Geek Addicts - Episode 18: In Memory of Akira Toriyama.

[00:00:00] The following is a GNC Podcast Production. Welcome to Geek Addicts, a pop culture podcast.

[00:00:35] Hey everybody and welcome to Geek Addicts, the pop culture podcast where we spend every

[00:00:45] week talking about different random bullshit. I'm very tired today. I'm Bill, this is Matt,

[00:00:51] how you doing Matt?

[00:00:52] I'm sad.

[00:00:53] Yeah, I know.

[00:00:56] Today was rough for a lot of people.

[00:01:00] Yeah, anyway, what's funny is I earlier in the week, I was just about to come in here,

[00:01:07] roll and talk about, oh, Rooster Teeth are shutting down, blah, blah, blah, yeah, and

[00:01:11] then this happened.

[00:01:12] Yeah, I knew it was going to be a rough morning when I sent you that text and then your response

[00:01:17] was the Rooster Teeth thing and I went, oh, he doesn't know yet.

[00:01:21] Nope, didn't know.

[00:01:24] Yeah, I immediately jumped on the Discord. I was like, maybe that's not what he's talking

[00:01:28] about and I think it's Snicker Minute posted it and I was like, oh, fuck.

[00:01:33] It was posted legit. The first thing I saw was my Discord, I had like 27 notifications

[00:01:41] and I was like, oh no, what happened?

[00:01:44] Yeah, that's never a good sign.

[00:01:46] And like three different group chats I'm in all posted it plus every server I'm in imaginable.

[00:01:54] So I was just like, I was like, shit, this is not how I wanted to end my week.

[00:02:00] Nope.

[00:02:02] So in a state we should probably specify in case anyone's wondering that didn't read the title of this episode.

[00:02:11] Unfortunately last night we lost Akira Toriyama.

[00:02:16] It's 68 years old, way too young.

[00:02:19] Yeah, I was like, what was it? A brain hemorrhage?

[00:02:23] Yeah, it was something I thought it was either brain or heart.

[00:02:27] I have to reread the thing that brain aneurysms something like that.

[00:02:33] Yeah, it was one of those things that it was like very shocking.

[00:02:36] It just kind of came out of nowhere because like no one heard anything bad about him as far as we knew.

[00:02:43] No, it was definitely one of those kinds of very sudden, you know, no build up to it.

[00:02:50] It's not like how it's going to be with Takashi because he's been consistently ill for like a decade or more.

[00:02:58] You know, everyone's been waiting for that one. No one expected Toriyama.

[00:03:03] So it was an acute subdural hematoma,

[00:03:10] which I'm not exactly sure what that is, but it doesn't sound pleasant.

[00:03:15] A big thing I just noticed though reading the press release, he apparently passed away on March 1st and we didn't find out about it until yesterday.

[00:03:24] Well, I'm sure they wanted to keep it quiet, you know, let the family have their service and everything.

[00:03:30] They didn't want a bunch of people bombarding them.

[00:03:33] Yeah, it's just amazing. I mean, it didn't leak honestly just with how easily everything just completely leaks and gets found out nowadays.

[00:03:42] Normally I would be but with House occluded and honestly isolationist Toriyama has always been true.

[00:03:52] He's always been a very private person. So I mean, I can see that.

[00:03:58] I do find interesting though because he is one of the few like manga artists that we actually know what he looks like.

[00:04:04] Yeah, right?

[00:04:05] Because like most of them they don't even they've like still are like have their faces hidden and we don't even know like it's really only the old guard like Toriyama.

[00:04:16] Like you've seen pictures of like Rameko Takahashi, like there's a few out there that we know like what they look like.

[00:04:22] So it's very interesting though that like they all are still very private like that.

[00:04:27] Yeah, Toriyama was the introvert that we all should strive to be.

[00:04:32] Yeah.

[00:04:34] Also he was like a self admitted like my favorite part of Toriyama was how he would just like dump on himself all the time for his like doorcomings which and he was perfectly honest about it.

[00:04:47] Yeah, perfectly comfortable with it too. We just did not care.

[00:04:51] Like I mean his famous quote about he only knows how to draw like four faces and damn right he does but we still liked it.

[00:04:57] Yeah.

[00:04:59] He also apparently could never he didn't know how to make a compelling romance yet he made some of the most longest running couples in the anime.

[00:05:08] Yeah.

[00:05:11] Like I don't know it's hard to really decide which one you think would be more whether it be a I'd say it's probably a tie between Krillin 18 and Gohan and Fidel.

[00:05:26] I mean he's got those two I mean help Bulma Vegeta Goku Chi Chi they're still going strong.

[00:05:33] Yeah, the Goku Chi Chi was kind of just like a hey I guess we're getting married so let's do it.

[00:05:41] Yeah, I think I think some people online like to look way too deep into the Goku Chi Chi relationship.

[00:05:47] It's like guys the manga you don't have to look that seriously into it.

[00:05:52] Yeah.

[00:05:55] You know what you know it's really kind of eerie and kind of sad and hindsight.

[00:06:00] What's that?

[00:06:01] Last night I actually drove out to like there's a comic shop.

[00:06:07] So in Massachusetts they have they have a comic shop called the Newbury comics.

[00:06:13] They're not very common outside of like New England area from what I've read but there's one near me that's like 30 minutes away.

[00:06:21] I actually drove out because I last night I was I've been trying to complete the Dragon Ball like series like all the bigs and volume six has been hard to find it's not imprinted at the moment I guess.

[00:06:36] And there is a Newbury near me that had a copy of it so I actually drove out like I just had like this like.

[00:06:43] I don't know what it was but something was like I need to go pick this up tomorrow like I don't know why I need to just go do it.

[00:06:49] So I went out and grabbed volume six and while I was there they had seven eight and nine as well so I just was I said fuck it I'm just going to finish Dragon Ball.

[00:06:57] Yeah, they also had a copy of spy family chapter volume 11 which isn't supposed to be out for two weeks so I grabbed that anyways.

[00:07:04] Fair enough. I was a Walmart earlier and I was keeping an eye out for it because they usually have spy family but some reason that we didn't even have one or 10 which is once you usually have.

[00:07:15] Yeah, well 11's not supposed to be out till the 19th. The fact that it was on the shelf I just thought was funny.

[00:07:21] Yeah, apparently nobody cares about release dates.

[00:07:24] No, they really don't.

[00:07:27] It was fun. It was interesting though I went out and grabbed those and I completed my Dragon Ball collection.

[00:07:33] I was expecting today we were going to talk about Dragon Ball and everything.

[00:07:37] I was going to talk about finishing that but then I woke up this morning it was like oh damn.

[00:07:43] Yeah, yeah that's the ironic thing is we were actually already planning on doing a Dragon Ball eccentric episode.

[00:07:50] We had like two in a row planned.

[00:07:52] Yeah, that's true.

[00:07:54] We had two in a row but yeah it's crazy.

[00:08:00] You know it's also I've noticed right away that now that he's passed away you're already seeing like anything he was involved with is starting to spike up in price.

[00:08:11] It's sold out everywhere.

[00:08:13] I believe it and a lot of that stuff was already super expensive.

[00:08:16] I get like with the exception of like newer releases like Dragon Quest 11 or stuff that's been released digitally like the original three Dragon Quests like everything else is already pretty high priced you know that's why I that's why I have a digital version of Chrono trigger because there was no way I was going to get a physical copy.

[00:08:39] Well, Chrono Triggers already was always expensive as shit.

[00:08:43] I mean, I don't know if it's actually but I noticed it because there's a Dragon Ball art book that I've noticed has been on the shelves for a while now and I've been meaning to pick it up but I think it's one of those like art books are always like $20 to $30 so I'm always kind of like yeah I don't need it.

[00:09:00] I went into Barnes & Noble today just out of curiosity to see if it was there and the entire Dragon Ball section was freaking wiped.

[00:09:08] I was like, damn, like people are quick.

[00:09:11] I believe it.

[00:09:13] Is that some is that the visual history or whatever?

[00:09:17] Yeah, that's actually that's actually the first of the Dysentium.

[00:09:24] It was the only one they ever actually translated and brought over here, but the Dysentium was the tenu and there's no is like the big encyclopedia of Dragon Ball that came out in Japan.

[00:09:38] Well, it was a multi a multi book series I want to say that started in the 80s like the late 80s, early 90s something like that.

[00:09:49] But it was just like this big thing we just like a bunch of facts and stuff that Toriyama had helped to put together.

[00:09:58] What's all about your art?

[00:10:00] Well, that's the thing is like each book had its own specific thing that it was based around the first one was like artwork.

[00:10:10] Some of them are about the animation, some of them are about like specific characters or whatever.

[00:10:19] So I will say though, I had I picked this up months like actually about a year ago, but I do still own this one.

[00:10:28] I'm kind of glad I grabbed it when I did because it's also hard to find now.

[00:10:31] I have a Dragon Quest illustrations book.

[00:10:36] Nice that I picked up a couple years ago when I saw it.

[00:10:41] Because I was thinking about this now everybody's obviously talking about Dragon Ball, which fair enough.

[00:10:47] But to me, I think the bigger loss in a lot of ways is Dragon Quest.

[00:10:55] That series is fascinating to me because when you really think about it, that series up until very recently since its inception has had the same core like team basically keeping it afloat with like Uji Hori as like the main writer and architect for the series.

[00:11:17] Akira Toriyama is the artist and then I always forget the composer's name he composed all the games up to 11 as well.

[00:11:26] And the composer had passed away a few years ago so it was already Trinity had already kind of started falling apart with Toriyama gun now.

[00:11:37] I don't even know what the future of Dragon Quest is going to be.

[00:11:41] Yeah, I mean the bright side with Dragon Quest is they've been reusing monster designs and stuff for years.

[00:11:46] So they still have that huge pool of designs to pull from for future games and any new stuff.

[00:11:56] I mean they could either try to find somebody new they can try to find they could pull Toyotaro for it.

[00:12:03] True.

[00:12:06] Yeah, because I was thinking about it like Daima was in production still I'm assuming at this point wasn't Toriyama pretty involved with it.

[00:12:15] He was very heavily involved and was going to continue to be which is a super bomber because who knows what's going to happen with that now.

[00:12:25] I mean I'm sure it'll still come out but it's not going to take the same shape it was going to probably not.

[00:12:33] Now with the super manga I know hasn't it basically been subtly but not officially confirmed that he's been kind of it even though it's credited to him it's technically been like ghost written for a while now.

[00:12:48] Well Toriyama has been still been like from from what I understand pretty much throughout the entire super run for both animation and manga wise.

[00:13:04] He's basically just been kind of writing basic outlines for plot and that's why the anime and the manga are so different is because he just kind of gives a basic outline of what he wants.

[00:13:17] So that's why there are certain elements in both versions that are the same and then otherwise they're wildly different.

[00:13:25] Yeah, for example, the like infinite Zamasu and the goku black arc like happens very differently in between the manga and anime but it's ultimately defeated in the same way.

[00:13:39] Gotcha.

[00:13:41] So it's just one of those kind of weird things where he was involved and he was helping with the story and with certain things because obviously Toyotaro was still learning under him.

[00:13:57] So you know Toyotaro was still drawing. It was still drawing the manga but Toriyama would kind of like guide him like make some corrections to his art to make it more Dragon Ball style, you know stuff like that.

[00:14:14] You'll see some stuff like that in the back of some of the volumes of Dragon Ball Super. You know, show like Toyotaro's original attempt at the design and then show the changes Toriyama told him to make to it to make it a little bit more dynamic.

[00:14:28] Yeah. Okay, that's understandable. Now because I had people have been wondering what the future of Super is going to be. I just assumed like it's going to probably continue on because I assume they already had so much of it laid out.

[00:14:41] Yeah, I think at this point Dragon Ball is just not good. It's just never going to die. Dragon Ball will probably outlive us all.

[00:14:47] Yeah.

[00:14:49] I'm assuming then that like Toyotaro is probably going to take over just officially at some point.

[00:14:55] I don't think it's completely official to my knowledge but I think as far as writing and drawing for the most part is going to be Toyotaro but I think Toriyama's son inherited it all.

[00:15:13] So I think it's probably going to be Sasuke Toriyama and Toyotaro working together going forward.

[00:15:20] Yeah.

[00:15:22] That's just an assumption we don't know 100% yet.

[00:15:27] Yeah, it's crazy. I still can't get over he was only 68.

[00:15:32] Yeah. It wasn't even in his 70s and he got like so many people who were in there, you know, friggin Masakono's hour is still going strong screaming her lungs off.

[00:15:43] Yeah. Have you seen all of her tributes she's been putting out?

[00:15:47] And Oda.

[00:15:50] Kishimoto.

[00:15:51] Kishimoto, yeah.

[00:15:53] Yeah, I think it's completely all of the big pretty much everybody in the industry like even like PlayStation made a post about it.

[00:16:01] Time magazine.

[00:16:04] I mean he's probably like the most influential anime artist ever at this point.

[00:16:11] Yeah, pretty much.

[00:16:13] It's a debatable topic because when it comes to anime over here, it was pretty much Dragon Ball that really kind of pushed it through the barrier initially.

[00:16:23] Yeah, I mean there was some stuff beforehand.

[00:16:26] But Dragon Ball was the thing that really put it up a guy.

[00:16:30] Like I mean you can make an argument for Pokemon but I mean that was very clearly for children with Pokemon though the majority people didn't even realize it was an anime.

[00:16:40] True.

[00:16:42] And the real one that I could say is close is maybe Sailor Moon.

[00:16:48] Yeah, but that's that's like the show Joe side of it though.

[00:16:52] Yeah, those were the big two though that I remember and like Dragon Ball was definitely the one that had the longest like staying power because like there's a reason why you got brought back so many times.

[00:17:04] For sure. And then we got you know Sand Land is getting all this all this attention now they had the movie the movies kind of get getting pretty much a series adaptation now.

[00:17:18] And I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that that Sand Land actually got a second arc written for it by Toriyama.

[00:17:29] And that's going to be like the second arc of this series, which is pretty cool to hear that there's going to be more Sand Land.

[00:17:40] I'm definitely even more so going to make playing the game a priority when that comes out.

[00:17:46] Yeah.

[00:17:47] That's for sure there's that there.

[00:17:51] I just thought it was insane just like the amount of things he worked on like Dragon Quest, freaking dragon, Chrono Trigger.

[00:18:00] So many games all of these incredibly iconics looks to them.

[00:18:05] Yeah, for sure.

[00:18:08] Like I still think the cast of Dragon Quest four is probably my favorite thing he ever created.

[00:18:15] As far as the video games from the ones I've played so far, I think I don't know I really like Dragon Quest three.

[00:18:23] I really liked the whole three four and five all had such great characters of stories.

[00:18:31] I just like for because for gave us so many memorable ones like the hero that the dancers a Tornico how can anyone forget Tornico.

[00:18:40] Yeah, right.

[00:18:42] I was like an entire chapter just running a store just because it why not.

[00:18:47] That was actually one of the most entertaining parts of the game for me.

[00:18:50] I was like this is kind of awesome.

[00:18:52] I love the fact that you go on an entire mission just like build your store and then you just spend an entire chapter running said store until the other party members show up.

[00:19:02] Yeah.

[00:19:05] But yeah, I think I think this is pretty much cemented that because I literally finished playing Final Fantasy two today.

[00:19:15] Finally, and I think you know this is probably going to push me to finally playing Chrono Trigger.

[00:19:24] That's gonna be my next game.

[00:19:26] Chrono Trigger so good.

[00:19:28] I've had it on my beat it for over a year, maybe even two years now and I just haven't got because I've been putting so much time and effort into Dragon Quest to find a fantasy and then there's all the other games that I wanted to play.

[00:19:41] Yeah, I just kept putting it off.

[00:19:45] Yeah, Chrono Trigger not only has his art but also just like one of the most interesting and unique stories in an RPG with the whole time travel thing plus the battle system which is like an interesting evolution of the classic Final Fantasy battle system but it's also full unique in its own way.

[00:20:05] You'll definitely enjoy Chrono Trigger that's there's a reason why it's considered one of the greatest RPGs I've ever made.

[00:20:13] Fair enough.

[00:20:16] I love that Chrono is in that final Dragon Ball movie.

[00:20:20] Yeah right.

[00:20:22] At least out of the classic ones.

[00:20:24] Yeah, rather the dragons.

[00:20:27] And then I don't know, Granola has it very, I mean I know I haven't played Chrono Trigger yet but I have a general idea of the aesthetic in Granola. It looks very Chrono Trigger.

[00:20:38] Yeah.

[00:20:40] Which I was actually thinking about reading the Granola Arc because recently the final volume for that dropped over here so.

[00:20:50] Volume 20.

[00:20:52] Yeah.

[00:20:54] I gotta start. I gotta finally sit down and read most of Dragon Ball Super.

[00:20:59] Yeah. I know we were talking about doing episodes on it and stuff but now I almost, part of me almost wants to kind of do what we've been doing with the Pokemon one but with the Dragon Ball manga to start from the very beginning.

[00:21:12] Yeah.

[00:21:14] Yeah that would be a long, long taking but it would be worth it probably.

[00:21:22] Yeah. I mean that was kind of like, when I was still playing around with the idea of doing a podcast like one of the things I really wanted to do was just a completely Toriyama centric podcast, like just covering everything he's written, everything he's worked on like the

[00:21:39] Dragon Quest games and all that. And that was one of the ideas I was toying with for a while and just, I didn't know how I was going to.

[00:21:51] Well I mean I wasn't expecting you to recruit me for a third podcast on your channel.

[00:21:58] Yeah.

[00:22:00] I wasn't going to ask you to do it with me because I figured that would be too much for you but here we are.

[00:22:06] Yeah.

[00:22:09] You know I also really want to read now but it's going to be hard to find just because it's not the most in print manga.

[00:22:15] I really want to sit down and just read Dr. Stop now.

[00:22:18] Dr. Slump.

[00:22:19] Yeah.

[00:22:20] Yeah. I have the first three volumes and I've been meaning to get around to getting the rest so I think that might be my next project especially since I'm caught up now in Spy Family until the new one comes out a couple weeks or week however long we can have.

[00:22:37] Yeah.

[00:22:38] Dr. Slump looks really interesting to me just because like all the humor and stuff that and like the Aria, what's her name?

[00:22:46] Arale.

[00:22:47] All the Arale episodes will make probably more sense after reading it.

[00:22:52] Yeah and it's pretty long series too. It's 18 volumes.

[00:22:56] Yeah that's pretty, that's decently long for, it's funny what I consider long because like I think the longest series I own is in Yasha which is a 56er.

[00:23:10] That's pretty long yeah.

[00:23:12] I think mine is Naruto. That's like 72 plus one because it was that 7th Hokage and the 7th Spring's volume which is like the 73rd unofficial and then I have 12 or 13 volumes of Boruto on top of that so that's pretty long.

[00:23:33] If you count all of Dragon Ball together, that's pretty long because like.

[00:23:39] As of right now the one that just released over here, that's 62 volumes.

[00:23:47] Yeah and that's counting Super Z and the original.

[00:23:54] That's crazy.

[00:23:55] Yeah.

[00:23:56] Pretty, that's 10 more volumes and it'll have as many volumes as original Naruto.

[00:24:02] Yeah. That's already long beyond it because its sequel series is still going as well.

[00:24:10] Yeah I think, I'd have to look into it but I want to say Boruto has the same amount of volumes or at least close to it.

[00:24:20] I'm super behind on Boruto though. At least collecting the volumes. I've been reading the chapters every month but I haven't been collecting the volumes.

[00:24:31] Yeah that's how I feel with most manga honestly.

[00:24:38] Yeah because I think the only other really long one I have is Black Clover and that's like currently 34 volumes.

[00:24:46] Yeah Naruto is definitely by far the longest one that I have.

[00:24:52] Let's say Dragon Ball is probably the second and then Full Metal Haku-Mist.

[00:25:01] That's like 27 I think.

[00:25:04] I think yeah.

[00:25:06] It's like one less than Moroni Kenshin.

[00:25:10] Are you speaking of Full Metal Haku-Mist? I saw her new series in the store today. I was tempted to pick it up but I haven't got around to it yet.

[00:25:19] I forgot she had a new series.

[00:25:21] Yeah I noticed it because I heard the art style. The main character on the cover looks identical to Risa so I was kind of like, that's interesting.

[00:25:35] I don't think it's the same character but...

[00:25:38] Probably not. I'll have to look into it though. Sounds interesting.

[00:25:42] Yeah.

[00:25:44] But yeah I need to uh... One of the other things that I really intend to do now is I need to get the rest of the Dragon Ball Culture books.

[00:25:51] Anyone who's a fan of Dragon Ball and hasn't heard of it or really given much thought to it, I definitely highly recommend getting the Dragon Ball Culture books written by Derek Madula.

[00:26:05] They're extremely knowledgeable. The first volume itself just covers pretty much Toriyama's life leading up to creating Dragon Ball.

[00:26:15] And then everything beyond that is like pretty much a full chapter by chapter breakdown, which is really interesting read.

[00:26:28] And he's got a few other non-fiction Dragon Ball books as well. I haven't read too many of them yet but I need to get more of them.

[00:26:41] Yeah it's funny. I was looking at some of the tribute posts going around. One of the ones that I saw that really was like really wholesome but also like crazy how long ago it was.

[00:26:52] And this was a picture of him and his son who was an infant at the time and they were playing Dragon Quest 1 on the Famicom.

[00:27:02] It's just really funny to see that.

[00:27:05] I've seen that one floating around too.

[00:27:07] Have you ever seen the original slime art design that Yuji Hori sent to a Kiyoshoriama?

[00:27:15] I don't think so maybe.

[00:27:19] I'll send it to you real quick. It is the basically Yuji Hori sent Toriyama this idea he had for what the slimes would look like in Dragon Quest.

[00:27:31] And basically Toriyama responded back with what they, the iconic slime design that we have now.

[00:27:43] But if you look at Yuji Hori's original design it's like whoa.

[00:27:48] I just sent it to you in discord.

[00:27:52] Yeah that thing in the corner there is what Yuji Hori was like so this is what I'm thinking for slimes.

[00:28:02] Toriyama's basically like no.

[00:28:06] Yeah.

[00:28:08] Yeah I definitely like Toriyama's design better.

[00:28:11] He created arguably one of the most iconic images in video game history.

[00:28:16] For sure.

[00:28:18] Everybody loves the Dragon Quest slimes.

[00:28:21] Yeah especially the puff puff with the slimes.

[00:28:28] Yeah.

[00:28:30] I know it's hilarious because Dragon Quest 1 is a good game but it's horribly aged.

[00:28:36] One of my favorite parts about playing it is just like you're grinding on the field and it's just, a slime draws near.

[00:28:42] It's like here we go again.

[00:28:45] I don't know. I found a lot to like about the first one when I played it. I didn't find it too bad.

[00:28:51] You gotta play the original NES version.

[00:28:54] That's fair. I was playing the remastered version on Switch.

[00:28:57] Yeah the NES version. I still like it but oh man the jank. There is so much jank.

[00:29:03] I can imagine.

[00:29:06] I wanted to show you something kind of funny. I haven't read it in a while so I might have some of my details mixed up but

[00:29:16] in the first Dragon Book Culture book I want to say it was when he was still doing, he's still early on in Doctor Slump I think.

[00:29:24] And his editor at the time Toriyama was on him about

[00:29:32] showing a jump. I want you to submit a picture of yourself for the collected volumes or for the magazine or something like that.

[00:29:42] I wasn't sure exactly what it was but he was getting out of it and Toriyama just kept, you know he's a very private person.

[00:29:48] He just kept putting it off, putting it off, putting it off.

[00:29:51] And then eventually, Toriyama put his foot down and was like dude seriously you gotta freaking do this.

[00:29:58] This is bullshit. You can't keep doing that.

[00:30:01] So what Toriyama did was he waited until the cutoff day and he took a picture of himself taking a piss and he sent that in and they fucking published it.

[00:30:14] Of course they did.

[00:30:18] Different times and also Japan.

[00:30:21] That's just like pure Toriyama right there.

[00:30:26] That's the kind of guy who was, you know.

[00:30:32] The man was very self-deprecating at times and one of his most famous trademarks was his tendency to forget things that he created.

[00:30:45] What would you say is one of your favorite Toriyama forgot moments?

[00:30:50] I don't know. That's a good one honestly.

[00:30:56] To me it's, I mean you can't launch.

[00:30:59] Launch is the most famous one.

[00:31:02] To me the fact that he forgot about Raditz was pretty crazy too.

[00:31:06] Considerate.

[00:31:07] I mean you could kind of throw them in the same boat because that was like at the same time because with the launch thing, I find the launch thing really funny because like yeah there was that gap between Dragon Ball and Dragon Ball Z.

[00:31:21] Like we have that separation because of the anime and even the manga in the west has split up like that but in Japan when the manga was running there was no separation, there was no part two.

[00:31:34] It was just the Dragon Ball manga.

[00:31:38] It went from Goku meeting Bulma all the way to Goku flying with Uub.

[00:31:44] So it was literally the very next week from Goku flying off in the tournament with Chichi to Raditz showing up.

[00:31:53] Yeah.

[00:31:54] Just in that week he completely forgot about her.

[00:31:58] Yeah.

[00:31:59] After writing her for years.

[00:32:03] I mean that one is probably worse in the sense that like he did write about her.

[00:32:08] The Raditz thing is more the, that was more like the Bardock special that just completely forgot he existed.

[00:32:16] Which is like for the amount of like impact that Raditz has on the story it's really funny that he forgot about him.

[00:32:23] Which is really funny because he didn't come up with Bardock but he didn't forget about him.

[00:32:28] Nope.

[00:32:29] He remembered him enough to make a whole chapter of him in the Dragon Ball minus and then include him in the Broly movie.

[00:32:35] Yep.

[00:32:37] I mean he did remember Raditz in the Broly movie though so we'll give him that.

[00:32:41] True but I find that really funny that the character that he didn't even write he remembered more than the characters he did write.

[00:32:50] That's like my favorite excuse though whenever someone has like a question about something in Dragon Ball they're like this doesn't make any sense in regards to the lore.

[00:32:58] My response is always just I forgot.

[00:33:03] Whatever he probably did.

[00:33:05] He probably just was building a model car and just flipped out of his mind.

[00:33:11] Oh the androids have unlimited energy.

[00:33:14] Oops.

[00:33:15] Yeah right.

[00:33:16] Why is he tired?

[00:33:19] He got bored.

[00:33:21] Yeah, pretty much he switched to iPhone.

[00:33:25] I still can't forget the fact that he basically brought Dragon Ball back to life because he refused to let it die with evolution.

[00:33:32] Yeah which is reasonable and plus like I don't know if you've heard anything about like what the original concept for Battle of God was before he got involved.

[00:33:42] Very different.

[00:33:43] I can imagine.

[00:33:46] Because it was a I think it was some of the old anime people that were working on it beforehand and then they I don't remember if who reached out to who but ultimately they they and Tori Hava were talking and they showed him their ideas for the scripts and he was like no.

[00:34:04] No.

[00:34:06] Let me let me let me take a shot at this.

[00:34:09] I don't know if I wrote it to be what we know it today but apparently the original idea was the first of all Beerus wasn't a cat he was like a lizard man.

[00:34:19] Or something, something like that.

[00:34:22] I would not have liked that nearly as much.

[00:34:26] I mean supposedly that the idea was that because I think it's pretty well known at this point that the Gaza destruction and the angels are named after alcohol.

[00:34:40] You know beer is his beer weasels whiskey, but beer is his name was that before Tori Hama touched it, but it was originally supposed to be a plan virus.

[00:34:50] Because Beerus's original idea was that he would infect people with evil.

[00:34:58] And that's why the sands are so shitty was because beer is affected them with evil.

[00:35:05] And like that was kind of like the setup for the movie.

[00:35:09] I don't know what it was going to happen after that but that was that original concept at Tori and was like now we're not doing that.

[00:35:18] I don't know why that plot is vaguely intriguing just because I'm curious where they go with it.

[00:35:24] But yeah I prefer what they did with Beerus because the whole reason why Beerus is such a likable character is the fact that he like, he basically doesn't give a fuck at all.

[00:35:34] He's just doing it because he feels like it pretty much it just everything is a win with him, which is just way more endearing.

[00:35:42] I like the idea of like the much more lighthearted whimsical romp that we got with Battle of Gods than something serious like I don't know Wrath of the Dragon or Broly.

[00:35:53] We got the bingo dance. That is the best part of that movie.

[00:35:58] Wonderful.

[00:35:59] That in a drunk bowl would be like hey everybody guess what Vegeta has friends.

[00:36:06] Yeah, that's too funny.

[00:36:10] They really nailed it with that movie.

[00:36:12] That movie single handedly I think made everyone love Dragon Ball again.

[00:36:17] That movie is like the perfect distillation of what Dragon Ball is.

[00:36:23] Like it had just the right amount of lighthearted comedy, the action was good, the animation was on point, the musical numbers throughout.

[00:36:35] It was just perfect.

[00:36:36] The voice cast was on perfect. I mean, I'm not the hugest fan of some of the recasts, but they did a really good job.

[00:36:44] Yeah, it would have been nice that they had pulled more of the original actors at least for the English dub. Obviously in Japan, you know over the years, they had lost some of their actors regardless.

[00:36:57] It was just from old age or whatever.

[00:37:02] There's numerous reasons, but...

[00:37:07] I'm actually kind of sad because I'm saying this and it's going to obviously push back a certain other anime that I'm supposed to watch, but I kind of want to watch the Dragon Ball series again now.

[00:37:24] Yeah, don't.

[00:37:26] It does look like Picking Fights is slayed now.

[00:37:30] It'll get over it eventually.

[00:37:35] Well, I mean, it could just be more incentive you to do the manga thing with me.

[00:37:43] Yeah. I haven't watched Original Z in so long though.

[00:37:48] I've experienced the story about a thousand times via video game adaptions, but I haven't watched like... I mean, I've seen Kai, but I have not seen Original like Vanilla Z in a very long time.

[00:38:00] And I'm kind of itching to re-experience that.

[00:38:04] Like Original Dub and all.

[00:38:06] Yeah.

[00:38:08] Well, you say Original Dub.

[00:38:10] Well, original the Orange Box, the right version that's out now.

[00:38:17] Obviously not shitty Funimation first attempt.

[00:38:25] Well, I'd say I honestly argue that that has its own merits of wanting like its own reasons to watch that particular version.

[00:38:35] It's entertaining at first just because it's like, wow, Sean Chamele is really trying to be Peter Columbus.

[00:38:42] Yeah.

[00:38:43] Get away from my friends.

[00:38:45] And Sabat had not really figured out what he wanted to do with Vegeta yet.

[00:38:50] He was doing like the serious like Smoker voice for Vegeta at the time.

[00:38:54] Yeah.

[00:38:55] Honestly, it'd be harder to do because I'd have to find it via illegal means, but an Ocean Dub rewatch would be interesting too.

[00:39:05] Because I've never seen beyond like other than like clips.

[00:39:08] I've never seen the full thing beyond the end of its original run over here.

[00:39:13] Well, I mean, you can at least watch the what's called the Rock the Dragon set, which is what what we got for the Ocean Dub up through like the Ginyu saga.

[00:39:26] Or that beginning of, I think like right with Goku got dynamic is when it cut off but yeah, it's right up to that point and then the first three Z movies.

[00:39:37] Yeah, I still think a strong world is better with the Ocean Dub.

[00:39:42] World's strongest.

[00:39:43] World's strongest, yeah.

[00:39:44] Strongest.

[00:39:45] Strongest.

[00:39:46] Strong world is one piece.

[00:39:47] God, God damn it, Alex.

[00:39:50] You're confusing me now.

[00:39:52] Yeah, World's strongest though.

[00:39:54] The Ocean made those movies more interesting somehow.

[00:39:58] Yeah, the ocean dub of those movies are actually really good.

[00:40:02] It's like the best thing Ocean Dub with with Dragon Ball.

[00:40:05] You know what I'd like to, I'd like to, if it was even possible to find.

[00:40:10] I'd like to see the Ocean Dub of Kai.

[00:40:15] That apparently exists.

[00:40:18] We just it's never surfaced once there's no release for it.

[00:40:24] Pretty much if you speak English, you get Funimation on home release no matter what.

[00:40:28] Yeah, apparently it never aired either because nobody has remembers hearing it.

[00:40:34] But it apparently was recorded.

[00:40:39] Because for years, apparently it's been confirmed that Richard Ian Cox voiced Goku,

[00:40:45] which is still the weirdest thing ever and I kind of want to hear it but at the same time I don't.

[00:40:52] And it used to be credited in all of his like IMDVs and like voice,

[00:40:58] voiceographies on like all the other platforms, but it's been taken off since.

[00:41:03] So I don't really know what to say about that.

[00:41:06] It's interesting though, I really want to know what his take on Goku was and why did they use him and not Kirby Moro who was still alive at the time?

[00:41:18] Who knows?

[00:41:20] Yeah, because it's Goku is weird in the Ocean Dug as he had three voices over the course of it.

[00:41:27] Yeah.

[00:41:29] Because it was Ian James Corlett for like the first part, then Peter Calamus was the most well known for a while and then Kirby Moro finished it out.

[00:41:41] And Kirby Moro to me is interesting because it's literally Moroku Goku and I still find that really interesting.

[00:41:48] Moro Goku.

[00:41:50] Yeah.

[00:41:51] I'm just waiting for Goku to like touch a girl's butt and be like, will you have my babies?

[00:41:57] I forgot that was a thing.

[00:41:59] Will you have my child?

[00:42:03] Any Ash is a fun rewatch, especially if you're not prepared for it.

[00:42:06] That's all I'll say.

[00:42:08] That's a show I need to watch again.

[00:42:11] But yeah.

[00:42:13] You know, it's kind of funny like I was looking to through like all the, because I just scrolled Twitter and it's nothing but tributes right now,

[00:42:22] which is amazing because like you realize just how much this man mattered to so many people.

[00:42:27] Like, yeah, I usually don't care about celebrities that much, but like the curatorium of passing that just like hit me hard this morning.

[00:42:39] Like, I didn't go to work today.

[00:42:41] I took a personal day.

[00:42:45] I know it's like, like I couldn't scroll the internet because I was just getting emotional.

[00:42:50] I was like, like, all right, I'm like, I can't be getting upset at work right now.

[00:42:54] So I had to put my phone down.

[00:42:56] Because anytime I would put bring up Twitter, it'd be nothing but tributes from like everybody in the podcasting community.

[00:43:03] Any voice actor that worked on a Dragon Ball like Eric Vale posted a really nice thing with a picture of trunks basically thanking the man for basically starting his career.

[00:43:14] Yeah.

[00:43:15] Pretty much all the pretty much all the Funimation alums out there encouraged to Dragon Ball.

[00:43:21] Yeah, in a lot of ways because Dragon Ball basically made Funimation.

[00:43:26] Yeah, fun Asia wasn't doing shit before they got Dragon Ball.

[00:43:30] No, the whole reason they started doing dubs is because ocean was too expensive.

[00:43:35] And that's why ocean doesn't really get work anymore.

[00:43:41] Yeah.

[00:43:43] But yeah, I actually went to the store earlier and I was walking through Walmart and I was passing by like the video games section of the stuff and I had to see it like where they have like all the anime and video game figures and stuff.

[00:43:58] And I saw a little goku plushie and I grabbed it for my daughter.

[00:44:03] It's something I've been wanting to do for a long time and I was like, well if I'm ever going to do it today is the day.

[00:44:08] Yeah.

[00:44:09] So it's just sad because it's like that is like a you really don't realize how many things that that man really did for American culture and just animation in history in general, even outside of what he did himself because he influenced and inspired so many people across the world.

[00:44:35] Toe animation is to an animation because of a curatorial.

[00:44:40] I mean, like all of the big three, you know, bleach Naruto one piece they all owe everything to Dragon Ball.

[00:44:49] Yeah, everything that's why I changed my my profile and discord to what it is.

[00:44:58] Now is the picture of I'm sure anyone listening is if you're a band of Dragon Ball, you've probably seen it on live.

[00:45:05] It's the drawing of like goku and Vegeta as camp counselors with all the all the new V anime pro tags around the campfire and he's telling them stories.

[00:45:14] It just that moves me in a different way now.

[00:45:18] Yeah, I mean, it like I to me that the two most touching were definitely the Kishimoto and the the Oda messages I saw.

[00:45:28] Yeah, that that photo of Goku with like Oda's style face is very interesting and I kind of like it and hate it at the same time.

[00:45:37] Yeah.

[00:45:40] Kishimoto's thing was really nice to I mean, especially because those guys basically, you know, some ways owe their careers to him as well.

[00:45:47] Yeah.

[00:45:48] But even like, I mentioned earlier how I have the Naruto manga when I was buying them because I was buying that the big box had so I buy them like 20 something volumes at a time that way.

[00:46:00] And how like, you know, when you're reading volumes of manga, they always have like little informational blurbs or, you know, they'll tell little stories in between chapters and stuff.

[00:46:12] And when you go through the Naruto manga, there's so many times where he was talking about how oh I used to read Dr. Slump in elementary school and I loved it.

[00:46:21] And then I was in middle school and high school and I was reading Dragon Ball and they literally throughout the entirety of his life he's been consuming Toriyama's work.

[00:46:34] Yeah, I mean you can, you can tell just by like so many other references in like just manga in general that a lot of people were.

[00:46:46] Because he really is like the old guard of manga. Like I'm trying to think of like, I mean obviously there's older manga series but like.

[00:46:53] Yeah.

[00:46:54] Dragon Ball is really the one where I think it became like a mainstream thing it is.

[00:46:58] Yeah, for sure.

[00:47:00] Like we wouldn't have these full walls of manga at bookstores now as if it wasn't for Dragon Ball.

[00:47:07] No, absolutely not.

[00:47:09] It wouldn't have blown up the way it has in the West.

[00:47:13] His art style too is, I still think it's untouchable like.

[00:47:19] Yeah, I mean his human designs are all very similar after a while but like his monster designs are still like me like the greatest things I think the man made some of the best like enemy and monster designs in general.

[00:47:32] And I love how so many of his like Dragon Quest designs and stuff were literally just like kind of reuse designs from his manga.

[00:47:42] Like the robot monsters, just the pirate robot from the Red Ribbon arc.

[00:47:49] Yep.

[00:47:51] And a lot of his human characters like you'll see in the background you'll be like oh that's just a Chi Chi back there with a different hairstyle.

[00:47:58] Yeah that's Chi Chi with a yellow hair or something.

[00:48:02] Something like that.

[00:48:04] There's a couple of protagonists in Dragon Ball that look a little bit like Goku.

[00:48:07] Yeah, and Gohan.

[00:48:09] There's a couple of trunks lookalikes.

[00:48:15] I mean, Chrono was basically that guy from Wrath of the Dragon.

[00:48:19] Yeah, Tapion.

[00:48:21] Tapion. That name is so funny.

[00:48:24] You know how to think of it?

[00:48:26] Obviously Tapion is supposed to be Tapioca.

[00:48:29] So you got Tapioca then nowadays you got Cronola who is kind of like a redesign.

[00:48:35] That's interesting.

[00:48:37] Yeah, I doubt Toriyama thought that far out but...

[00:48:41] Probably not. Well I'm pretty sure that arc was mostly...

[00:48:46] I don't know if I'm getting that confused the more or not but I want to say that that arc was a big like Toyotaru drive.

[00:48:55] Drive arc.

[00:48:57] But...

[00:48:59] I've never asked. Was Toriyama aware of like Team 4 Star in the Average series?

[00:49:04] I highly doubt it.

[00:49:06] To my knowledge the only thing he really uses is email.

[00:49:10] Okay, I just always wondered if he was aware of that or not?

[00:49:15] I don't think so.

[00:49:17] So he never approved or disproved of it?

[00:49:21] Because he didn't really have a full grasp of the effect that Dragon Ball has had around the world.

[00:49:30] You know, he...

[00:49:32] Like I used to hear stories about when Battle of Gods was coming out he came to America for like one appearance.

[00:49:42] Like really quick and he was like blown away.

[00:49:46] Like he did not expect it to be this much of a huge event.

[00:49:51] Yeah and it's only gotten bigger.

[00:49:56] I think now Dragon Ball is bigger than it was back when it was like airing.

[00:50:01] Yeah well I mean with the...

[00:50:05] You know, with the way that the internet has blown up since then.

[00:50:09] Things are shared a lot more easily. People learn things a lot more. It's not just word of mouth anymore.

[00:50:15] And as we were saying before how anime has become a lot more mainstream.

[00:50:24] It's a lot easier for people to find these things and it's pretty much common knowledge that Dragon Ball is where it all began.

[00:50:32] Yeah I mean for the most part. I mean you'll get the occasional person like well Astro Boy came first and it's like that's nice but...

[00:50:40] Yeah well I mean Goku's hairstyle came from somewhere.

[00:50:44] Yeah.

[00:50:46] That's literally where his hairstyle came from was Astro Boy.

[00:50:49] Yeah that is true.

[00:50:52] Was there a Doctor Slump anime before Dragon Ball?

[00:50:56] They get... There was okay. It just never came out of here right?

[00:51:00] There was I believe one pilot episode done by Harmony Gold.

[00:51:07] And that was as far as it went. That's as sad as this is.

[00:51:12] I'm hoping that this will be the push to finally get a Doctor Slump dub.

[00:51:19] Or maybe a proper one.

[00:51:21] Or maybe a remake.

[00:51:23] They've already done that once and it didn't work out too well from what I understand.

[00:51:27] There was a Doctor Slump remake in the 90s I believe.

[00:51:33] Alright. Yeah I wasn't sure because I know like that's been kind of a thing.

[00:51:39] Going on recently with like old manga or getting like remakes that are just like popping off now.

[00:51:45] Urusei Yatsura just recently got a full on like remake.

[00:51:49] That was Rameko Takashi's first work. The one with the alien and like the Cheetah Vakini.

[00:51:56] Yeah.

[00:51:58] Because there was an old anime of that that's very obscure but the new one's been going pretty strong from what I've heard.

[00:52:05] Yeah.

[00:52:07] So yeah you never know maybe.

[00:52:10] Yeah well hopefully. I mean we've been getting some of his stuff like slowly.

[00:52:17] We got the manga theater, Toriyama's manga theater a couple years ago.

[00:52:22] We've gotten some of his like single volume.

[00:52:28] His like one shots like Jacoes, Handland, Kawa.

[00:52:34] And then obviously we've gotten the Doctor Slump and Dragoball Manga's.

[00:52:40] So I don't know I'm hoping especially with Sandland coming out.

[00:52:45] Being like probably the last, well I'm sure they had a bunch of stuff already set in place for Dima so I guess that'll technically be the last thing he touched.

[00:52:57] But yeah.

[00:52:59] You know we got Sandland in just a couple weeks coming out here which will be nice and be nice to have a little bit more Toriyama stuff.

[00:53:11] Yeah.

[00:53:13] I just, it shocks me like Dima was just announced and then he's gone already and we still don't really even know what Dima is going to be.

[00:53:24] And it was like, it just sucks because this was like the first time he was really like gung ho I'm going to be super involved in this particular.

[00:53:33] He was never even really involved in the Dragon Ball anime, the original or Doctor Slump or any of that.

[00:53:38] He was either writing the manga or he was busy doing his own thing.

[00:53:43] He was just like yeah you could do an anime and then he just went about his life.

[00:53:48] He was drawing assets for Dragon Quest most likely.

[00:53:52] Yeah, but like this is the first time he was actually going to be full on like I am pumped to work on this anime.

[00:54:00] And it just sucks.

[00:54:04] Yeah.

[00:54:05] He could have had so many more years.

[00:54:07] I hope he had enough of his like DNA into it at this point that it hopefully will continue on in the direction he wanted and it won't become another GT that loses itself as it goes on.

[00:54:23] Well, that's the thing is unlike some other writers.

[00:54:29] Toriyama doesn't play him.

[00:54:32] No, he doesn't. That's the unfortunate part of it.

[00:54:35] So, he pretty much only have what he's already told them.

[00:54:41] What he's already had and he had already decided on what he wanted for the direction and that's probably it. He didn't.

[00:54:48] I highly doubt he had a master plan for that series.

[00:54:52] I highly doubt he had numerous arcs mapped out in his mind.

[00:54:56] He is not.

[00:54:59] In that way. Easy.

[00:55:01] I'm a mapped everything out he wanted with attack on Titan.

[00:55:04] Toriyama wrote by the seat of his pants, and that's just the way he wrote and it worked for him.

[00:55:10] Yeah, but I still wonder though how long time I was even supposed to be because it's been very unclear if that was supposed to be a long thing or a short thing.

[00:55:21] Um, I mean I could see it being especially now I can see it being long.

[00:55:28] I guess it depends.

[00:55:31] Like is to Yataro going to be involved in that on top of writing the manga is his Sasuke Toriyama gonna gonna take his dad's place and and work on. I don't know who knows.

[00:55:46] Does does a his son do anything like that we know of or is he kind of a private person as well?

[00:55:52] I'm not 100% sure. I never really occurred to me to really look too much into it. I just know that he

[00:56:00] From what I understand, I could be mistaken but from what I read he has taken over the estate.

[00:56:08] Okay, so that makes make sense.

[00:56:11] I don't know if he's an artist in his own right or if he writes at all or if he doesn't look completely different.

[00:56:18] Or if he just lived off of his dad's money, I have no clue.

[00:56:24] Yeah, that's true.

[00:56:26] I mean, only time will tell I guess one thing I know for certain is that Dragon Ball isn't going to end anytime soon.

[00:56:33] No, they're gonna.

[00:56:35] I mean it wasn't going to end. It's such a cash cow franchise that it was going to keep going forever.

[00:56:41] It has that life in it where it can go forever regardless of who's making it.

[00:56:50] I mean, it's honestly a story in series that's out.

[00:56:56] I mean literally outlived its creator and it's basically transcended like anime into it's part of just pop culture now.

[00:57:05] Yeah, for sure. I mean we've had Goku floats at how many Thanksgiving parades now?

[00:57:11] I mean you have like NFL players that get crunchy role endorsements because they're Dragon Ball fans.

[00:57:17] Yeah, just like crazy shit.

[00:57:19] UFC fighters and wrestlers dressing up like Dragon Ball people and you got friggin yeah like football players like doing their,

[00:57:28] was it like the end zone celebration doing coming how they hazard each other and shit, you know?

[00:57:34] That was my favorite thing I saw on Twitter today was it was just a post that just said admit it.

[00:57:41] You all tried to do a Kamehameha at one point in your life.

[00:57:45] Oh yeah, actually when I was a kid I must have been like about Santa's age maybe a little younger.

[00:57:57] And I remember having a dream because this is my old house too so yeah I would have been around Santa's age.

[00:58:05] I remember having a dream one night that I was training with trunks and I shit you not I woke up in like the

[00:58:15] like one leg on my knee the other on my foot like kind of like that kneeling up position with my hands doing the Kamehameha.

[00:58:25] I woke up like that I shit you not.

[00:58:29] I tried to do it at recess once.

[00:58:33] Yeah, I got laughed at after.

[00:58:36] Do you remember that video of the kid who would like had this whole theory about how like the concept of Super Saiyan like can

[00:58:45] happen you can do it if you practice enough and then he spent like the next five minutes screaming into the camera

[00:58:52] and then at the end he's just like I'm a Super Saiyan.

[00:58:57] And you know the whole time you're watching you think he's gonna like add an effect or something like

[00:59:03] no just screaming into the fucking camera.

[00:59:06] It's amazing how much of that series really is just screaming.

[00:59:13] Yeah.

[00:59:15] And we like it that way.

[00:59:17] That's one thing I do like about Kai though is that they kind of sped up a lot of the the stair downs.

[00:59:25] We're like, it's hard for me to really describe without like a visual example but like where you know you'd see like

[00:59:37] for instance if someone's like juggling an opponent like hitting them, they'll get fly off in a direction they'll tell for

[00:59:44] behind them to hit them again they'll go fly up top of behind them to do that like six seven times.

[00:59:50] Whereas that would have taken like, like a full like two minutes in the original Z where it'd be like hit, soar, hit, soar like that.

[01:00:02] But in Kai it's like boom boom boom boom boom like you know they speed it up so it's like actually like a lot faster and more dynamic.

[01:00:10] Which is even funnier because in original Dragon Ball it was even slower.

[01:00:16] I mean with original Dragon Ball it made more sense for it to be that way because it was more martial arts based and less like who's glowy hair is stronger.

[01:00:25] See like I love going back to original Dragon Ball and like anytime they do a kamehameha it's so slow and you're like, wow this used to be like the ultimate attack.

[01:00:35] I love that the first beam struggle was just Goku and Roshi in the tournament.

[01:00:40] Yeah.

[01:00:42] Jackie Chan.

[01:00:43] Jackie Chan.

[01:00:44] I'm sorry Jackie Chan.

[01:00:45] Jackie Chan.

[01:00:46] You want to pull a Yamcha and get it wrong?

[01:00:49] That's still, still my favorite thing is nobody noticed.

[01:00:55] The only person who did notice was shamed for it until he was like gas lit into believing that he was wrong.

[01:01:04] Oh man I missed.

[01:01:07] Original Dragon Ball is just special to me like it was such a different show.

[01:01:11] It was just so charming.

[01:01:13] Exactly like it's such a, it's so down to earth compared to like later Dragon Ball which was wacky and all over the place.

[01:01:21] For sure.

[01:01:24] It was also really really weird though in comparison.

[01:01:29] Oh yeah well I mean it was, I mean look you just look at the title of the theme song Mystical Adventure.

[01:01:39] You know that's what it was.

[01:01:41] It wasn't about sci-fi, crazy, laser battles or anything like that.

[01:01:47] It was adventure, it was magic, it was meeting friends along the way.

[01:01:54] I also love the fact that every friend Goku runs into is a frickin' prick.

[01:01:59] The one he first runs into them.

[01:02:01] Other than Chichi, is there anything Chichi got more dickish later on?

[01:02:08] Yeah there's very few characters that, I think you know what's funny is I think the only characters that weren't

[01:02:15] dicks to him right when they first met and became friends are the ones that ended up fading into obscurity like Aidur.

[01:02:24] Hey he appeared for one scene in Super and then got a bliped out of existence.

[01:02:30] Yep alright.

[01:02:33] I mean he's in Kakarot at least.

[01:02:36] Along with the Suno.

[01:02:39] Hey he had the Path to Power movie.

[01:02:42] True and they both gave energy during the final Spirit Bomb.

[01:02:47] Yeah they even recognized his voice somehow even though he was an adult.

[01:02:51] Even though the last time they saw him he was 12.

[01:02:55] Yeah.

[01:02:57] I always assume that Goku went around and visited them over time but you never really know.

[01:03:02] I don't. I don't just assume that at all.

[01:03:06] He didn't even visit his family.

[01:03:08] Well no he doesn't care about them.

[01:03:10] He cares about his friends.

[01:03:13] Yeah.

[01:03:16] He still thinks Chichi is a dessert or something I don't know.

[01:03:20] She's just the beautiful lady who lives in his house.

[01:03:23] And yells at him.

[01:03:24] And yells at him it makes delicious food.

[01:03:26] And won't let him train his child.

[01:03:28] Right.

[01:03:29] Who he also doesn't really care about that often.

[01:03:32] Yeah well.

[01:03:34] Uh.

[01:03:36] Goku's a fun character.

[01:03:38] Oh yeah I mean there's so many fun characters throughout Dragon Ball.

[01:03:42] It's kind of messed up in hindsight though when you realize Goku is technically a character with brain damage the entire series.

[01:03:48] Oh yeah super brain damage.

[01:03:51] He almost died.

[01:03:53] Yeah it's just like when you forget that reveal it's like wow.

[01:03:57] It all makes sense and it's kind of sad.

[01:04:00] That is what that seems like.

[01:04:02] Did you ever hit your head really hard?

[01:04:04] It's like every day why?

[01:04:07] Yep.

[01:04:10] Kind of like you wish he would get to meet his like dad once for real and his dad would just be like what the fuck happened.

[01:04:16] Well they he never like officially meets him in the official.

[01:04:22] But there is a little something with Goku and Bardock in the Griddle arc.

[01:04:28] Oh okay.

[01:04:30] Which is nice.

[01:04:34] Cause I always just think of like in Dragon Ball FighterZ when you play as Goku and then you play as Bardock and he'll be like

[01:04:39] Gokarage is that you?

[01:04:41] Yeah well uh yeah they did that in like the Fudokai 3.

[01:04:46] Yeah it's similar to that thing where Bardock would be like wait you're my.

[01:04:51] Your dad was a brilliant scientist.

[01:04:54] Yeah.

[01:04:56] Still the dumbest line in the series but I love it.

[01:04:59] One of my favorite things in the Ocean Deb.

[01:05:02] They just made shit up on like the go because they really didn't know what they were translating.

[01:05:07] Yeah it was just so much.

[01:05:10] Now I definitely feel like I want to because I had so many other magas I wanted to read but now I just feel like I should just reread them.

[01:05:18] From the beginning especially now that I have all the way through Granola in Super I feel like now's the time.

[01:05:25] It's just funny to me because like after watching the anime going back to the manga you realize just how much of the anime was filler.

[01:05:34] Oh yeah.

[01:05:36] Like I think my favorite still is like Chi Chi only appears once and then she doesn't come back again until the tournament.

[01:05:43] She pops up like a bunch in the anime.

[01:05:45] Yeah.

[01:05:47] Which actually like look at it.

[01:05:49] I was going to say like I still think one of the best arcs in that anime is the wedding dress dark.

[01:05:54] Because it's the one time Chi Chi was likable.

[01:05:57] Yeah I really like I think that arc is underrated.

[01:06:00] I enjoyed that.

[01:06:01] He's a nice little five so wrong.

[01:06:03] It's literally the best version of Chi Chi and they never went back.

[01:06:08] Yeah.

[01:06:09] And also that arc also had my favorite character the sexist mountain.

[01:06:13] Yes.

[01:06:14] What a fucking random thing.

[01:06:17] Oh god.

[01:06:19] Yeah and um I just feel like Dragon Ball had some of the best filler.

[01:06:25] It had some good ones like I mean Goku and Piccolo licensed.

[01:06:30] That one is so popular that they have to put it in everything now.

[01:06:34] Well even just like even if I'm just talking like original Dragon Ball,

[01:06:37] like I loved the filler and original Dragon Ball.

[01:06:39] It was like the like pretty much every Goku training like he has like a good six, seven time.

[01:06:45] One time it was like he was like he was like a big man.

[01:06:49] What's the worst thing about Dragon Ball?

[01:06:51] Like he has like a good six, seven episodes before each tournament arc that are just filler

[01:07:00] episodes.

[01:07:01] Like each one is like a standalone filler episode of him training.

[01:07:04] And there always like really like was one where he goes to the demon world and there's one

[01:07:08] where like he fights the Inno-Chiccho show which is like a giant pig with antlers.

[01:07:15] I mean hell like even in Z the whole tournament in the in the afterlife.

[01:07:21] But like where we get introduced to like Pycon one of the most underappreciated like anime

[01:07:26] only characters there is.

[01:07:29] I think that's probably like the fan favorite.

[01:07:33] Well he was he was just such a fun character that his movie appearance is still like one

[01:07:40] of the greatest things ever where he spends the entire movie yelling at a wall.

[01:07:43] Yeah.

[01:07:47] I wish I wish they made him canon because he is so entertaining.

[01:07:51] Yeah I think he would have been next the next canonized character.

[01:07:57] Yeah.

[01:07:59] That was great.

[01:08:02] Even going back to like original Dragon Ball like I think original Dragon Ball had some

[01:08:06] of my favorite villains in the series too.

[01:08:09] Like General Blue.

[01:08:10] General Blue mercenary.

[01:08:11] He's a gay Nazi.

[01:08:15] Mercenary Xia was still like the funniest one.

[01:08:18] Yeah he was great.

[01:08:19] My favorite one of my favorite scenes in all of Dragon Ball was when he was just like walking

[01:08:26] through the town.

[01:08:27] Like I think he's like waiting to get a new outfit made because Goku fried his old one.

[01:08:32] Yeah.

[01:08:33] He's just walking around and like some dude comes up like is like hiding in the shadows

[01:08:39] and like goes to shoot him from the in the back.

[01:08:43] And the dude literally like all in one motion flips his flip flop into the air over his

[01:08:48] head behind his back deflects the bullet with the fucking flip flop.

[01:08:53] And without a single moment's hesitation slips it back on and keeps walking.

[01:08:59] Yep.

[01:09:00] My favorite is my favorite is his way of transportation where he pulls that giant like

[01:09:04] pylon out of the ground and just throws it and then just jumps on it.

[01:09:07] You're how we kill General Blue by hitting him with a temple with his tongue.

[01:09:13] Yeah.

[01:09:15] Which is hilarious because like he was like the unstoppable force when he first got

[01:09:20] it brought up and then nowadays Goku could literally just flick him out of existence.

[01:09:25] Oh that's part of the reason why I love original Dragon Ball so much is because

[01:09:29] it was he was still holding tight to his doctor slump roots but with that

[01:09:35] that martial arts action setting.

[01:09:38] And the power scaling wasn't absurd.

[01:09:41] Yeah.

[01:09:42] Like I still remember like when Yamcha was a threat like his first appearance.

[01:09:47] Yeah.

[01:09:48] I'll never forget Yamcha's like appearance where he like meets runs into

[01:09:52] Chichi and then fucking sucker punches her and it's like Jesus.

[01:09:56] Right.

[01:09:56] Well she did try to cut his head off.

[01:09:59] Well I mean it was justified.

[01:10:01] Yeah.

[01:10:01] It was not the fence.

[01:10:03] All right.

[01:10:03] He snuck up on her.

[01:10:06] And she was kind of a nervous wreck.

[01:10:08] No kidding.

[01:10:10] I just that that clip of her of him just like punching her in the gut and knocking

[01:10:14] her out.

[01:10:14] I'm like wow what a different anime.

[01:10:17] It was a monster carrot.

[01:10:20] Yeah.

[01:10:20] That's a character that he gets brought back in the games every now and then

[01:10:24] I always laugh.

[01:10:26] Yeah.

[01:10:26] He's an attack of the sands.

[01:10:29] Yep.

[01:10:29] Because of Yamcha has an entire arc before the game starts like even though

[01:10:33] I'm pretty sure in an interview Toriyama was asked about monster carrot

[01:10:38] because he brought up the fact that Roshi destroyed the moon

[01:10:41] and he was like so what happened to them are they dead?

[01:10:44] He just said something along the lines of like no they're alive.

[01:10:48] They're just floating through space.

[01:10:50] Just endlessly forever.

[01:10:52] That is a very Toriyama answer.

[01:10:54] Yeah.

[01:10:55] He probably made it up on the spot right there.

[01:10:58] Did you know the kais are grown from fruits on trees?

[01:11:02] I did not.

[01:11:03] Yeah.

[01:11:04] That's another golden Toriyama nugget from an interview.

[01:11:09] He probably like someone asked him about the

[01:11:12] monster carrot on the moon and he probably was like fuck I didn't leave him up there.

[01:11:17] Yeah.

[01:11:17] I swear to God like whatever he would have these questions posed to him during

[01:11:21] interviews he would literally just make it up on the spot.

[01:11:23] Like yeah I'm dead sir and that was what was happening.

[01:11:27] That's because he probably was like I don't remember that.

[01:11:29] And everyone sitting around with their paper and their pens just writing it

[01:11:33] down vigorously like fascinating tell me more.

[01:11:36] Yeah the fan fiction authors like I need to write a story about this.

[01:11:41] Yeah.

[01:11:41] OK.

[01:11:43] Oh God.

[01:11:44] That wasn't a dig at fan fiction writers.

[01:11:46] There are very talented ones out there.

[01:11:48] I'm just making a joke.

[01:11:49] No if anybody if anybody wants to read a really good Dragon Ball fan

[01:11:52] fiction check out Drag of all multiverse.

[01:11:55] It's been going since before Battle of Gods.

[01:11:58] I haven't caught up with it in a couple years.

[01:12:00] But to my knowledge it's still going.

[01:12:02] And it's it's a really fun story.

[01:12:05] That's a good one.

[01:12:06] The best modern one was probably Dragon Ball Dynasty.

[01:12:09] But that got like deleted.

[01:12:10] But it's I guess back now.

[01:12:12] I was my first time hearing about it.

[01:12:14] I haven't checked it out.

[01:12:14] I've read a little bit of what the hell was it called.

[01:12:21] Like zero verse or no that's not it.

[01:12:25] A lot of 100 percent sure.

[01:12:27] I just I think it was a Chinese fan manga.

[01:12:30] And revolved around Bobbity came back for some reason and was like

[01:12:35] trying to awaken the bonus in something along those lines.

[01:12:41] I didn't get super far into it, but it seems like an interesting story.

[01:12:45] And then there's you know that there's the classic AF.

[01:12:48] Yeah.

[01:12:49] Dynasty was an interesting take.

[01:12:51] It was it was another one of the classic what if Raditz was good arcs.

[01:12:54] But instead of just being Raditz it basically it's the divergence

[01:13:00] starts where Goku Goku's dead after the fight with Raditz.

[01:13:04] And he falls off the snake way and goes to hell

[01:13:07] and he runs into his family down there.

[01:13:09] Oh yeah.

[01:13:10] And then brings them back and it basically

[01:13:11] it redos the entire Dragon Ball storyline.

[01:13:14] If as if Bardock, Guinea and Raditz were alive.

[01:13:18] Also so it must be a relatively new manga.

[01:13:20] Yeah, it's well, it's not a manga.

[01:13:22] It's this is a strictly a story.

[01:13:25] It's a text based.

[01:13:26] Yeah.

[01:13:27] Gotcha.

[01:13:28] It was really big.

[01:13:30] Like it had over they were just starting like the Majin Buu arc.

[01:13:35] Wow.

[01:13:36] And then the author I guess had like a mental breakdown or something

[01:13:40] deleted it and then brought it back and they're rewriting it now.

[01:13:45] So from the beginning.

[01:13:47] Well, they're not fully rewriting it.

[01:13:49] They're fixing up the chapters and reposting them.

[01:13:52] They're like halfway through the repost now.

[01:13:54] OK.

[01:13:55] That's not a very following that one for a while, though,

[01:13:58] because that one was really well written and it was an interesting.

[01:14:00] It was like one of the more interesting takes on the whole

[01:14:03] bringing the family back kind of thing.

[01:14:05] Yeah.

[01:14:07] Because I mean, everybody knows

[01:14:09] Moscow X and his weird obsession with Raditz.

[01:14:14] To a point where it's now just kind of I think he's more known for that than a

[01:14:19] does a meme at this point.

[01:14:20] Yeah.

[01:14:21] What if Raditz was good?

[01:14:24] What if Napa was good?

[01:14:26] Part 68.

[01:14:27] Yeah, I'm still making shit up for this.

[01:14:30] Yeah.

[01:14:33] He's a nice guy, but sometimes he goes a little too far.

[01:14:36] Those things.

[01:14:37] You know, it's fucked up is pretty sure his kid was born yesterday.

[01:14:43] Oh, really?

[01:14:43] The day that this became public.

[01:14:48] Wow.

[01:14:49] There's a lot of really weird stuff.

[01:14:52] This is something weird.

[01:14:55] Like two hours ago before I came over and started

[01:14:59] the setting up to do the podcast, I was watching Kai with my wife and my daughter.

[01:15:05] And like I've had a run of Kai going for a while.

[01:15:09] I'm just kind of watching it here and there and just where I happened to be

[01:15:13] today of all days.

[01:15:16] It was the Namek saga.

[01:15:19] And Ginyu had just been defeated.

[01:15:22] Goku was in the pod.

[01:15:25] Vegeta was asleep.

[01:15:25] They they gathered the Dragon Balls in secret, made their wishes.

[01:15:30] Vegeta woke up, came over, blah, blah, blah, big, big, immortal.

[01:15:34] And Perunga dies.

[01:15:37] And you just see Dende weeping.

[01:15:41] And they're like, what happened?

[01:15:43] What's going on?

[01:15:44] What happened to Perunga?

[01:15:45] And Dende goes, the creator of the Dragon Balls in the past.

[01:15:51] Yeah.

[01:15:52] It's just today of all days for me to watch that episode.

[01:15:55] Like my wife, like my wife didn't catch it at first.

[01:15:58] And I asked, like, did you hear that?

[01:16:00] And I rewound it.

[01:16:01] And when she heard it, she started tearing up.

[01:16:08] It's sad.

[01:16:08] Like it really hit everybody differently.

[01:16:15] Yeah, there's been a bunch of people in the discords who were like really upset.

[01:16:18] I'm right with their wood, them honestly.

[01:16:20] It's it's.

[01:16:23] It's not kind of sad, but Dragon Ball is my best friend throughout most of my

[01:16:27] most of my childhood.

[01:16:28] I didn't have many friends that I didn't even have, like.

[01:16:34] I didn't really even have friends until like closer to middle school

[01:16:38] or even past middle school.

[01:16:40] See, I had friends, but I was the only anime fan.

[01:16:44] That was outward about it.

[01:16:48] So I couldn't even share all my the Dragon Ball stuff with anybody.

[01:16:53] I tried to see that's the thing is like a lot of people hid their

[01:16:59] like for Dragon Ball.

[01:17:01] I didn't.

[01:17:02] And that outed me out as the weirdo.

[01:17:04] Even though you knew everyone else was also watching it.

[01:17:08] Yeah, well, I mean, there's been numerous occasions,

[01:17:09] like, for instance, my cousin Dominic

[01:17:13] um, he used to he used to make fun of me for watching Dragon Ball

[01:17:18] and being into like that RTO and all that stuff.

[01:17:21] But he's like.

[01:17:23] Is like all about anime now.

[01:17:25] Like I talked to him a few years ago and like he had like anime tattoos

[01:17:30] and he had a he had a paintball team called Laughin Coffin,

[01:17:35] which anybody who knows that's.

[01:17:38] That's a group in sort of online of all shows.

[01:17:43] Yeah.

[01:17:44] So yeah, it's it's funny how that happens.

[01:17:48] See, kids have it so much kids have it a lot harder in a lot of ways,

[01:17:51] but they also have it so much easier in terms of stuff like this.

[01:17:55] Now it is because like anime is so mainstream and popular now

[01:18:00] that it's like you're almost the weird one for not liking it.

[01:18:03] Yeah.

[01:18:05] But I still think about back in like middle school,

[01:18:08] especially elementary school, but also middle school.

[01:18:11] Like I was like the one anime fan that was kind of open about it.

[01:18:16] I was less so the further I got in because I knew

[01:18:20] being an Yasha fan that was going to be even more ridicule heavy

[01:18:23] because that series wasn't even popular like mainstream wise.

[01:18:28] Even though it was like way darker than a lot of the other ones.

[01:18:31] Like that was a fucking dark show.

[01:18:32] It was, but the people couldn't get past the fact that the main

[01:18:36] character was a schoolgirl.

[01:18:38] So yeah, well, they probably saw the schoolgirl outfit and thought Sailor Moon.

[01:18:42] Yeah.

[01:18:44] I mean, even though Kigome is way more interesting than so many

[01:18:48] anime characters there are, but that's just my bias going through,

[01:18:52] especially the lady characters for being totally honest.

[01:18:56] Yeah. For the majority of at least of like the classic shows

[01:18:59] that we grew up with, like generally,

[01:19:02] there are exceptions, but usually the women were just there for like,

[01:19:06] hey, look, I have a woman in my manga now.

[01:19:09] On service.

[01:19:10] Like what?

[01:19:12] What purpose to Kako serve in you?

[01:19:14] I actually

[01:19:16] emotional support. Exactly.

[01:19:20] Yeah.

[01:19:21] Ironically, she's more prevalent in the manga than the anime.

[01:19:24] But yeah.

[01:19:28] Yeah, it's just it's funny though, especially

[01:19:31] like, I mean, even Dragon Ball, though, had some pretty strong female characters

[01:19:34] throughout. Oh yeah, for sure.

[01:19:36] I mean, the second character introduced is Bulma and she's there the entire time.

[01:19:41] And she's like, she actually is a brilliant scientist.

[01:19:45] Yeah. Yeah, Bulma, despite Bulma being kind of

[01:19:48] Bulma, he is still like arguably the brightest character in that show.

[01:19:52] And like.

[01:19:54] A lot of like the reason, like most of like the innovations are all Bulma.

[01:19:59] Mm hmm.

[01:20:00] I mean, she I don't know if this was.

[01:20:06] I don't know if she just figured out on her own or if she like

[01:20:10] reverse engineered the technology of free space ship from Resurrection F.

[01:20:15] But she made a healing tank

[01:20:19] like like they had anemic.

[01:20:22] Yeah, I'm sure she probably re-engineered it.

[01:20:25] Not to mention the time machine.

[01:20:28] Which she invented twice.

[01:20:31] He probably would have invented it again if Beerus didn't say no.

[01:20:35] Well, that's what I'm saying.

[01:20:35] Like she her future self invented it and then

[01:20:39] the current Bulma reverse engineered it and it would have worked.

[01:20:43] But Beerus destroyed it.

[01:20:44] Yeah, Beerus was like, we're not doing this again.

[01:20:48] Along with Future Bulma's notes.

[01:20:50] So if she was going to make it again, it would take a lot longer.

[01:20:55] My favorite part about Bulma, though, is a character is the fact

[01:20:58] that she is incredibly smart, but she's also incredibly shallow

[01:21:02] at the same time, like in superhero, like where her she's going

[01:21:08] through all these hoops and creating all this stuff.

[01:21:09] But in reality, she just wants to make her a lot bigger,

[01:21:14] which is really silly because like

[01:21:17] she probably could just develop the shit to do it on her own.

[01:21:22] She doesn't really need that.

[01:21:23] Like she is smart enough to be able to figure out how to make

[01:21:27] like she probably could make like a magic anti-aging cream.

[01:21:31] She chooses not to.

[01:21:33] That's like the fan theory behind why and GT

[01:21:37] like Bulma looks significantly younger than Chi Chi, despite Chi Chi

[01:21:41] being younger is the fact that like they just assumed Bulma just invented some shit.

[01:21:46] But Chi Chi was always stressed out.

[01:21:47] Bulma just didn't give a fuck.

[01:21:50] Well, yeah, Bulma got like Chi Chi gave birth to like two sayings

[01:21:54] and then had to deal with their bullshit because the father wasn't going to hang out.

[01:22:00] Vegeta wasn't an absent father, and even if he was Bulma is the richest woman on earth.

[01:22:04] So yeah, Bulma didn't have to raise she's getting nannies for days.

[01:22:11] Like I'm tired of this now.

[01:22:12] Can you take care of it for an hour?

[01:22:14] She's got like eight fucking Mary Poppins on hand at any given time.

[01:22:19] I mean, although to be fair, Chi Chi kind of did a lot of that shit to herself.

[01:22:24] True like she would have a much less stressful life if she just let go.

[01:22:28] Who like you go to sometimes.

[01:22:31] Yeah, I think I think at this point in like where the series is,

[01:22:35] I think she's pretty much accepted that he is how he is.

[01:22:38] It's not going to change.

[01:22:39] Yeah, I mean she was pretty good at the end of Z after he died.

[01:22:46] And then like after he came back and super, they kind of

[01:22:51] forgot all of her character development and made her like worse

[01:22:54] than she was at the beginning of Z for a while there.

[01:22:56] Yeah, all of a sudden she cares about Goten studying,

[01:22:59] even though she's already got it already has a successful son.

[01:23:02] Even well, you know what I found weird about that is like she all of a sudden

[01:23:05] cared about Goten studying, even though one of her biggest character moments

[01:23:09] in Z was the fact she trained him.

[01:23:12] Mm hmm.

[01:23:13] But that he learned how to become a Super Saiyan because of her.

[01:23:17] Yeah, which also like when you think about it makes a whole lot of sense

[01:23:20] about like why he was strong at Go Super Saiyan but didn't know how to fly

[01:23:24] because she never learned.

[01:23:26] Yeah, that's true.

[01:23:27] Chi Chi did never learn how to fly.

[01:23:28] So that makes sense why Goten didn't know how to fly.

[01:23:32] Yeah, even though you think Trunks would have taught him.

[01:23:38] Yeah, you think well they were they were kind of frenemies at that point still.

[01:23:44] Um, yeah, because it's weird that Chi Chi never did because Chi Chi was

[01:23:48] not counting like 18.

[01:23:50] Like she's I think the strongest like human woman still in the series.

[01:23:55] At least the strongest woman that isn't all treated in any way.

[01:23:59] Yeah.

[01:24:01] Like 18 wouldn't be that strong if she wasn't a cyborg.

[01:24:04] Yes, that's why I'm saying other than 18.

[01:24:06] Mm hmm.

[01:24:08] But also there really hasn't been any just human female fighters

[01:24:12] since not like human fighters in general anymore.

[01:24:18] To be honest, yeah, which is a bummer, which is another reason why everyone's

[01:24:23] really been waiting for you know Dragon Ball to go past the end of Z

[01:24:28] so we could get some who because he's the one human who has the potential

[01:24:33] to match these Saiyans.

[01:24:37] Yeah.

[01:24:40] Yeah, that is true though.

[01:24:41] I was thinking about that like there hasn't been like a human

[01:24:44] because like in a.

[01:24:47] In original Dragon Ball, that was kind of the whole gimmick is that Goku

[01:24:50] was the weird one among like all these human characters.

[01:24:54] And then like Z it's just like all of a sudden they forgot about.

[01:24:58] Oh yeah, they're from Earth by the way.

[01:25:01] I think the majority of Earth's population is well to be fair to

[01:25:04] though in original Dragon Ball we had all like the weird like animal

[01:25:07] people walking around.

[01:25:09] Yeah, that's true.

[01:25:11] But they had to make a sub mini quest in Kakarot to explain why that went away.

[01:25:20] I just thought that's even though even though even in Kakarot it was established

[01:25:24] that there are some people who were altered to be animal people

[01:25:28] and then there's other animal people who are just born that way

[01:25:31] like Oolong was just born that way.

[01:25:33] Yeah, but apparently the King of the world or whatever

[01:25:40] he took the drug.

[01:25:43] Yeah, so I don't think for me they had to make bed.

[01:25:49] It's just make things up.

[01:25:52] So I don't know.

[01:25:54] I kind of like the world of weird that original Dragon Ball was.

[01:25:57] Yeah, it was so charming and so interesting.

[01:26:01] It kind of got sterilized a bit with Z but yeah, there's a lot

[01:26:05] more like kind of modernized in a way.

[01:26:09] Yeah.

[01:26:10] What my favorite like like I don't even know if it's meant to be a joke.

[01:26:15] One of my favorite like quirks of the Dragon Ball world is how

[01:26:19] like whenever there's like a huge panic like like cells going to blow

[01:26:22] up the world or booze coming to the city or something's going to happen

[01:26:26] and everyone's going to die and everyone is panicking trying to get

[01:26:31] out of the city and the drive, you know the bumper to bumper traffic

[01:26:35] and you see one car just like literally just slowly bump into

[01:26:40] the car in front of them and both cars explode.

[01:26:43] He literally lightly taps and they just both explode in

[01:26:49] One of my favorite things is like in like a battle of gods

[01:26:52] like the classic line of like all those explosives are happening

[01:26:55] it's like, oh, they do it over a capsule core.

[01:26:58] Yeah, though there was that one cop who was just like as

[01:27:02] pride the briefs testing some explosives that are licensed

[01:27:05] again.

[01:27:07] Such a throwaway line.

[01:27:09] I'm pretty sure the whole reason that was there.

[01:27:11] I think that was like a famous Japanese like athlete or something

[01:27:15] and that was just supposed to be like a little cameo for

[01:27:17] like the Japanese audience but like to everyone else in the

[01:27:21] world it was just so out of left field like everyone

[01:27:23] thought something was going to happen like related to that

[01:27:26] like I was going to be a plot point later on like no,

[01:27:29] it's literally just a stupid throwaway joke.

[01:27:33] Yeah, it's funny to how super also kind of like build all of

[01:27:37] the tension in like the series because they literally like

[01:27:42] when they introduced a weasel they basically just went

[01:27:44] like, oh yeah, by the way, I can just undo the world getting

[01:27:47] exploded at like will so and even at the end of super where

[01:27:51] he was just like, oh yeah, I can just people back to life.

[01:27:54] Boop.

[01:27:55] There you go.

[01:27:55] Frieza, you're alive.

[01:27:57] Yeah, who needs Dragon Balls?

[01:28:00] I love I love Beerus and Weasel but my God they fucked up

[01:28:04] so much cannon.

[01:28:05] Yeah created.

[01:28:07] That's true.

[01:28:08] But that's the thing though is if they're not interested

[01:28:11] in what's going on, they won't touch it.

[01:28:13] Yeah, I do like that but but now we just kind of like

[01:28:16] all right we need this planet because Beerus is attached

[01:28:19] to it now so now like nothing can happen to Earth.

[01:28:24] It's still a little weird though because like all the

[01:28:26] previous cannon was made without Beerus and Weasel

[01:28:29] but now they're so integral to it that it's like it makes

[01:28:32] some of the watching the older stuff a little weird

[01:28:34] sometimes.

[01:28:36] Yeah, but like with a lot of the retcons they've done it

[01:28:39] it makes more sense than it should.

[01:28:43] True.

[01:28:44] Like for instance, Gokunmajita splitting apart with

[01:28:49] the Pitara when they were fighting Boo like that actually

[01:28:51] makes sense now.

[01:28:54] True.

[01:28:55] A little bit less sense is the fact that Beerus is the one

[01:28:58] who sealed elder Kai and the Z sword.

[01:29:03] Yeah, I mean I did kind of like the whole implication

[01:29:07] that Beerus was going to destroy the Saiyans anyways

[01:29:11] but Frieza did it.

[01:29:12] Yeah, Frieza was just like hey is it cool if I do

[01:29:14] that he's like yeah cool say me a trick.

[01:29:16] Yeah I don't really care.

[01:29:18] Although ironically like the Saiyans probably would

[01:29:21] have lived a lot longer if

[01:29:24] if Frieza hadn't gotten the okay like if Beerus was like

[01:29:27] now I want to do it myself but he probably would have

[01:29:28] just gone to sleep for like a few decades.

[01:29:32] Yeah, he would have been lazy and not wanted to do it.

[01:29:35] So they probably would have still lived a while but

[01:29:39] who knows.

[01:29:40] I like the fact too that he was like he was kind of like

[01:29:44] yeah, I did have where is that Frieza?

[01:29:46] I want to go put him out of his misery and they're

[01:29:48] like oh he's already dead.

[01:29:49] He's like oh okay.

[01:29:52] Yeah, I don't know.

[01:29:53] I just I really hope Toyotaro was up up to the

[01:30:00] up to the mantle that he's been put at you know he

[01:30:03] he's been training for this for a while like he's been

[01:30:06] you know the protege of Toriyama for almost a decade now.

[01:30:14] I mean yeah, Supers been going

[01:30:17] since 2015.

[01:30:18] Yeah.

[01:30:19] So yeah it's been almost a decade that he's been

[01:30:23] working directly with Toriyama, learning under him

[01:30:28] and I just hope he's up to it.

[01:30:30] I mean you look at his art like you look at volume one

[01:30:34] then you look at like volume 20 and it's like you can see

[01:30:37] how much better he's gotten.

[01:30:39] He's definitely improved but he's still not

[01:30:42] Toriyama level.

[01:30:43] No one's going to be Toriyama.

[01:30:45] I mean true.

[01:30:46] Although I will say Dragon Garo Lee, he's he does a

[01:30:51] good job imitating that style.

[01:30:53] Hmm.

[01:30:55] Yeah, I mean it's so

[01:30:58] Toriyama's art style is very interesting to me like even

[01:31:02] just like looking through this like book of all the

[01:31:04] Dragon Quest designs like his style isn't the most like

[01:31:10] crazy like intricate but the way he draws it

[01:31:15] is something that only he seems to be able to do

[01:31:18] and he doesn't so he did it so casually too like

[01:31:22] it wasn't like like it was like a notorious thing with

[01:31:25] him where you know he he ran a weekly manga like week to

[01:31:31] week from

[01:31:35] I want to say 1980 to like 95 give or take I could be

[01:31:40] mixing up the dates but about that long about 15 years

[01:31:44] straight.

[01:31:47] And he was notorious for procrastinating the hell

[01:31:52] out of it like he would literally procrastinate for five

[01:31:55] days out of the week and then those last two days he would

[01:31:58] bang out the full chapter.

[01:32:00] Oh yeah, and what's crazy to me is like his black and whites

[01:32:03] like his manga actual art is so like detailed and intricate

[01:32:07] but then when he goes and does like his full color spreads

[01:32:11] it's like the dude is like was on another level.

[01:32:15] Like just looking at that art.

[01:32:17] Yeah.

[01:32:18] And it's so distinctly him.

[01:32:21] For sure.

[01:32:23] Like you can't look at any anything that he's drawn and not

[01:32:27] instantly recognized as a Toriyama piece.

[01:32:30] Oh yeah, like there are so many great artists on like

[01:32:33] the Internet that I see doing like fan art and they

[01:32:36] almost have his style down to a T but you even looking

[01:32:40] at it that you can still tell it's not Toriyama.

[01:32:43] It is just a very good stylistic interpretation

[01:32:47] yeah, which perfectly fine.

[01:32:49] There's a lot of good fan art out there but oh yeah,

[01:32:54] but I mean that's what makes a manga artist like so good

[01:32:58] like Toriyama was like when I think of like other iconic

[01:33:02] artists like there's never going to be another Oda.

[01:33:04] They'll never be another Kishimoto.

[01:33:07] They'll never be another Rumi Kotakehashi.

[01:33:12] There's more off the top of my head.

[01:33:14] I could think of probably.

[01:33:16] Yeah.

[01:33:16] Um, Takashi, you know he has a very specific style too.

[01:33:22] Oh yeah.

[01:33:24] Um, I don't know it's just one of those things where

[01:33:27] you know often imitated never duplicated you know nobody

[01:33:32] can ever touch that style.

[01:33:35] No, but you see my biggest thing is like I I know

[01:33:40] Toyotaru can you know like I said he's improved a lot

[01:33:44] as an artist.

[01:33:45] Um, I think for the most part he can handle the drawing

[01:33:51] aspect of it but who knows what the the writing aspect

[01:33:57] like yeah the stories are going to be hard to tell.

[01:34:00] Yeah, who knows how that's going to kind of pan out.

[01:34:04] Um, especially like like is he going to keep

[01:34:11] kind of emulating like Toriyama style with the writing?

[01:34:16] Is he going to kind of start to lean more towards

[01:34:18] fan-thicky stuff like what he started with?

[01:34:21] Who knows, you know.

[01:34:24] I'm hoping that he stays true to Toriyama's overall vision.

[01:34:29] What puts some of his own flair to it?

[01:34:33] If uh if we never get adult go tanks then we know.

[01:34:37] Yeah.

[01:34:39] Uh, because they faked this out with that again in one of

[01:34:41] the most recent manga chapters.

[01:34:44] We got another fucking fake out with adult go tanks.

[01:34:48] Just trolling us at this point.

[01:34:51] Yeah, well they call them trolleyama for a reason.

[01:34:55] Yeah.

[01:34:57] Now Sandland that was his official title.

[01:35:00] Last thing he drew right like a Manga wise.

[01:35:04] Uh, no actually Sandlands pretty old.

[01:35:08] Is it?

[01:35:09] I thought it was like 10,000.

[01:35:11] Yeah, it was like the original 2000.

[01:35:12] Jaco was newer than that.

[01:35:13] Oh, Jaco is newer.

[01:35:15] Jaco, he wrote that I think in tandem with

[01:35:18] battle of gods.

[01:35:20] Like that was supposed to be like a supplemental to

[01:35:22] battle of gods.

[01:35:23] And that's why Jaco was like a very good guy.

[01:35:25] Yeah.

[01:35:26] Like that was supposed to be like a supplemental to battle of

[01:35:28] gods.

[01:35:29] And that's why Jaco was in the resurrection f movie.

[01:35:32] Gotcha.

[01:35:35] Aside from that.

[01:35:37] I should really just bring up a,

[01:35:39] probably just bring up a thing of his work so I can

[01:35:41] actually see what he made and when.

[01:35:44] Yeah, I have no idea what the last thing he like his

[01:35:46] last official manga was.

[01:35:49] Like that he actually wrote and drew himself.

[01:35:54] So.

[01:35:56] Looking at it like most of his stuff was obviously in the

[01:35:58] 80s and 90s.

[01:36:02] Well, I guess he was doing Neko Majin.

[01:36:07] From 99 to 05.

[01:36:09] That's another one I really hope we finally get.

[01:36:11] I would love to get Neko Majin.

[01:36:14] So Sandland was 2000.

[01:36:16] Yeah, that makes sense.

[01:36:20] So there was a doctor Masher Rito in 2007.

[01:36:28] Which that was like the main antagonist and doctor slump.

[01:36:33] Okay.

[01:36:35] Jaco was 2013.

[01:36:37] So that's obviously the most recent thing he did exclusively.

[01:36:41] Yeah, that's what I figured, but I didn't know if it was.

[01:36:44] Cause I mean I.

[01:36:46] I was staying pretty much.

[01:36:49] Up to date with a lot of his stuff like since.

[01:36:52] The Dragon Ball resurgence.

[01:36:54] It was battle of gods.

[01:36:55] I feel like I feel like it's something else that come out.

[01:36:57] I would hear about it.

[01:36:59] Yeah, other than that.

[01:37:00] Yeah, Jaco was the most recent thing, although that's.

[01:37:06] Technically has Dragon Ball spin off now.

[01:37:09] Yeah, I mean, you can make an argument and say the last

[01:37:11] thing he wrote himself was superhero.

[01:37:15] True.

[01:37:16] Cause he did write that story.

[01:37:18] Yeah, he's written the script for the last three

[01:37:20] Dragon Ball movies.

[01:37:23] And they're three of the best.

[01:37:25] Well, well.

[01:37:27] Except for resurrection F.

[01:37:29] Yeah, that one's.

[01:37:32] That one didn't really need to be a thing.

[01:37:34] No, well, I mean it could have just.

[01:37:39] It was a little bit too.

[01:37:42] Action focused and not enough story.

[01:37:45] It was too big.

[01:37:48] For a movie and I think the anime adaption kind of proved that.

[01:37:52] Yeah, I think.

[01:37:54] I think superhero was.

[01:37:59] Was a good place to leave it.

[01:38:02] Yeah, I mean superhero.

[01:38:04] I think.

[01:38:06] That storyline was perfect because he.

[01:38:08] He subverted so many expectations with that movie.

[01:38:12] And that, that.

[01:38:13] That movie is just so classic Toriyama.

[01:38:16] It's so like, you know.

[01:38:19] So goofy, so silly.

[01:38:21] Lots of gags, but also like had that kind of style to it.

[01:38:25] Had that high action.

[01:38:28] But at the same, even with all the high action, like all those.

[01:38:31] Like crazy, like go on getting angry power up stuff.

[01:38:34] It was all, it was all fakeouts because Pam is never in any actual

[01:38:37] danger until like cell showed up.

[01:38:40] Yeah.

[01:38:43] Yep.

[01:38:45] But we did get, we got, we got a Goku and Gohan movie.

[01:38:49] I mean, not Goku, a Piccolo and Gohan movie, which we never thought

[01:38:52] we were going to get.

[01:38:54] Yeah, that wasn't even in the problem of possibility in my mind.

[01:38:56] Well, especially because the fake out like art, like posters and

[01:38:59] trailers that had Goku all like full on like.

[01:39:03] Present like throughout all of them and it's like, nope, he's only

[01:39:06] in like 10 minutes of the film.

[01:39:09] If that.

[01:39:10] Yeah.

[01:39:12] But I don't know.

[01:39:14] I'm hoping things.

[01:39:17] Things go forward with the Dragon Ball Super Manga.

[01:39:20] I'm.

[01:39:21] I'm hoping things go forward with the Dragon Ball Super Manga.

[01:39:24] Cause the last.

[01:39:27] The last chapter ended with a sparring match between Goku and

[01:39:31] Gohan that was about to start.

[01:39:35] Like they just kind of barely started touching fists.

[01:39:38] Like the real fight is going to be in the next chapter later this

[01:39:41] month.

[01:39:42] And I'm looking forward to that.

[01:39:44] Yeah.

[01:39:46] That's just, that's probably the, the last piece of manga he's

[01:39:50] touched.

[01:39:52] Like the last chapter of the game.

[01:39:54] I'm hoping that the next chapter is going to be a little bit

[01:39:57] more of a tribute or something.

[01:40:00] Oh, I'm sure.

[01:40:02] I'm sure.

[01:40:06] Yeah.

[01:40:08] I'm hoping a lot of that stuff that we never got over here

[01:40:10] will, will be.

[01:40:12] Made more of a priority now.

[01:40:14] Things like the slump things like, um, like they come

[01:40:17] margin.

[01:40:19] I'm amazed with just how.

[01:40:21] Popular Toriyama is that how much of his stuff is still.

[01:40:24] Right now.

[01:40:26] You know, he's been doing some great stuff for, for a while

[01:40:29] in the past few months.

[01:40:30] Yeah.

[01:40:31] I mean, he did his thing back in the day of why doctor slump

[01:40:34] never made it over here. And that like the whole concept was

[01:40:36] like, oh.

[01:40:38] The Japanese humor doesn't translate very well, but that's

[01:40:40] not even like a real.

[01:40:42] That's not even a real argument anymore because there's so many

[01:40:45] gag mongas and comments like comedy mongas and stuff like

[01:40:50] culture who work on these things that they could definitely do it now 100%

[01:40:57] I mean if Ozamanga Dio can get a full Amubis release over here

[01:41:02] There's no excuse. There's no excuse

[01:41:05] Like I'm just saying the original of Dr. Slump manga or anime I should say

[01:41:12] Absolutely could be dubbed today with oh, yeah with the knowledge and skills that we have nowadays

[01:41:19] With the amount with the amount of garbage that gets dubbed nowadays. There's no excuse for

[01:41:25] Something like that not getting dubbed

[01:41:28] for sure and now with

[01:41:32] Now that Funimation has been absorbed by crunchy roll like they could easily well other way around technically but well

[01:41:42] And it's actually Sony is one of the most but whatever

[01:41:45] Sony Sony bought both of them and then basically was like go together now

[01:41:51] What the crunchy roll name is more bigger outside of the US fine use that one? Yeah, but it's still Funimation basically

[01:41:58] Yeah

[01:41:59] Well, I mean they still have like the studio and they still do the same stuff like that

[01:42:03] But it's all branded now. Did you see all the go the goodbyes from all the little off topic here

[01:42:10] Did you see like when the they closed down the Funimation servers like officially all the other Funimation actors were like posting their goodbyes and

[01:42:19] Then my favorite one was Dallas Reed who literally said goodbye Funimation

[01:42:25] I won't miss you because I'm literally going there the next day because nothing's changed

[01:42:32] That tweet was then later deleted so I'm assuming he got yelled at for saying that but I'm like I'm like Dallas

[01:42:37] Reed's the only real one here. Yeah, it's about right. It's just literally nothing changed

[01:42:43] It's not like any of them lost a job. No, they just changed the name on the door. Oh, well

[01:42:52] Yeah

[01:42:54] Still can't believe it though. It's like the end of an era in a way

[01:42:58] It really is I mean like who knows

[01:43:01] Where things are gonna go from here with even just the what the anime and manga sphere in general let alone

[01:43:08] Like just looking at Dragon Ball particular or Dragon Quest for that matter what gets me even more though with

[01:43:16] Toriyama is like we said it earlier. He wasn't that old so it's like this really kind of like

[01:43:22] Makes you realize like any of these guys can go or guys or girls gals can go like at any time

[01:43:29] I use guys as a collective term. I know

[01:43:31] It's just it's crazy because I think of Toriyama as the old guard, but it's like he was only 68

[01:43:40] He really wasn't that old

[01:43:42] Oh for real. I mean friggin Shatner's in his 90s. He's still kicking

[01:43:47] Ozzy Osbourne still alive so now yeah, right

[01:43:50] I think how the fuck is Ozzy still alive and Toriyama isn't like that

[01:43:54] What kind of world do we live in Ozzy is actually a confirmed mutant like he's got some weird genetic

[01:44:00] Thing that like makes his body super resistant to like bullshit basically

[01:44:04] Yeah, well it makes sense. Although it is apparently catching up to him because that's why he's not really touring anymore, but

[01:44:10] Yeah, well, it was gonna happen eventually

[01:44:13] Yeah, it's it's it sucks. It really does

[01:44:17] yeah

[01:44:19] I'm trying to think like who are the other big writers from that era like other than like I

[01:44:25] Guess uh Tagashi Tagashi was from that era as well

[01:44:29] Kind of I

[01:44:32] Mean he didn't really I

[01:44:34] Mean, I don't know what he had before you Haka show up anything

[01:44:39] You Haka show came out in 90. So by that point Toriyama was already 10 years deep

[01:44:45] True, I forget Dragon Ball is a lot older than we actually think it is. I mean you also got to figure

[01:44:50] He's been going since before Dragon Ball, you know, Dr

[01:44:53] Slump was four years before Dragon Ball started

[01:44:56] When did Dr. Slump come out stomp the slump come out? I'm pretty sure it was 1980

[01:45:04] Let me double check cuz I got his

[01:45:06] So he was writing stuff in the 70s like Wonder Island was the 70s

[01:45:12] Yeah, like he had a lot of his like

[01:45:14] His one shots and stuff that he tried to get going before

[01:45:20] Dr. Slump caught

[01:45:22] Yeah, so Dr. Slump was 1980 to 1984

[01:45:31] Sorry, I was gonna say like Dragon Ball didn't Dragon Ball was 84 to 95

[01:45:37] Okay, wow, I was actually I was actually dead on with it with the years

[01:45:42] in that 80 to 95

[01:45:44] yeah

[01:45:46] Surprised I thought I was off

[01:45:48] Yeah, that is weird now I'm actually trying to think who were the other like Magikos at the time I

[01:45:57] Don't know I think

[01:46:02] The I know the Berserk author started Berserk in the late 80s true

[01:46:10] I don't even I don't even know what was out back then

[01:46:19] I

[01:46:21] Taro Mira was the creator of berserk

[01:46:25] We lost him what two three years ago

[01:46:28] Yeah, and he and even then berserk only started in 89. So that's like borderline 90s. Yeah, he's basically right there with Takashi

[01:46:40] yeah, we lost a

[01:46:42] we lost a

[01:46:43] Mira in a

[01:46:46] 2021 and he was only 54

[01:46:48] So even even he was he was super young

[01:46:52] Compared to that. That's just nuts

[01:47:00] So I guess closing thoughts because I'm not we're kind of just rambling at this point it's just kind of sad

[01:47:08] Yeah, but

[01:47:14] Not a fun day no, but I mean I guess at least like

[01:47:19] When thinking about it we can at least appreciate what we did get and like what he did do for anime manga just

[01:47:27] Japanese media in general

[01:47:29] Not even just Japanese meter just animation and like

[01:47:33] Art in general like how much of an influence he had

[01:47:37] Yeah, I

[01:47:39] Hope wherever he is now. He understands fully now how how truly beloved and

[01:47:46] Irreplaceable he was

[01:47:48] Yeah

[01:47:49] They'll never be another Dragon Ball. Well, yeah

[01:47:52] There I mean there's other series that have have the same staying power as Dragon Ball

[01:47:57] But they'll never be another series like Dragon Ball

[01:47:59] No, it was a one in a million one a billion

[01:48:04] Chance for something like that. I think me some of my Toriyama could make it

[01:48:09] I think it hits them us millennials the hardest because it was our anime

[01:48:15] like the the

[01:48:17] Well millennials are kind of split like we got earlier like mid millennials to like late millennials

[01:48:22] We're really into Dragon Ball then like a combination of late millennials to like early zoomers were into Naruto and now like

[01:48:30] zoomers are all into

[01:48:32] My hero academia and whatever the other the big ones are nowadays demons layer demons layer

[01:48:38] Yeah

[01:48:40] Black Clover, I mean I'm into black clover black black clover is kind of like the second tier one at this point

[01:48:47] Well rest in peace Toriyama

[01:48:55] Yeah

[01:48:56] Yeah, and we'll uh, we'll be talking more about Dragon Ball in the future because we had two episodes playing that we kind of pushed off

[01:49:04] So next week we'll be talking more Dragon Ball

[01:49:06] Yes and the week after and probably plenty of times after that yeah probably not in a row but

[01:49:14] In general

[01:49:15] Yeah

[01:49:18] But uh, yeah anyways guys once again, thank you for joining us on this very somber episode of Geek Addix

[01:49:24] You can find Geek Addix and all your major podcasting platforms in the GNC podcast feed

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[01:49:49] And with that everybody we will see you all later