use techniques to hide things that they weren't. They complete it during cut scenes, like assets in the game that they But the problem with Cyberpunk was that when you're constantly in character perspective, you have to flesh everything out on screen, all animations. So I get that that can definitely be time consuming. But that's the choice they made for narrative, right, So it's like they have to be willing to find that compromise. Okay, what's our narrative going to be? How how are we going to present this story? What's the perspective? You know? So it's all going to be in the inception, or should say the conception. They're just a game game smaller. You think they're going to focus more. Yeah, because I don't think that. I don't think, yeah, I don't think that sacrifices quality in any way or emotion. You know, it might not, but the games may not be as huge anymore. You know. That's what I'm saying, as long as they're great. But what I was thinking of, it's like it's in terms of technology, in terms of something coming that's gonna be like just like oh, yeah, well that just makes this so much easier. Oh, I think Unreal five is going to be that once that you think that's gonna be it? Okay, it could still be, but I'm thinking like, remember like wired internet and phone lines, you have to fucking put your phone lines everywhere. I'm thinking like that to Wi fi, you know, just oh, it's so much easier now Boom, something came out and just like, yeah, you want internet in the basement here, it's called Wi Fi. You just do it like this now. Oh but somebody you think some cutting edge, some cutting edge is gonna streamline there they develop workflow. Yeah, just how how it's done. Maybe in terms of twos could already be in the works. Who how do we know if somebody hasn't thought of something everyone once everyone starts using it, I guess, and learning it to the to the max. Well, Fortnite's the first one, but like, when's the next one coming? And like and the next year. I think there are no Undrell Engine five games out right now, not other than Fortnite. No, I don't believe. So can you verify that? Can you verify that? We'll can you verify it? Well, I'll talk about my my point here. Okay, okay, um, So what Daniel was saying, they took shortcuts. Let's talk about these shortcuts that devs have taken over the years. CUTI cut some time down. So Powell was talking about which or three for example, they would cut to black to hide objects loading in into view, or use camera angles to conceal things that hadn't been fully modeled or animated. And like you said, um, he said that wasn't possible with Cyberpunk, which did not feature any cuts or points where the player was removed from V's head right right, So the player wasn't removed from V's head. Sasko says this made it much more expensive to create the branching narratives. As Dane was saying to that the player expects. So with open sprawling worlds where everyone wants to explore every nook and cranny, I can see how this might not be feasible anymore. Like with open sprawling worlds where everyone wants to explore every nook and cranny, I could see how this might not be feasible anymore. Like when I'm playing Cyberpunk, I want to go into every fucking door I see. Motyrs will actually unlock like a hundred buildings, yeah, you know, and they're like, oh, some doors are now unlocked. Go find them in night City and you're like, oh shit, and you're running around unlocking all these doors. But like, imagine that they unlocked every building and you could go into every building, Like how ridiculous would that be? Right? They have to draw less it would be ridiculous. Yes, because I don't need to go in every building. I do like occasional cool knooks where you're like, oh shit, I wasn't expecting to find that here, and things where they deliberately chose Okay, this is going to be a little secret area the map where the player can go Like, I don't need to fuck go in every room. I wouldn't do that in real life. I mean like hacking doors. I don't go around you're like, yeah, checking people's doors, like get out of air, going to store, like you're going to the back, You're trying to get into the back. What are you in the air? Just like yeah, I don't know. I just don't think that. I don't think it's necessary. We have to we have to accept or zero in on what's necessary. What do we need the fundamental experience? Like what when does it become too much? Too much feature, too much content? Uh, you know, too far, too vast enough. I actually found that about Red Dead two or not when I was playing Red Dead two, Like citizens game is FU, that's a whole other league. Ye forget about When I was playing Red Dead two, I remember thinking like this is just like too much, this is so much like why it is? Why did they include because I don't even remember there being much of a story element to that region of the map. They included like half of the Red Dead one map with Red Dead two, and you didn't even really need to do anything in it. I don't think. It was just this like open space on the map, and I was like, that's I don't need all of that that take to make. Yeah, well I think Hue like that, and that story was so long. Story was really long. It was way I mean, I'm okay with it again, because when you're spending one hundred fucking dollars on a game nowadays, like you're gonna want Okay, Well, that was one of my points, Like, if something comes out to fix this, are the game's gonna get cheaper or they make No, I don't, because then they can put that money to marketing, right, or they can shift it into some other facet of release, something that's gonna make them more proud. We're already let's screw over the gamers. We're already charging them one hundred bucks a game. Why would we lower it? So? Yeah, because then they can make cooler ads for these games. Commercials can become like the nineties again, something like that. Okay, it was Jonathan looking up. We got them to look up the games. Yes, I have them here games using Unreal Engine five. We have this game called Lyra. It came out April fifth, stole it from us. What about TERRELLD. Dower. Yeah, it's not it's not about our Lyra. It's a shooter. It seems a third person shooter game of some kind. Fortnite is using it as of December I think twenty twenty one. The Matrix Awakens not a game, Yeah, it was just we have a Mortal Online two released January twenty five, twenty twenty two. Oh really, developed by Star Vault. Uh it's an MMO RPG that presently uses Unreal Engine. Wait what the fuck it says this is using Unreal Engine four. Oh they just say, oh, they just say it's confirmed that it will move over to Unreal Engine five. Okay, that's so that's not out. Um. And then there's one coming out in May called Ciphius Protocol Syphilis Protocol. Oh I like that one. I played that one in real life. Um, that comes out in May. I Am Jesus Christ prologue apparently was yeah, right, starring Willem Dafoe. Oh wow, that's funny. There's a game called The Bucks that was an upgrade to Unreal Engine five though, Layers of Fear coming out June. Yeah, so November tenth. Yeah so uh so like nothing huge, there's only a hand less than a handful, I would say, But there's some things coming out the year that's that are going to be on an Engine five. So yeah, not a lot of games, not a lot of games, because it's just they're still going. There's that one of the Monkey King looks unreal, and I think that one's coming out late next year. And that one was like the first big unreal Engine five that really looked insane. The Monkey King. I can't remember what it's called, Monkey Simulator, Black Myth Wokong Wu Kong. Yeah, oh yeah, yeah, yeah, I think I know what you're talking about. Yeah, watch watch a trailer for that. It looks insane. Hang on, hang on, hang on. Whoa whoa, whoa whoa. So there's literally no mention of the word monkey in this title. You just you were just winging that. Is that what you're telling The Monkey King and the Chinese Lure? Oh okay, I was like, that is nothing similar to Monkey King. You weren't even on the okay, Black King one more time, Black Myth Wukong gotcha. Yeah, the snow and shit, Yeah, yeah, this is what I was talking about. Yeah, yeah, the Monkey King. He's got his little pole there. Yeah, this is a little fucking yeah. Yeah, yeah it looks sweet. Yeah, this does look cool. He's goku anyway, with that coming. Hold on in a fart, that's a shit game would be another Souls game. Um, so let's let's talk about these shortcuts. Okay, some more. I looked up a few shortcuts that people have used to get the game going, get it, squeeze it out before their release date. So Kotaku had an article where they had interviewed a few developers and asked this question. Charles Randall, who worked on the original Assassin's creed Um, once said the team didn't have the budget to create a special custom skeleton rig for fellow assassin Malik, so when the character loses an arm, it's actually still there, but just inside out. Randall explained that if you clip the camera into his body, you'd likely see a tiny, little scrunched up arm inside the bicep. I'm not sure I'm following. I might need a visual. Can you demonstrate this? Okay, that's weird, that's kind of interesting. That's fascinating though, because I'd ever thought of this. Yeah, just they shrank his arm right to make it look like it was either gone or mangled or something. He don't like people in games don't think about this, right if he were not game developers, So another ac one hack involves the game's horses. Randall explained that the horse in the game, or the horses in the game were created out of a twisted, quote unquote twisted fucked up digital human skeleton rigs because at the time the team's tech only worked properly with bipeds. Oh, so to make a horse like mangled up a human skeleton and then develop the horses over that, like like this, like it's insane, it's crazy stuff. Here's one more so there's a tweet by dark Table. He says worked at a place where the engineers wouldn't give the designers times or timers to delay or sequence stuff. But designers did have falling physics objects and collision events. So designers would just drop boxes off screen from varying heights and trigger events off the collisions of those objects. So they would like use the object that falls off a cliff to trigger something because they didn't have timers to yeah, and the other pieces or objects would use that calculation when it hits the ground to then start an animation or something like that because they didn't they didn't have timers or they didn't have time to create the timers that do that without having to drop the objects. There's so much crazy little tiny world events. Yeah, game events. The things they spawn like a box and drop it from the sky at a varying height and they know it's going to take this would be time to hit. Yeah, that interesting based on the physics, and whenever it does, that's when you triggered this event. Yeah. Yeah, So the collision of the box in the ground is going to happen at zero at whatever time because we know the physics and it's going to take this long for the box to drop. That's fucking weird. So there's Yeah, there's another one. Limitation. Yeah, executives, that's it. I think that's where this is going to end up. This is where it's gonna get. You're but I'm gonna say what I canna say this one last one here? Uh Joe Hobbs another tweet. He's like, without a doubt, the hackiest thing I remembered from Titan Quest is how we managed the event scripting. So more events stuff. It seems to be like these events scripting and timing that a lot of issues arise from the Quest slash event tech had a major weakness and that there was no way to delay an action once it was triggered. So if you wanted something to happen five seconds after a player ran through some bounding volume, there was no way to set a delay. It would always just be instant. Yeah, I could see how that, Like it triggers it as soon as you walk through a doorway or exactly. Yeah, So he says, we were nearing the end of production, so it was hard to request additional features as engineers were slammed was trying to meet their milestone deliverables. One of the QA testers had started helping out with scripting work and figured out that there was in fact a way to delay an action from triggering based on the length of an animation ended up using He ended up using three squirrels we had as ambient creatures as the animation timers, and they became the default timing mechanism. He created an invisible version of the squirrel which we would place in the levels where we needed them, then would time everything based on the duration of their idle animation. Because of his creative problem solving, he was promoted to designer on the next project. Wow. This leads me into another point and what Daniel was saying, where there's limitations. It breeds that creativity, that creative mind to get around those limitations. It happens everywhere. It happens everywhere. Yeah, it doesn't matter what field you're in. Yeah, So whenever you hit a wall, it's got to get done. You've got to figure out a way. And that's whenever the big mushy creative minds they like thrive in that and they find a way Like Apollo thirteen. Yes, exactly what happened in Apolo thirteen. I don't know. They ran out of oxygen or something, yea, and they had to like improvise improvisation, man, And that's what separates humans from monkeys from machines. No machines for us. But yeah, like what do you guys think about that? Well, I think that's That's what I'm saying. They're going to come up with something, they're gonna yeah, yeah, there's gonna be a limitation to that something. There's always gonna be a limitation. Alright, Well, what I said, these are video games. They're not gonna be real life. You can't get real life from video games like that. There has to be an indelible line drawn somewhere for the creation of these games that you can't pass, there's gonna be there's got to be something that said that caps boundaries. It's called the boundaries of the Okay, counterboys, let me let me play Devil's Avocado here. Okay, would it be so bad? Let's discuss this, this crash it happens. Games would be different. They'd be cheaper to make. We already talked about this. Would they be cheaper to buy? Probably not, But you wouldn't have to sink as many hours into gaming to finish games. If they're smaller, you know, they're more focus, they're more limited. You'd be able to play more games, Nathanel, Your gamer fatigue would be lifted from your shoulders. I don't think it'd be more like crushed, more like exacerbated. No, because you could. You feel better about it, though, because you'd finished games more you never you who never finished games. Oh, I see it. I guess. I guess you don't have these huge, daunting games that you feel you have to play for two hundred hours because I spend one hundred dollars on it. It's not a great feeling. See. I loved playing Hogwarts Legacy for forty five hours and then stopping that was perfect for me. It was perfect. Do you guys think that it's it's gamer dependent though, everybody's different, everybody wants a different experience. They're gonna have to accommodate everyone. They're gonna have to please everyone. They can't just make shitty. I'm just making. I'm just playing Devil's advocating, I'm just making. No, I'm just saying, do you guys think that they're gonna have to say at one point? Because obviously they thought of that, they're thinking of that now. Already these developers are thinking, well, how you know what? What what they're the ones the state of the game is going to be. They're the ones who think it's it's going to be too much to consider doing it. So it's like, yeah, okay, yeah, I don't want to do that anymore. Maybe that's what they're thinking. Yeah. Maybe it's like like it takes so much time and cost so much money, Like maybe we might just stop doing that. It's like a it's like a relapse. It's like a de evolution of gaming. Yeah, let's talk about this. So a studio of how many people are in a studio two hundred people, Let's say, yeah, that's a lot, I think. So how many people did Star Citizen have? I think? But that's four hundred people. That's half that's a half a billion dollars. Yeah, that's half a bill. Okay, So say you have two hundred people and you're working on this RPG for ten years. Okay, you guys are gonna have to do some math here. Don't ask chat GPT to do it. The salaries of these people range from let's say forty thousand, two hundred thousand, Okay, an average salary of what, let's say, an average salary of sixty thousand dollars per person sixty thousand times what did I say? Two hundred? Oh god, that's a lot of money. No, that's per year. Put it in how many how many people work at um san Monica, Santa Monica Studios or Rocks? Yeah, one of these big ones? How big is the dev team for a triple A title God of War? God of War? Eight other studios contributed to the development Ragnara, concluding places students created far it's felt creating attainment Blue Point games right now? Fu. Yeah, So it takes a lot of people. So it range from forty at a time, forty people all the way up to four hundred people. Okay, so they said putting a team of three hundred people at work for years, So three hundred people. Kay, how much did God of War costs to make? Two hundred million dollars to make? So let's say three hundred people. Okay, three hundred people at an average sixty thousand dollars salary. Let's just say that, okay, which is like, fuck, that's a lot of money. That's eighteen million a year. Okay. Yeah, Let's say it takes them six years to make it. H Okay, it's one hundred and eight million dollars in the six year plus marketing all that bullshit. Let's say two hundred million dollars to make. Yeah, okay, voice actors, Yeah, all that shit. Two hundred million dollars to make over six years. It's a lot of money. They have to make that money back in sales and then make some fucking money, right. That's why these games have to be groundbreaking spectacles, because you're not going to make that much with the New Call of Duty unless well maybe because people are stupid talking about it was the biggest fucking selling game in the last I guess I'm overestimating, Am I overestimating? Yeah, no, you're underestimating. Underestimating. But it made a billion dollars, didn't it. I think the point still stands though, like people would just want to play Here we Go, Here we Go. I don't know. Eleven million copies God of War as of February twenty twenty three, okay, eleven million times what one hundred dollars Canadian? Sure? Yeah, before attacks ninety bucks one point one billion was sales minus two. It's a billion Canadian so like six hundred seven million. So yeah, it made its money back and more so that'll find another two or three games, right, Like big games like that they can keep making, and they can keep making great sick games. I guess it depends. I'll have to concede on that call of duty thought, because it depends on the studio then, I guess, because if you're just a studio, regular, average, normal studio making you know this kind of it's a cool game, but it's not this massive spectacle triple A thing as long as it It's like these games have to be like home runs almost every time, and I think that's why there's so much time put in them. There's so much money. Again, your exceptions are the Star Citizens because the game isn't even out yet. But I don't know, man, We just we should rename this podcast to the Star Citizen. Wells example, we have guests, right of yeah, of what not to do? Yeah, Well, as a developer, imagine they imagine they drew a line somewhere and finish the fucking game. Right. They'll never happen because they're the ones pushing technology. Yeah, they're just adding more ship. Well exactly, Okay, so there, that's why we keep bring it up because they're not in And I said that, didn't I say that last when we talked about Star Citizen. I said, they just don't They're not focused. They're all over the place. You have to rain it in. And I start thinking about Skull and Bones too, and I'm like, what happened there? I mean, I mean, what didn't they have a focus? I'm sure it was the ideas just pirates, Like how much fucking more could they can sail around the whole Earth? There's the whole Earth, and then you can visit other planets as well with your ship, your pirates. You're Peter pan Fairy desk sale and you can upgrade your ship into a spaceship to spaceship and you become a space pirate. Done. That's good that they just made star Afield, Like, yeah, okay, well that's good. This is a good discussion. Well, I think we'll be okay, is what I'm gonna say. I think me too. I think we're gonna get some some good games, great games, great games that maybe that don't reach I'm hoping too far, I am. I am. I'm hopeful. I am hopeful. Yeah, that's all. I don't think we're gonna I think I think RPG open world single player lovers like me are gonna be just fine. We're always gonna have games that we can play that we love, and we don't need more. That's my stance. I don't need more. Oh. I have a little point here. Remember when Breath of the Wild was first announced for WE You're for that vaguely, and then they delayed it and released it as a launch game for Switch as well as releasing it for WU. Huh. So, now, back to our talk was there was definitely some limitations on these Nintendo hardware right the WU specifically limitations there. I played it on WEIU first. Yeah, it was good, And they finally spoke about why they delayed it, and it was because of the physics engine, because of all the shit that you can do in that world, dropping rocks, boulders at the ships, a lot of physics and breadth of the wild, and that was a big thing. And I tried to see if they had used any hacks or time hacks or like those that Assassin's creed things, but shortcuts, shortcuts. I couldn't find any. But that was the reason why that was delayed. It was because the physics engine. So you don't really know what kind of tricks they used, Nintendo tricks to get that game out, you know, in a I don't think they would ever be dead exactly. Just imagine, just imagine the secrets they have behind how they made Breath of the Wild run and look so well on that shit hardware. Yeah, like like your your design, like your vision, How do I make this game? How do I make an amazing Zelda game with this limitation here? And then you've got to make this path and follow the path and make sure that it keeps going. And you you just got to work around the limitations, and you got to get creative, and they did it, but for Breath of the Wild for sure. And now they took that Breath of the Wild engine and they're making Tears of the Kingdom with it. Right. It's a hugely anticipated game, right, So they're not doing anything innovative in terms of development there, they're just maybe they just we don't well, we don't know, but according to the trailers whatever, So let's say superficially what they aren't. But they are innovating in terms of new features and content into the game, which you can new mechanics, yeah, which you can develop in that engine, and it's already like built for you over the past x amount of years, right, so they know how to do it. They're doing the right thing and staying focused, and they're they're they're making their scope mechanics. Yeah, for in terms of innovating and making new new features and stuff as opposed to development tools and stuff as far as we can see. Yeah, cool, that was it. Yeah, Well there you have it, folks. I think I think it's safe to say we're all agreed that this this shouldn't happen. There's not going to be a crash. Okay, but what do we know, yeah, who cares? Who cares? What we can there will be no Triple A RPG ice age. Maybe there'll be a game about it. There'll be a game about it. Who you listening? You you watching? Do you think there's going to be a crash? As Pavel said, is there going to be a Triple A crash? Let us know in the comments, let us know in a DM, let us know in a tweet. That's it for this week's episode. Thank everyone for coming in, hanging out, and this is a good discussion. I think I think this is this will go over well with the listeners. They're gonna like this one. I think. If you did, let us know, give us a rating, give us a review on Spotify, Apple Podcast, leave a comment, leave a like on the video, and subscribe if you want to hear more. Because we're doing this every other week. We're doing this every week. Send us a DM on Facebook, Instagram. But thanks again, and we hope you have a wonderful day. Peace see ya. Spar flowed to blow the before happ