Final Fantasy VII Rebirth | Postgame Show

[00:00:00] Hello everybody, it's your boy Dre off the top here to warn you that this Final Fantasy

[00:00:05] 7 Rebirth post game show assumes that you have already played the game. Which means this entire

[00:00:11] podcast will contain full spoilers for the game from beginning to end. We're not holding back

[00:00:18] whatsoever so this is your one and only warning to turn off this episode right now if you don't

[00:00:23] want to be spoiled on Final Fantasy 7 Rebirth. Also we're naturally going to be doing comparisons

[00:00:29] to the events of Final Fantasy 7 Remake as well as like the original Final Fantasy 7. So all things

[00:00:36] in the Final Fantasy 7 Sphere are going to be talked about with reckless abandon. So if you don't want

[00:00:42] spoilers on these games we don't blame you, we'll catch you next time on Fine Time but if

[00:00:46] you're going to continue on with us we thank you and we're going to get started right now.

[00:00:51] Fine Time is about to...

[00:01:43] Um and that is uh so I've experienced a bit of a rebirth. I am not only your curmudgeon in crime

[00:01:49] but I'm also your setra in crime. That's still CIC. It is yeah it's right yeah setra in crime.

[00:01:59] Have we ever seen a male setra? I don't think we've ever... Not that I remember.

[00:02:06] I could be the first one. Okay yeah I mean look I'm sure they exist but it could be like

[00:02:11] one of those things like a you know Wonder Woman or something where it's just women and then they

[00:02:15] just you know use a man to get pregnant and then just possibly the sea or whatever they're whatever

[00:02:19] they do in Wonder Woman. I don't know. Whatever they do indeed yes. Yeah we're here we're

[00:02:25] going to talk Final Fantasy 7 Rebirth. I am real excited and you know we kind of played this

[00:02:31] game in tandem. I beat the game I think a few days ahead of you or whatever. Just a bit yeah.

[00:02:37] Yeah and we're done and we want to talk about it a lot but first I want to start with our thoughts on

[00:02:44] the original Final Fantasy 7 because I think it's important you know let's let's just start at the

[00:02:50] beginning so everyone can have our thoughts leading up to rebirth. I think that's what we should do.

[00:02:55] It feels correct okay. I feel correct doing this. Yes it does. So back in the day this

[00:03:01] obviously I anticipated Final Fantasy 7 as much as anyone else did. I was looking forward to

[00:03:06] this game and then it came out and I liked it but I was never in love with it. I think that's the best

[00:03:14] way to say it. I thought the gameplay of the original was really great. I loved the materia

[00:03:19] system you know. I loved the summons you know. I loved the amount of mini games and stuff like

[00:03:24] that and there's like all sorts of secrets on the world map and shit that was cool and of course

[00:03:29] the presentation is insane and to this day it's still insane presentationally but I just never

[00:03:37] connected with those characters. I just didn't really like them all that much. Some of them

[00:03:43] I had no feelings on at all like I had no feelings about Titha or Eris at the time

[00:03:48] that she was at all. Yeah they just existed. Eris was just you know nature lady who gets

[00:03:55] stabbed later to be a martyr for the rest of the game. I guess you know like I just didn't get it.

[00:04:00] Cloud was a dick. I didn't really understand his character very much. I didn't like him.

[00:04:04] Barrett embarrassing right? So like characters not great. Plot is whatever. Sefroth villain.

[00:04:12] I guess he looks cool and that's about it. So the original game gameplay wise pretty excellent

[00:04:18] story and character wise not so much. So it just it worked out to being fine. That's how

[00:04:22] I felt back in the day. What did you feel about Final Fantasy 7 originally?

[00:04:27] You know the funny thing is that so I had been quite the square salt fanboy up to this point right

[00:04:31] so I mean coming off of Final Fantasy 4 and 6 I was really excited to see where this game

[00:04:38] was going to go. So I actually played the demo disc with Tobol number one like a lot.

[00:04:43] I played it several a bunch of times just because I was so fascinated from a presentation

[00:04:48] perspective and like there's just so many like pre-rendered backgrounds and all these different

[00:04:53] angles and just presentationally it was mind blowing and I still maintain it does a lot of

[00:04:58] cool things visually but it's just I agree though it's like as much as like the journey

[00:05:03] and like the sci-fi tropes and all of that. It's just the personalities are really dry right

[00:05:08] and the the story's pacing really soured me especially like around the end of disc two

[00:05:13] it just drags man so like it's actually the point I just don't really I just haven't felt like replaying

[00:05:19] the game like at all like I beat it once and then I tried to play it again a few years later but I

[00:05:23] don't think I finished that run and ever since I'm just like I think I'm good man so I mean like

[00:05:28] yeah I I think it does some cool stuff mechanically but just like it's hard to get past that plot.

[00:05:33] Yeah you know what you're right it does drag I never really thought about it that way it

[00:05:38] does actually once you get I would say you're right like halfway through disc two at some point it just

[00:05:44] kind of hits a lull and it I don't think it ever really recovers from that because like the only

[00:05:49] thing you can do after that like this three is just go beat Sephiroth right so it's like it's not

[00:05:54] really yeah you're kind of right. Yeah because he just had to cram the cinematics into disc three

[00:06:00] that was the reason why you need another disc. Yeah but like it yeah you're correct so we're

[00:06:07] in agreement on that let's also establish how we felt about remake okay because coming out of that

[00:06:14] how we felt about the original I wanted to try remake because I realized they were doing

[00:06:21] something really different in a great way at like the very first thing I noticed right off the bat

[00:06:27] was like the characters are actually characters. Oh my god right as soon as Barrett spoke like

[00:06:34] two sentences and he wasn't embarrassing he wasn't Mr. T or whatever like I was relieved I knew right

[00:06:42] then and there that this game was going to fix my crippling issues with the first game and yeah

[00:06:48] I really enjoyed remake it's not perfect there are some dungeons that kind of suck in fact I

[00:06:54] would maybe say most of them kind of suck I mean if I'm gonna be honest but that doesn't

[00:06:59] that doesn't mean like they're like it's a terrible game I actually do really like remake it has

[00:07:04] great characterization side quests not so much as most of the dungeons not great but all the character

[00:07:10] stuff and like visually and the battle system of course I thought were a lot of fun battle system

[00:07:16] is not perfect much more refined in rebirth but still really good start and yeah I enjoyed

[00:07:22] what did you feel about remake? I'm in agreement that really my biggest takeaways of the characters

[00:07:27] feel like actual people that you can get behind and support and all of that versus before

[00:07:32] and I do also feel like the areas feel like a bit too constrained for their own good but I guess

[00:07:39] you gotta make it run on PlayStation 4 somehow right? Yeah that's PS4 it's the best they could do

[00:07:44] literally the best they could do yeah pretty much um another big takeaway was their willingness

[00:07:49] to subvert expectations which I thought was pretty surprising like the the very end of the

[00:07:54] remake goes off the rails so it kind of set the stage for some shenanigans in rebirth right

[00:07:59] so like I was just wondering like what they were going to do next. Well it's the expansion of everything

[00:08:05] right the expansion of wall market and like it's like to me that was always like the worst part

[00:08:10] of Midgar it's just kind of boring okay go get the dress okay go in here okay blah blah blah

[00:08:15] really long cutscene okay canara all that shit was crazy good in remake it's such a spectacle

[00:08:21] it's so cool yeah it's my favorite part it's my favorite part of the game it's my favorite

[00:08:25] part of the game straight up they turned the worst part of Midgar for me into my favorite part of the

[00:08:30] game yeah actual moments yeah it was great and then yeah all the character stuff with cloud and

[00:08:37] erith you know just adventuring around I mean all that stuff is great I think so yeah character

[00:08:44] moments and spectacle you were getting it all in that so it's like okay I'm really looking forward

[00:08:50] to rebirth especially with the way they left it with kind of the ghost of zacking you know carrying

[00:08:57] that almost dead body a cloud shuffling off towards Midgar right so it ended that way and I was like

[00:09:04] oh my fucking god what is this shit it's crazy because we're not even like big zack fanboys or

[00:09:10] anything but we're like wait a second that's not how I played out so I'm like wait what's

[00:09:14] what's going on man like yeah they had a thing going for sure okay so typically on fine time we like

[00:09:37] to get really deep into like gameplay stuff like battle systems and traversal mechanics and like

[00:09:44] world construction and you know even graphics and stuff like that but as far as Final Fantasy 7

[00:09:50] rebirth goes we didn't really want to do that we're not gonna do that this time because we'd rather

[00:09:56] focus on like like we're just talking about story and characters and music and stuff like that instead

[00:10:03] that's really when it comes down to it that's what matters to us here so that's what we're

[00:10:07] gonna talk about today by virtue of you listening to this you you've played Final Fantasy 7 rebirth

[00:10:14] probably I hope so because you're about to get real spoiled if you didn't uh-huh and so you know

[00:10:19] whether you like the game or not we don't have to explain what the game is to you you know

[00:10:23] already so that's kind of why we wanted to focus on the other stuff today and the other stuff is so

[00:10:28] impactful too which is why we're focusing on it yep so but okay before we get into that stuff

[00:10:35] the character story or whatever let's just kind of tie up with a bow how we felt about rebirth

[00:10:42] as a whole since we're not really gonna talk about that other stuff let's just say what we

[00:10:46] think of the game let's start with you what did you think of rebirth as a whole you know

[00:10:50] the funny thing is I told you this during my run but I basically said that $70 was practically

[00:10:55] selling themselves short and I can safely say this game's gonna give you a lot more value for

[00:11:00] your buck than most other games in recent memory like it probably could have been 80 or 90 dollars

[00:11:05] and it would have actually justified that right and that's like that's crazy to think about

[00:11:09] because like in the wake of everyone complaining about prices or stuff like that there's just

[00:11:13] so much in this game like I haven't done everything in there there's so much in here to do

[00:11:18] and um but really uh so far as the game itself goes they've expanded areas in full into full

[00:11:25] flesh environments in a way that's really compelling right like I never in a thousand years thought I

[00:11:30] would have remembered anything about like gungaga or even like june right but they made these real

[00:11:34] places full of people full of like moments that stick out in your mind right so like in

[00:11:40] comparison if I'm not totally mistaken I think gungaga is optional in the original

[00:11:45] game I believe that's yes I yeah so you don't even have to go there so yeah it's it's crazy I also

[00:11:51] think it's like really abbreviated uh I don't really think it's much of a presence there at all

[00:11:55] but uh in comparison with the original game like uh this makes the original seem extremely sparse

[00:12:01] like I've intermittently looked at uh footage of the original and I'm just like oh how holy

[00:12:05] smoke by original do you mean like 1997 final fantasy seven or like remake 97 90 okay

[00:12:12] yeah it's a really funny comparison to make um well I mean it's not a comparison at all I mean like

[00:12:19] that's not no look at look at those cheesy pre-renders of the golden saucer before of like

[00:12:24] jumping through these little poops versus like what we got in this game we'll get to that of course

[00:12:29] but for what it was worth those pre-renders still age well 200 degrees just you know it's

[00:12:36] in comparison to what we got it's not if they don't look bad I don't think the original

[00:12:40] game looks bad I think that game will always look good because of the craft put in there but

[00:12:45] come on like what we have now um exactly but yeah so it sounds like you really love this game you

[00:12:53] you really enjoyed rebirth I did absolutely yeah um that's that sums it up nicely I got a lot out

[00:13:01] of it and it was full of very impactful moments that's for sure though those are the moments

[00:13:06] we want to talk about today but as for me this wildly exceeded my expectations my expectations were high

[00:13:13] that tgs trailer from last September that shit blew me away when they were showing all the chocobo

[00:13:19] stuff all the racing the mini games the everything and I was like oh my god they're doing everything

[00:13:27] this is now instantly my most anticipated game and it went way beyond what I thought I'll have

[00:13:35] to sit with this game for a while to know if it's like one of my favorite jrpg's like ever it probably is

[00:13:41] but I can say this right now with confidence final fantasy 7 rebirth might be the most generous game

[00:13:51] I've ever played mm-hmm all this game does is give and give and give and give some more

[00:13:58] it and when you think it's done it gives you even more yes it does I loved it all I love the

[00:14:06] battle system I love the world I love the side quests I love the mini games I love the music

[00:14:10] and the characters the towns I loved every single thing about this game and I don't think I've stopped

[00:14:17] thinking about it since I beat it you know um we like a streamer maximillion dude right and he's a

[00:14:23] big final fantasy 7 fanboy and I watched some of his playthroughs and I think he nailed it like when

[00:14:28] you first get let loose and calm he was like within five minutes he's like this is disneyland holy

[00:14:35] shit this is disneyland that's such a way of putting it he's right it is disneyland it's almost

[00:14:41] like you went to a final fantasy 7 theme park it's like oh shit over there is calm let's go see

[00:14:47] oh and there's there's people dancing on the street oh I can play cards a whole entire card

[00:14:53] game with people oh I get you know there's a jazz band just playing final fantasy 7 tunes right over

[00:14:59] here yes like what what the hell is this he's right it's disneyland it's the ultimate playground

[00:15:06] right there's just an everything's an attraction yeah you can like you know what got me you know

[00:15:11] really got me is we the fact that you could just jump in the stream and calm yeah jump in the

[00:15:16] water and think about how many games don't let you do stuff like that yeah you know in this game so

[00:15:22] like oh no you can do that oh wow I can even do that okay I know it sounds simple but like

[00:15:27] again games take so long to make and there's so many systems on top of systems that like

[00:15:32] sometimes you literally cannot just make stuff like that it's much harder than it seems to do

[00:15:38] yeah they just didn't they don't care and also another side is that it all works like

[00:15:45] except for some minor collision bugs I didn't really like bug out during my run like whatsoever

[00:15:50] I had one minor collision bug that didn't affect gameplay at all and I had one weird enemy encounter

[00:15:57] in temple of the ancient so I think I sent you a video of yeah where I fell off a platform and

[00:16:03] then I teleported back to it was really strange other than that that's like the only weird

[00:16:07] thing that happened to me and think about that this time last year just about I was

[00:16:12] complaining my ass off about Jedi survivor you know what still isn't as stable as this game right

[00:16:18] come on it's crazy it's insane how stable it is

[00:16:26] okay I think where I want to start is like characters and character moments because

[00:16:32] like obviously that's the heart and soul of the game and that's what we care about the most so

[00:16:38] I would like to start there and I guess we could start wherever you want but I think

[00:16:43] here's a good place to start it out I think the voice acting and Final Fantasy 7 rebirth is exceptional

[00:16:51] this is something I really want to commend because think back to stuff like not that long ago like

[00:16:56] like Final Fantasy 13 or something which is which is like so stiff and so unnatural

[00:17:02] and so terrible or even think about like again I know this is going to be 20 years ago but

[00:17:07] think about like Dergis Cerberus or like not that the voice acting was bad but just like the cut scene

[00:17:13] direction too was just like so robotic and stiff we come a long way right it's insane how far it's

[00:17:20] come yeah just like the natural directions of scenes and talking and everything feels so good

[00:17:27] and so natural that it's almost underrated how good the voices are so I wanted to take

[00:17:33] the time up front to say how good it is like the whole cast like meet like some people have

[00:17:39] feelings about Sid's voice I don't but you know that's about it really you know I've also heard

[00:17:45] some rumblings about Sid but let's be frank like I think the voice fits and I don't really

[00:17:50] know what people necessarily expected but the performance is a lot of fun it's great

[00:17:56] and everyone else again they sound like believable people there's also something to be said for

[00:18:01] conveying a lot of impact with subtlety which is what remake and rebirth do well um they're not

[00:18:07] overacted and like these characters just feel like uh people man yeah that's all I've ever wanted

[00:18:14] that's all I want from any RPG I want people I want to be around I don't even necessarily

[00:18:21] have to like them I just have to think they're interesting I don't have to like everybody that

[00:18:25] I don't like Yuffie right but she's interesting she's an interesting person versus like the original

[00:18:32] game where she's just an annoying brat and that's like the entirety of her personality

[00:18:36] it's so one-dimensional I can't stand it I'm just gonna steal your shit yeah I'm just gonna

[00:18:42] steal your shit bitch bye right bye bitch harm as a bitch and then like you know but in this

[00:18:49] game she's you know you understand she's actually portrayed like a teen the teenager she is

[00:18:55] they lead it to it yep yeah absolutely it was just and another thing is that like but the fact

[00:19:00] that Yuffie's not optional this time really adds a lot as well because they could actually like

[00:19:03] lead into character moments whereas before it's like well maybe she's there maybe she's not so

[00:19:07] it's like kind of weird well yeah I mean like okay well first of all there's no way that

[00:19:13] we're gonna let Vincy Vincy did I just make Vincent and Yuffie one person Vincy yes

[00:19:20] did I just ship them that's something to think about yeah thanks I just shipped them

[00:19:26] anyway there's no way there's no way they would make Vincy optional this time because it's like

[00:19:31] come on there's so to everybody they're basically part of the game like okay in part three

[00:19:36] there's no way Knights of the Round is going to be optional that's Final Fantasy 7

[00:19:42] you know come on yeah I never thought that I mean I'm not saying you thought that would be the

[00:19:48] case but I'm you know I just no way but uh going back to voice acting in particular

[00:19:54] I want to really commend Clouds voice actor he had a really hard job here and he nailed it

[00:20:01] like to to have to convey suppressing like your true self and he also has to act like his real

[00:20:08] self quote-unquote real self in the Nebelheim flashback which is like you know almost acting

[00:20:14] like two different people in a way and on top of that he has to convey how like manipulated he is

[00:20:20] by Sephiroth which obviously comes out during chapter 13 and I guess before that too but yeah

[00:20:26] there's bits of pieces yeah yeah like you know like the deeper he goes into the temple of the

[00:20:30] ancient some more like Sephiroth he becomes some more possessed he comes some more you know

[00:20:35] cut off he becomes from reality and you have to convey that it's it's really great stuff we'll

[00:20:42] get to those scenes later but like I just wanted to say that it was it was great

[00:20:48] it was super great just because you feel the awkwardness from Clouds voice right

[00:20:53] and that's sort of a place where we've all been to like a degree like he's not just some cookie

[00:20:58] cutter person so like he's his mental state is not all there and for that sort of uh

[00:21:05] awkwardness to just be portrayed via his voice that's like some really fascinating storytelling

[00:21:09] man it's really good stuff I've never been a Sephiroth fanboy by any means uh mainly because

[00:21:16] he was never much of a character to me so much as just like an entity which is not really

[00:21:21] that interesting if he asked me but whatever people liked him because he looks cool I guess

[00:21:26] he has a cool sword but in an RPG I need more than that to care about a villain he doesn't

[00:21:30] have more his hair yeah oh great hair that lori al last hair oh my god do you like that shot of

[00:21:38] the like that slo-mo shot during the the nibelheim flashback or if like you know when they do

[00:21:43] like their team up attack what is it called I forget what it's called synergy synergy attacks

[00:21:49] yeah yeah we're just do so it's like it does that slo-mo pan of Sephiroth and his hair is like

[00:21:55] it's like that's great all so good what it was like what is this panting pro v commercial last

[00:22:01] fucking we don't want to be like Sephiroth I mean I do now my god he's beautiful but um

[00:22:12] but yeah the original never gave me any reason to care but in rebirth they start you out with

[00:22:17] that famous cloud and Sephiroth flashback in nibelheim and lo and behold Sephiroth is an actual

[00:22:24] person with an actual personality for the first time ever yes I know the scene existed in the

[00:22:30] original game but it wasn't like this oh it was just so transient it was barely like like anything

[00:22:38] yeah and because of how well rebirth handled this getting to play as Sephiroth in the first

[00:22:44] chapter was so fucking cool it almost felt forbidden I'm like oh my god am I am I using a game shark

[00:22:50] right now am I allowed to do this absolutely yeah and uh the the flashbacks really like give you a

[00:22:58] glimpse of how he kind of melts down right which is like the driving force of the whole story

[00:23:03] but um and the little touches really convey a lot uh he runs like a maniac when he's after

[00:23:08] he's done reading him just like oh that was really unsettling yeah and uh he like tosses cloud like a

[00:23:15] like a rag doll like so you really get a glimpse of just how powerful he is man oh in the man

[00:23:20] chain we just have force push like the push yeah force pushes him yeah yeah he got wrecked by oh

[00:23:26] my god he's got wrecked by Sephiroth yeah it's it's it's something um one relatively

[00:23:33] minor thing that actually was rather poignant to me was an early scene in which uh Barrett and

[00:23:39] Red 13 fall into the water in the mines Red actually was by nonchalantly and toss taunts

[00:23:45] Barrett about floating there and I never would have expected Red to actually like say anything

[00:23:49] like that because normally he's so straight laced it was then and there when I realized that um

[00:23:55] is expanding the original 97 game and because I couldn't even tell you like an experience

[00:24:01] where like Barrett and Red 13 had a meaningful conversation before and they group these characters

[00:24:06] up to build some dynamics and that's great man I feel like everyone kind of gets that right yeah I

[00:24:11] feel like I feel like Tifa when Yuffie's really uh uh motion sick or whatever I feel like Tifa is

[00:24:18] really the one who really like by the way the way they played that up in this game lol like

[00:24:23] really like it happens so often too it's like okay it's like I'm on a I'm on a plane I'm on a boat

[00:24:31] uh I guess like literally the only time it doesn't happen is when she's riding her own chocobo but

[00:24:35] everything else just like I'm gonna feel sick this mine cart's too much but no you're right no I

[00:24:42] did think about that in the Mithril caves excellent fucking place by the way that's how

[00:24:46] I knew this game was going to be special when I got to the myth myth rule myth rule minds

[00:24:50] Mithril caves whatever it's called and I was like wait this is actually good like this dungeon

[00:24:56] more than a 90s g rpg dungeon well not just that but the compared to the dungeons and remake which

[00:25:02] were mostly not that fun like this was like oh my god this is actually good anyway yeah

[00:25:07] that I love the interactions like that um one such interaction I really like maybe might be

[00:25:13] one of my favorites in the game if not my favorite is the red 13 and eryth scene

[00:25:18] in Casa del Sol when they're at Johnny's shack yeah and eryth is in the shower and she comes out

[00:25:23] of the shower red 13s there just chilling by the way he just gets to look Jesus Christ and like

[00:25:31] and like that's the scene where eryth you know looks at her holy materia it's like well it was

[00:25:37] white now but now it's clear I don't know but I don't remember why it was a really that's one

[00:25:43] scene in this game I really can't piece together I don't think I fully understood what was happening

[00:25:48] there yeah it's such a mystery right I think it's deliberately kept ambiguous to your to a degree

[00:25:54] just to kind of uh subvert your expectations I guess but like to be entirely honest with you yeah

[00:26:00] it's just uh I couldn't particularly explain it well I mean think back to the end of remake

[00:26:07] where they rescue red 13 in Hojo's lab and eryth puts her hand on his head you remember that

[00:26:12] right yeah and she and then he kind of calms down and is like gained some sort of knowledge

[00:26:18] doesn't she do the same thing to Marlene that's why she knows stuff in the Zach timeline I believe so

[00:26:23] yeah yeah so it's like I still can't really put that together that's a weird one yeah I think

[00:26:32] it's deliberately kept kind of funky and and and strange I can't I can't go on without talking

[00:26:39] about this speaking of red 13 okay all right isn't it weird that everybody treats him like a dog

[00:26:45] yeah they do because to me to me he's a cat he's always been much more cat to me especially like

[00:26:51] yeah especially like a like a jag he has kind of has like jaguar nose and face to me or like a lion

[00:26:58] maybe panther like perhaps yeah yeah in his manner yeah and his mannerisms are kind of like cat-like

[00:27:04] to me I don't know you know I can see it but I think like maybe it's like the snout structure

[00:27:09] that really makes me feel like a like dog I don't know that I've always felt dog for some reason

[00:27:12] too I've never really felt thought about this which is kind of interesting since I do like cats

[00:27:17] and all that but uh yeah I think uh it might be a facial thing yeah I don't know um I do agree

[00:27:23] the mannerism's kind of screamed cat as well so um it's not really a point I've really discussed

[00:27:27] too much so uh don't really know but hey you but whenever you go anywhere especially on Castle

[00:27:34] Soul hey have your weird dog compete in like fake rocket league or whatever do some tricks yeah

[00:27:40] they run the fake rocket league yeah that's right did you play that that was so weird

[00:27:47] God this game has everything this game is fucking everything what's he expecting rocket league

[00:28:13] obviously the real rock of this game is caught in Tifa's relationship of course

[00:28:19] and I thought that was depicted so well it was so good in this game just from the opening

[00:28:26] scene obviously in calm before you even really get to play the game after the nebelheim flashback

[00:28:33] I thought it was pretty fascinating how like Tifa was already questioning his narrative right

[00:28:37] because uh she has a sort of like a hesitancy and awkwardness and she's like thinking to herself

[00:28:44] she's clearly thinking that he's full of it right that's like wait I don't remember you being there

[00:28:48] but it's just so the way those actors was really compelling because just like I don't really want

[00:28:54] to burst your bubble but did you in the in the flashback did you go through a shit because

[00:29:00] you can go to her house right and it's like you went you went in my room or something

[00:29:04] and he's like I did or something well I went in a room yeah and then I could do that it's great

[00:29:09] yeah I did that and then I went up to her wardrobe he's like did you look through my things and then

[00:29:14] I said no because I didn't want to piss her off so I didn't actually I didn't actually do that

[00:29:20] wow that's some detail yeah I didn't do it did you play my piano no I didn't play your piano

[00:29:26] or whatever you get you know because I'm sure if you do I'm sure if you dig through all that

[00:29:30] stuff you're just gonna piss her off for the rest of the game or you're gonna have to build that

[00:29:33] shit her like relationship bubble right so relationship with Tifa is one of like minus 100

[00:29:39] points out the gate because you play with your it just has like a red like brownie face or like a

[00:29:44] mad emoji that'd be amazing I remember what you did but yeah she obviously didn't tell him

[00:29:53] the truth because she's worried about his mental state but maybe she should have because

[00:29:58] I don't really think this helped anything I mean look cloud is fucked up and that's all there is to

[00:30:05] it but maybe she could have maybe this could have been over with if she had said something

[00:30:11] but you know the game though then maybe they have to have some reason to keep the story well yeah

[00:30:17] obviously for her character reasons she's really unable to say too but she really confides in

[00:30:22] erith yeah so I think I think the Tifa and erith relationship to me is something that definitely

[00:30:30] didn't exist in the original at least not like this nope I love the way they team up to tease cloud

[00:30:36] by the way sometimes when they both they hella do it from clouds like the camera's clouds

[00:30:41] perspective they hell yeah the first person camera they hella just get up in the camera

[00:30:46] like facing it like come on or whatever it's really it's a chocoboes come on it's really funny

[00:30:51] I'm also funny I love the chocobo thing okay fine yeah they hella get up in this space

[00:31:01] but yeah it's established pretty early on that Tifa is confiding in erith the stuff she knows

[00:31:05] about cloud the cloud is lying about rather it's really great and of course this comes back

[00:31:10] around in gun gaga when they visit the fairer residence Tifa was like well that clears it up

[00:31:16] he definitely doesn't know who Zach is like I was thinking myself are you like what this is crazy

[00:31:22] like what do you mean she doesn't know yeah but they just get they just can't believe it yeah and

[00:31:29] again I guess I guess erith really I don't know I guess I guess she felt like it was Tifa's

[00:31:34] call to make to not really like tell cloud and I get that it's not really her I don't think it's

[00:31:41] really her call at the same time like man just just wild oh by the way cloud is just like the

[00:31:48] ultimate bag fumbler man like Tifa's trying to like I mean it's not just an argument they have

[00:31:54] at the beginning but just a later on remember that part where like Tifa's telling us some story

[00:31:58] or something like that and he's like not listening clearly not listening and she's like

[00:32:03] you don't care do you and he's like uh not really but I'll listen if you want or something like that

[00:32:11] cloud you fucking virgin come on he's got more of a game than that surely right

[00:32:20] he was he he was fumbling the bag you got Tifa right there man just just just let's just

[00:32:29] pretend to care for a second not really it's like come on man like oh Jesus you want to talk about

[00:32:39] someone who's socially awkward there there's it's more than socially awkward I think he just can't

[00:32:44] even even if he wanted to he just he he couldn't make himself care it's it's so weird well as mental

[00:32:54] says not all there so maybe we can excuse some of it maybe of course I mean we understand the way

[00:33:00] the reason why he is the way he is and that's why this game is so great you don't understand that in

[00:33:04] the original you don't no no you do understand this because he's an actual person if the original

[00:33:09] he's just a dick he's just yeah in this game you really you want he's still a dick but you

[00:33:15] completely understand why and that's what I was saying earlier you don't have to like everybody

[00:33:20] that you're traveling with but you should find them interesting that's the most important part

[00:33:24] yeah it's not about like it's not about liking that yeah it's really not and um there's there's a

[00:33:29] something that's actually interesting in the middle of the of the run um that I affectionately

[00:33:34] call like the the space whale and the Tifa segment oh the space whale and the Tifa yeah well

[00:33:41] you you I think okay I don't know this for sure we haven't talked about this is this your

[00:33:45] favorite part of the game I think so just of how bizarre it is it's so different from anything

[00:33:51] else in Final Fantasy 7 like in any form and like it kept us really interesting sense of

[00:33:59] intrigue right so like beforehand uh cloud has like this robotic performance that's like really

[00:34:04] really terrifying and um so it kind of left us to our own devices like wondering what was going

[00:34:09] to happen next so uh I presumed that this was like the live stream right it's just because it's

[00:34:14] gonna be what else could it be what else could it be yeah it's gotta be like everything's green and

[00:34:19] like dreamlike and Tifa's experiencing visions of the past and like you can seriously just like

[00:34:24] click uh select things as if it's like a choose your own adventure kind of it's like an adventure

[00:34:28] game all of a sudden it's it's it's something I was not expecting anything like this it was

[00:34:37] crazy and of course it feels like the live stream because it definitely didn't feel like an ocean it

[00:34:41] didn't feel like you were in this wide open it felt like you were in this tunnel of of of life I guess

[00:34:50] live for a better term you know so yeah that whole sequence was insane sephroth came down there

[00:34:57] and like cut her out of like the weapon or belly thing yeah also what that was crazy man

[00:35:05] it the much like how we save cloud after like he's drowned after the snake boss

[00:35:10] you know he needs them alive your erith is the one who needs to die but he needs them alive for some

[00:35:16] reason he needs puppets like I don't know what's weird right it's so strange yeah you didn't actually

[00:35:24] oh sorry um no say you you didn't actually think Tifa was like gonna like die corncord did you

[00:35:30] no I didn't think that I didn't think they would do anything that radical yeah of course not

[00:35:35] I really didn't think the most rat the most radical thing I thought is that they would let

[00:35:40] erith live and oh boy we'll get to that later but speaking of which that's who I got on my golden

[00:35:47] saucer dates is that you also got I also got erith as well yeah well that's good so you remember

[00:35:53] the part where they were riding the ferris wheel this is of course after the nebelheim

[00:35:58] where they go back to mount nibbles right and they have they have all that stuff

[00:36:03] and then cloud remembers zack drowning it wasn't a random soldier was it was zack but then cloud

[00:36:08] says to erith did tifa talk to you about zack and then erith does flash back to a scene that we

[00:36:13] were not privy to previously where tifa does bring it up to her but then erith lies and says no

[00:36:18] tifa didn't know nothing that I can think of I was just like blushing my teeth I'm like

[00:36:23] what do you mean she didn't say anything I again I don't think it's her she felt like it wasn't

[00:36:29] her call to say it so I think uh she didn't really want to say anything she's protecting him too of

[00:36:36] course but I mean yeah but to what extent do you do you remember where you actually meet

[00:36:47] kate sith in the original gang because I don't think it was at the golden saucer

[00:36:50] I think it was definitely before that I don't think it was too much more before if it was before

[00:36:55] I'm a little hazy in the details but like yeah it wasn't in this way though like it was shuffled

[00:37:02] a little bit it wasn't when you go to the goose bumps ass like hotel the weegee's mansion

[00:37:09] ass hotel even as the lighting hell oh god the lighting is incredible

[00:37:18] it's it's so good I love excellent excellent game 10 out of 10 okay here I was me an idiot

[00:37:31] an absolute fool thinking that they might skip out on barrett in the sailor outfit

[00:37:38] not only was he in the sailor outfit but he was wearing it for a significant portion of the

[00:37:43] game enjoyed he talked about how much it is like oh I look good in this or whatever it's funny though

[00:37:50] because he was originally wearing it to uh like for disguise purposes right but then he still wore it

[00:37:56] like during coast until soul like what are you doing man it's it's beachwear I guess why not I mean

[00:38:02] yeah sure I guess I think they're on some swimming trunks I guess I don't know I guess you

[00:38:06] could just be like a basic bitch like cloud looked really weird and just a swimming trunks he's so

[00:38:12] skinny looks like a like skinny but shrunk he's moko powered okay sure that's why that's why I put

[00:38:22] him on the like uh Hawaiian shirt or something it's like dude you just need to be like yeah

[00:38:26] I think I did that too actually but yeah I don't think I should do the truck things

[00:38:31] oh the barista outfit as people call it yeah beach barista

[00:38:39] it is it is oh so good all right all right vin sent it's time to talk about vincent if you will

[00:38:49] it's time for vincent to talk about vincent vincent on vincent yeah vincent on vincent

[00:38:54] vincent x vincent yeah the nevilheim mansion is one of my favorite parts of the whole game

[00:39:01] because it has this scene that really threw me for a loop of course he's laughing already

[00:39:07] I can't help a lot about it um it so it it results in a really funny way of course it's

[00:39:12] the place where you meet vincent um so the whole time like is he going to join the party is

[00:39:17] you're not going to join the party is he going to join so he he doesn't uh right so he he

[00:39:22] crosses he gets he's like tells everyone to like like leave and so he gets back to his coffin

[00:39:28] he crosses both of his arms and then he closes the car yeah he it's like how do you how did

[00:39:35] you close the coffin when you cross your arms already this is a mini sense dog

[00:39:40] he's like I'm just kidding I'm just kidding I've gotta reach my arm I just gotta look cool for

[00:39:43] the camera time to reach my claw it's like oh wait wait hold on I need to close this

[00:39:49] you never saw this it's like what are you doing it's so it's so edgy it's so for the top

[00:39:57] it's so ridiculous and they knew it they had to do it that way they couldn't they couldn't make him

[00:40:03] anything else but what he is a late 90s edge lord you had to that's so appropriate yeah it fits

[00:40:09] it's just like the stereotypical goth crossing that looks like come on man oh it's come on dude

[00:40:16] it the dude sleeping in a fucking coffin in the middle of an abandoned mansion you better cross

[00:40:21] your goddamn arms when you go back into your coffin you better do the whole bit with your

[00:40:27] with your clickety-clack gauntlets or whatever yeah but he bamboozles us right so Vincent

[00:40:35] trolled us um and the whole party's about to fly off and so Sid is like hey you got a plus one

[00:40:43] like that I'm like what do you mean there's a plus one and this is just like right there

[00:40:49] he's like hi bitch I'm here I guess I'm coming with you like what do you do like why did you show up

[00:40:55] all of a sudden man like what are you doing he does insert himself into every scene remember near

[00:41:00] the end where they're trying to get through the the wall of whispers or whatever he sees someone

[00:41:04] gesturing at the end it's like she needs you yeah she does yeah he does do that it's like

[00:41:09] you're here too okay I guess yeah but what does he do what is he actually generally doing this

[00:41:14] the whole time right it's like sure you can kind of help them out of the temple but like what are you

[00:41:18] you're just standing there dude like what are you doing

[00:41:25] so let's talk about this and I'm sure you've noticed this too

[00:41:29] Correll Barrett's hometown Correll it had a lot more black people per capita than like any other

[00:41:37] town did you notice this is that sure did yep okay I thought this was completely by design but

[00:41:44] I'm not exactly sure what they were trying to say exactly just just because there are a fair

[00:41:50] amount of black people in other towns I mean this isn't Final Fantasy 16 after all there is

[00:41:55] there is black people around right so maybe it was just simply that since Barrett is from

[00:42:03] there it would make sense that if there was more like relatives or family or a place where there is

[00:42:08] like a larger black community I guess I think it's gotta be by design right like but for what purpose

[00:42:17] like of course it's there to establish his sort of place of origin but like I almost wonder like

[00:42:23] if they were like hinting at something else like perhaps like Shinra like exploding a community

[00:42:28] or something like that I kind of wonder if there's a deeper subtext yeah um that's that is true although

[00:42:35] Shinra exploits the fucking of everybody obviously right of course of course but this this place got

[00:42:39] blown like literally blown up though but yeah yeah yeah well it suggests a position too of that

[00:42:45] town's like relative porno versus like the splendor right up the road of agonola way is the

[00:42:51] goddamn golden saucer right yeah that's right yeah the haves versus have nots and just juxtapose

[00:42:57] like that just like in real life so well look how fucked up look how fucked up that station was and

[00:43:02] like the actual golden saw here go up to the golden saucer here that sign was all dirty and broken

[00:43:06] and shit it was just like and there's like mine carts that barely work yeah it was just the

[00:43:13] juxtaposition anyway I like this depiction of this town because it means that it means that

[00:43:19] Barrett's blackness doesn't exist in a vacuum you know like it might like it might exist in

[00:43:24] other g rpgs that feature a person of color it's not like races ever actually discussed in Final Fantasy

[00:43:30] 7 Rebirth but when you have a town like this you don't really have to you know the details told

[00:43:37] the story exactly yes I thought that was really excellent yeah storytelling via subtlety yeah well

[00:43:43] there's a thing that we'll mention time and time again and uh speaking of subtlety I have a point

[00:43:47] real quick the NPCs had so much cool stuff to see in the background just like as you walk around

[00:43:52] in town and uh that was an element I really liked in remake as well but it's way better even in Rebirth

[00:43:59] yeah in in Junan it's really crazy because there's some anti-shinra protesters and they

[00:44:04] they're like raising signs and stuff like that which really resonated with me because of course

[00:44:09] in real life there's all sorts of protests and stuff like that like it's it's it's such a

[00:44:13] timely thing it really parallels like current events in a really fascinating way whether they

[00:44:18] intended to or not right so yeah I'm not sure that was intentional I mean you could only make the

[00:44:23] game you're making you can't I mean games takes a long to make I don't think they can really

[00:44:27] capitalize on some sort of moment like that right but I mean like unless you want to really have

[00:44:32] something like late breaking oh we're about to go gold in two weeks let me try to add

[00:44:36] him you obviously can't do that it's just an anti-protest it's so hard yeah I'm sure you had

[00:44:41] some favorite like chatter like that too well there is one thing that's actually stuck out

[00:44:46] to me in calm because one of the guys actually does say like I thought calm was this backwater town

[00:44:52] but this place is actually pretty livable which which felt like a very meta comment on like the

[00:44:57] original Final Fantasy 7 where calm was just like a couple of shacks and like two screens

[00:45:02] or whatever yeah and you and I've always thought of it as a po-dunk town but now it's just like

[00:45:08] this entire like like Maximilian said it's Disneyland yeah so it's like it's it's great

[00:45:13] I feel like that person said they did that on purpose I think I have imagined so yeah there's

[00:45:20] just someone yeah it's so lived in and people are like everywhere there's just so many people

[00:45:25] in calm now yeah it's crazy it's so good yeah um and just really quick in Neymarheim there's

[00:45:32] so many hooded people just chilling there and it's almost like the people feel like they can't

[00:45:36] really help them so again that kind of touches like it almost paralleled like you know life

[00:45:41] in a way it's like you you see people that can't really do anything for other people and it's just

[00:45:45] like this sort of really awkward situation was like with homelessness and stuff like that right so I

[00:45:50] mean like I'll just almost felt like that when playing that segment yeah um I would I would be

[00:45:58] remiss if I didn't mention that the Queen's blood stuff was insane I didn't expect every person

[00:46:02] to be a character and every person to like yeah and like to have it like an entire storyline

[00:46:07] there to like comedy and something that was just wild to me crazy stuff the characters are so off the

[00:46:14] rails so like there's like a dog that's trained to play the game and I think there's a chocobo right

[00:46:19] there's a chocobo there's a there's a guy I think who is mute there's a guy there's a guy in a town

[00:46:25] in June on two who's like he's playing the guitar and he keeps singing the entire time

[00:46:29] there's that guy there's that guy there's that guy in calm who just keeps crying he's just

[00:46:34] like crying the whole time I think it played exactly yeah it was it was crazy and then it actually

[00:46:40] call mates and stuff as you get further and further along in that storyline you you fight Vincent

[00:46:46] at the mansion you have to go to the Shinra manner to play him

[00:46:50] wow yeah dude it gets crazy it gets crazy amazing wow the diversity is so cool though there's

[00:46:59] a dude in Igboheim just like the shirking work and just hiding the cord away for someone

[00:47:03] to challenge him that was like really yeah yeah yeah there's just so much variety so another thing

[00:47:09] that stood out was uh red 13th performance and Cosmo Cannon just blew me away right so like the entire

[00:47:16] game up to that point we're just basically like two thirds of the run uh he's like so straight

[00:47:20] late he said like he's so deep voice and everything so all of a sudden he calls up to his friend

[00:47:25] like this very playful upbeat tone and I'm like am I hearing something

[00:47:30] that was I was like what the hell I thought I was I thought I was imagining things but

[00:47:36] it's a sort of performance you can't get from text alone like voice intonation

[00:47:40] and like the changing thereof like he the whole thing was a facade his gross voice was

[00:47:44] a facade the whole damn time yeah I could not believe is like really the only way you could

[00:47:51] do that in like text is to give him two completely different dialects like maybe he's spoken old

[00:47:58] English before and then you give them like you know a country bumpkin uh you know what's up y'all

[00:48:04] like kind of you know what I mean that's so half afterwards yeah that's the only way you could

[00:48:08] probably like pull that off italicized versus text color differences like that's just so

[00:48:13] that's just too artificial right oh my god this is he's organically does it and I also

[00:48:19] noticed in battle from that point onwards he played he speaks in his regular voice

[00:48:23] they actually like pay attention to that they didn't switch back to his gross voice yeah I was like what

[00:48:28] um I really um as I've been learning Japanese these last few years I've really appreciated the

[00:48:32] way Final Fantasy 7 uses Japanese because not I don't think any other Final Fantasy game does this

[00:48:38] they use the way they use kanji and the way they used like the stuff is just part of the

[00:48:42] world yeah that game and there was a side quest did you do the side quest for of red 13 where

[00:48:47] they were um someone's writing a children's story I think it's in gungaga uh they're writing a

[00:48:53] children they're writing a children's book and it ends up being about red 13 and they don't

[00:48:57] really say this but I remember looking in at the poster and it said Akai Senchi no monogatari

[00:49:04] the tale the red warrior what yeah what like the cover says it or yeah the cover says it

[00:49:10] what okay yeah so but it was like you know I'm glad I'm glad I know I'm glad I can

[00:49:15] actually read this stuff it sort of enriches the world I mean you don't have to know that right

[00:49:19] but it's just it's if you do it's just a little bit of enrichment that's that's really cool that's

[00:49:24] dope that's really good yeah that's great wow yeah it actually it actually said that um hojo

[00:49:31] real quick just a classic cackling evil scientist I mean he always has been but the way he's

[00:49:36] been depicted in in the remake series uh just he's practically snidely whiplash with how fucking

[00:49:43] evil he is he is he is he just seems like a sociopath he's always talking about a grander and

[00:49:49] making things more grand and like he's like locking red up and he's like cackling like an asshole

[00:49:55] he's like crazy man yeah it's it's weird there's one aspect of Final Fantasy 7 that I have never

[00:50:02] cared about whether it's og advent children remake anything that's lofty oh man I I it's true

[00:50:10] and the thing is I have never cared about the turks wow I I don't care I don't get it

[00:50:18] they're not interesting they don't look cool their assholes their asshole shinra lap dogs who

[00:50:25] were after erith because someone told them to and who also dropped a fucking plate on all the poor

[00:50:31] people in in midgard literally because just someone made the call for them to do so so

[00:50:37] fuck them that was pretty assholes yeah yeah fuck fuck rino in his stupid red hair

[00:50:43] rude in his bald head holy alana alana can get bent I don't care it says uh song

[00:50:50] fuck him too I don't care about you straight lace you know the funny somebody told me this recently

[00:50:56] I was actually pretty shocked because it was like I thought we saw like they have the fun

[00:51:00] interactions to some degree they're not really like the coolest like villain team on the

[00:51:05] faces of planet but I actually like some of the interactions and rebirthers apart we're like

[00:51:10] you can just imagine rude being like irritated at alana's like chirpy like sort of inexperience and

[00:51:16] amateur like shenanigans like she's the only one questioning what they're doing the the

[00:51:22] issue is like what the hell is going on yeah like we're going into die what and then there's

[00:51:26] like we're going to follow the mission so yeah sure I understand like they're kind of boring

[00:51:30] that respect but like I just thought some of the way the some of the performances and rebirth were

[00:51:36] kind of interesting to me but like yeah I mean as a whole sure I understand but I've never disliked

[00:51:41] them to that degree man oh my god yeah I'm just I've just never liked a man never have

[00:51:48] anyway I think that wraps up all the character stuff unless you got anything uh anything else

[00:51:52] it's kind of I think we cover Vincent on Vincent I think in the most important part to me

[00:52:00] hot you're coasting with I okay I think we should talk music because again I don't really know how

[00:52:24] this is going to settle in all time list for me yet final fancies heaven rebirth I can say

[00:52:29] this is one of the best sandraks ever heard straight up yeah it just has to beat out 16

[00:52:34] wait what who said that but no this is great I think this is better in 16 oh my god okay

[00:52:40] hmm that's that's a food for thought but yeah I would I would say I would say 16 is better than

[00:52:46] remake 16 is not better than rebirth for sure okay yeah sure I'll think about that one I think

[00:52:52] doesn't doesn't really no I really like the soundtrack in 16 don't get me wrong I do of course

[00:52:57] of course um no this but I think a good starting place is that much like remake this soundtrack

[00:53:04] could have easily been nostalgia porn they could have just played the hits you know and everyone

[00:53:10] would have loved it including myself you know because the way they do play the hits in this game

[00:53:14] are really great but they didn't just do that they did much better than that and I really appreciated

[00:53:21] it it didn't just sound like a midi compressed on the disc wait what who said that but

[00:53:27] in the grand scheme of things it takes just the risk that you need to properly remake something

[00:53:32] right because like they could have just like literally like rerecorded or redone stuff

[00:53:37] like as is but no it does way more than that they were not afraid to play with established

[00:53:42] late motifs right so uh one of the goofiest things was actually uh the way yufi like plays with

[00:53:48] established tunes like her theme right so uh she has a she has lyrics to things like you get on

[00:53:56] chocobo gongaga and then she's like chirps about writing a chocobo and i'm like what's so surprising

[00:54:02] to me i'm like what are you what and there's another thing also around gongaga where she's

[00:54:08] singing her theme but she's singing while being bored i'm like what i'm so bored i'm laying on the

[00:54:14] couch or something like that yeah yeah yeah i can't even remember but no but you know you

[00:54:18] know what's funny it's that we do the same shit when we played a game enough we had lyrics

[00:54:23] all sorts of stupid things we do like we love to do that it's funny right so the fact that she

[00:54:28] i mean we're not the only ones obviously um she yeah the way yeah and of course like even like

[00:54:36] instrumentally like her theme is played in different parts of like the the mount coral area right so

[00:54:42] like uh and you can't do that if she's like an optional character so the fact they integrate

[00:54:46] her into like the the main thing like they could do these moments and like so when you reach

[00:54:50] a peak and you like you find the little birdie on top like the song is like super playful and stuff

[00:54:54] like that so like there's so many different iterations of like established songs oh yeah

[00:54:59] cloud jr i almost forgot about cloud jr it's so funny it's so silly it's great um mount

[00:55:09] correll in general when you're climbing mount correll that song oh my god that shit is incredible

[00:55:17] oh it's so impactful it's it's so loud too that's a background music that's our background music

[00:55:25] that's music it's it's sweeping right it's super sweeping oh it's so good it's super great i don't

[00:55:32] even remember it sounding remotely like that before i mean i'll tell you what it was you know i love

[00:55:39] a lot of the soundtrack and i get it they're remaking a game from 1997 but they're leaning into

[00:55:45] the 90s-ness this doesn't this kind these kind of motifs are definitely not like okay i'll put it this

[00:55:53] way so you know like in the 90s a lot of those composers you know being gen x they're they're

[00:55:58] pulling from like 70s especially prog rock stuff i mean hiroki kikuta did that all the time

[00:56:04] you can tell you know nobu iimatsu i guess maybe he's more of a boomer but he also did that all

[00:56:09] the time even mitzvah you know what i mean like a lot of these guys kind of pulled from those

[00:56:14] kind of sources you listen to like nintendo music from the early 90s uh and i've made fun of this to

[00:56:20] you made fun in a good way go back and listen to super mario kart those are like disco tracks man

[00:56:26] those are like like you can like i had like i can pull up disco songs that's like oh yeah it sounds

[00:56:32] like this one you know like so they're pulling a lot from the sources now in the year of our

[00:56:37] lord 2024 the people who are making this stuff are now like more our age and are pulling from the 90s

[00:56:44] for sure they probably grew up playing final fantasy seven yeah this yeah that's a great

[00:56:49] observation yeah wow that's the inspiration for them you know not just because it's a game from

[00:56:54] the 90s they're pulling from those sources itself i mean like all that kiriye stuff is like

[00:57:00] literally like 90s pop rock right so it's like very produced 90s pop rock now and then

[00:57:07] of course she has her fake ass toni basil oh mickey you're so fine you're so fine you blow my mind

[00:57:12] pop song and when you do another quest for her which is like incredible the lyrics on that are so

[00:57:18] funny it's so it's so in character for her anyway sorry for talking so long point being

[00:57:26] i love the inspiration that they're pulling from not just real life but just you know a game from

[00:57:32] the 90s is sounding like the 90s i do like that yeah and honestly it comes from a really heartfelt

[00:57:38] place so uh just to lead into that uh that song really the kiri song really quick i think like

[00:57:44] it was so insanely over the top but like i feel like in the way they like set it up

[00:57:49] it felt a lot more like endearing than some of maybe squares like previous efforts to like

[00:57:54] i don't know appeal to a worldwide audience or whatever right so it's like they've included some

[00:57:58] like i don't know some other songs are kind of silly like thong fancy tens like other world

[00:58:02] which was like felt way too hamfisted to me but like this that song is just so like even though

[00:58:08] it was like kind of chirpy and annoying in a way it was great it was so much it's supposed

[00:58:13] to be annoying yeah it's supposed to be you know like that's the point it's like that's you

[00:58:18] know it's it's great it's such good stuff yeah speaking of songs or side quests which they went

[00:58:27] so hard on with the kiri a stuff i think maybe just as hard um there's a couple quests involving a dog

[00:58:34] a dog escort mission oh my god and um like but we effectively everyone just calls them bow wow

[00:58:43] because that's what it's yeah they say it over and over again it's so good it's why did they go so hard

[00:58:51] on side quest a side quest for a fucking dog they went crazy and the funny thing is this this side

[00:58:58] quest is actually pretty early in the game too so what a way to make an impression right it's

[00:59:02] like everything sounds so expensive earlier oh well they're they spared no expense oh by the

[00:59:09] way do you like how during that quest like barrett is losing his mind about about marlene he's just like

[00:59:16] oh no what if i can't let her go or what if i don't let her what if i clip her wings or something

[00:59:20] to the point where clouds like barrett calm the fuck now or whatever he says calm your

[00:59:24] shit or whatever yeah literally if cloud is telling you that you're probably really messed up

[00:59:30] somewhere exactly if cloud is saying that shit yes you you you've you fucked up somewhere

[00:59:36] yeah well barrett was about to cry into the mic so it was uh he he definitely yeah

[00:59:44] man the music in this game is so good what about um one of the things that struck me probably the most

[00:59:50] is after erith dies if you will again more on that later you start the fight against jenova

[00:59:57] but it's like a sad version of the era theme right but then as you fight that boss and pieces

[01:00:03] it eventually gets taken over by the jenova theme it's taken over exactly it yeah it's

[01:00:09] wild the storytelling through music in this game is crazy it's so seamless and organic and that's

[01:00:16] the surprising part it's just so good man one of the things that was really apt to me was the

[01:00:24] the gungaga areas themes right so there's like this new age song i mean this one's perfect

[01:00:30] right because it's like a jungle right so it's like it's got this firm golly ass song that's kind of

[01:00:34] might as well be from like the lion cake and has like enigma ass instruments and all the stuff

[01:00:39] and it's just like it's right out of the 90s like environmentalism movie right we were we were

[01:00:44] just talking about the 90s and that's about as 90s as it gets holy shit man do we want to

[01:00:51] the sandy if we went to the sandiego zoo and they played that at some exhibit would be bat and

[01:00:55] eyelash i mean like that's exactly no just put that shit in seawall or something in that right

[01:01:02] dude it's so good so good it's so good i could not wait for you to get there i remember asking

[01:01:07] you have you been to gungaga yet and i'm like you're like no i'm like oh my god you're like

[01:01:13] what i'm like i don't even want to say i didn't even want to say the music i didn't even

[01:01:16] want to say the word music i was like just tell me when you get there yeah probably would have us

[01:01:21] full of surprise to a degree but yeah man it was just so perfect and also obviously the game is about

[01:01:25] like you know environmentalism to a degree so it's like we love this over the top shit man it's just

[01:01:30] so like it's video game life baby it's great okay so i want to talk about one more moment that really

[01:01:39] did it for me so then we are both two american men born in southern california in the 1980s

[01:01:48] so that means we know a little thing at disneyland called the main street electrical parade we do

[01:01:55] i think you know where i'm going with this and it's exactly what it sounds like for anyone who

[01:01:59] doesn't know it's a parade down the main drag at disneyland with all like the garish lights and floats

[01:02:04] and stuff and and it plays and it plays this very distinct song it's very carnival like song as you

[01:02:11] go down it's kind of like yeah yeah and when i first played final fantasy seven back in the day

[01:02:16] and i got to the golden saucer and i heard that the golden saucer theme i was like that's it that's

[01:02:21] the main string electrical parade that's what it is the main street electrical parade of course it

[01:02:25] i mean that's like that's what my like teenage brain conflated i mean like what else would it be of

[01:02:30] course right the right time frame for a two right and so final fantasy seven rebirth obviously

[01:02:36] has that theme right but when you're on the date with whoever you're dating it plays a version

[01:02:44] of the golden saucer theme that uses like very mid 70s synthesizer sounds yep and it sounds exactly

[01:02:52] more than ever before like the main street electrical parade at disneyland there's no way

[01:02:57] that's a coincidence they knew what that should sound like yeah they mixed it in a way that's so

[01:03:03] like organic too so like we both did it erith so like notes of our theme just like strewn

[01:03:08] throughout like the song and i'm just like yo man they actually like have so much attention to detail

[01:03:14] and like how many other games can speak to that right they have a whole roster to like

[01:03:18] like include and they paid attention to the details yeah i that's one thing about the tifa date i

[01:03:25] do know they do incorporate tifa's theme into that theme if you date her into the golden saucer

[01:03:30] yeah they incorporate the theme of the person that you're dating into that that is crazy

[01:03:35] saying that's so much work but they did the work yeah they did um speaking of which real quick

[01:03:42] of the golden saucer rather did you like when you did the arena battle after the loveless uh

[01:03:49] play when you had to go do the arena battle they like the corneo cronies kicked it off with

[01:03:54] that fake ass beastie boys rap song or whatever like i loved it god it was so egregiously stupid

[01:04:03] it was so ridiculous the lyrics were so over the top because they literally say things like golden

[01:04:09] saucer throw that shit in the trash and i'm like you have to be like you have to be off your rock

[01:04:15] or to write something like that and have someone actually sing it that's so crazy that's so crazy

[01:04:20] i think they call someone's a bit like check it out bitch we're here so i don't know it's like

[01:04:25] i remember the word bitch being really funny as well and um yo so unhinged man it was it was

[01:04:31] unhinged and i love the sound design in that area too because it's so loud it sounds like an arena

[01:04:36] and i'm using my fancy schmancy you know playstation headset 3d headphones or whatever so it was really

[01:04:42] it was really loud it sounded like you were in an actual arena like the announcer and stuff you

[01:04:47] know talking shit while you're like it was so overbearing like in a good way you know it

[01:04:52] should sound like that in there it was it was crazy good audio yeah i remember it was pretty

[01:04:57] echoey like an actual concert too yeah it was great for sure was it just stuff like being

[01:05:03] played straight up it was like the whole this world building it via music yeah but i like how

[01:05:08] they made those two flunkies rap it was like it was like seeing like i don't know

[01:05:12] 2p and axel from final fight rapping or something like that it was really weird yeah

[01:05:19] oh dude yeah so good i have something really quick about cheesiness in the coral prison area

[01:05:29] this dude gust like appears to make to crack a deal it's like it becomes like super swank

[01:05:35] but then shortly thereafter like there's a random action like a random bad

[01:05:39] band just like chilling this mad max ass area and they're playing like this sort of pump

[01:05:43] rocked act and i'm like you're just like sitting here doing this like this crazy

[01:05:48] i love it it was it's so good and we and you just buy it because you're enjoying the game

[01:05:52] so much you just buy it you don't even think like oh man what are these fuckos doing here

[01:05:56] you're just kind of like okay sure you know you're like mad max sure that's fine yeah um one more thing

[01:06:04] before uh we wrap up the music part the ending theme for final fantasy 7 remake hollow like the

[01:06:10] part you i think it plays when you when cloud real quote real cloud passes you know zack

[01:06:16] dragging cloud along in the other dimension and that song strikes up you they play that song in the

[01:06:21] grad the desert part of the grasslands because that's where that's where remake ends they play

[01:06:26] that song in that area of the grasslands i was like oh dude it's such a good observation dude yeah

[01:06:32] i actually like didn't even think about that at first but yeah like uh now that you mentioned it

[01:06:37] it's like it's another way of doing like throwbacks without like bludgeoning your head with them

[01:06:41] right and it's just the song in general is like super like sub dude so just just fits right into it

[01:06:47] and it's like wow man well yeah i mean it's just again storytelling through music uh subtle subtle

[01:06:54] cues not bludgeoning you with it i guess that song is this is the theme of cloud i guess but i

[01:07:00] think of it more like zacks thing i understand hollow that makes more sense for cloud right but

[01:07:08] like i kind of think of it as like i don't know i think a zack when i hear that song well that's

[01:07:14] when zack does this sort of like surprise like reentry i guess right but yeah it could fit i think

[01:07:18] could fit for both it still feel cloud about one but it's the story of their relationship cloud

[01:07:24] the relationship is hollow yeah fine time broadcasting all the way all right i think this

[01:08:02] would be a good time to go through just some scenes that we loved in the game but some of

[01:08:07] our favorite scenes or stuff that we just thought was notable um outside of the character stuff just

[01:08:14] yeah there's a lot but we're gonna you know we're just gonna stick to the ones that we uh that we

[01:08:18] really feel and i have to start with my favorite scene in the game and that would be the loveless

[01:08:26] play whoo that's a way to start this was so good then i don't even know where to begin

[01:08:34] i guess we could start with it being tied to jesse which obviously gives it you know great lore

[01:08:39] and character stuff there right ties is everything right and then that choreography begins wow

[01:08:47] that was like a real-ass modern dance ballet like they didn't i would love to see the mocap on

[01:08:54] that that was crazy oh my god can you imagine the mocap that was beautiful that was so good

[01:09:02] if i went to see that live i would pay i don't know how much to see something like that

[01:09:07] it's such a huge production man it's so good it's just unbelievable and then then the actual

[01:09:15] like play begins and everyone's in costume and yo man can we please talk about like i all of them

[01:09:26] like baron especially what the hell was that that was crazy looking i loved baron's costume it really

[01:09:32] built off of his character made him look like this imposing figure all such a perfect fit it was

[01:09:38] so elaborate too yeah it was that was crazy good then of course all their dialogue is just like

[01:09:46] per you know so i almost don't even want to call it cheesy it's just your standard like kind of

[01:09:53] oh i'm gonna save the princess story but it's just the way it's done it felt so surreal just see all

[01:09:58] our characters have been spending like 80 hours with at this point just in this play randomly this

[01:10:04] vr play was insane i mean i can't even look you guys played the game if you're listening to this

[01:10:10] probably i don't have to explain it to you it's just incredible and then you know erith

[01:10:16] caps it off with the song just great i love the moment of of comedy there where like said to sleep

[01:10:23] and like fucking you if you not just have a wake like hey you know she's on yeah he doesn't give a

[01:10:28] shit about any of this right which is yeah which is perfect you know of course he does it of course

[01:10:33] yeah i don't think i'm being prisoner of the moment here that might be one of the best things

[01:10:38] i've ever seen in like in a video game yes that was one of those moments for me i mean i don't

[01:10:44] know new donk city festival the end of super metroid i don't know whatever you might put in your like

[01:10:50] personal like hall of fame for me i think loveless goes there then it really does i

[01:10:58] i love that's how much i love this i don't have the words i fucking love video games the end

[01:11:04] this this is video games a full display man it really has that sort of um spectacle but it's

[01:11:10] like beyond just mere spectacle it like hit both of us so deeply to our core and yet like new donk

[01:11:17] city and super metroid those at the end of super metroid those are like no slouches so far as scenes

[01:11:22] go but it was just it was just the whole totality of the thing and it was executed so well

[01:11:28] it's like practically like a real stage play at that point and yeah how many games can actually

[01:11:33] like attest to like having a real last stage play no who has the budget and even if they do

[01:11:39] have the budget they would never do anything as fanciful as that you know they would spend that

[01:11:44] budget on be like hmm i wonder if we can make this game sharper right like i mean that's what

[01:11:49] and obviously rebirth wasn't concerned about that not in 60 frames a second mode anyway so like

[01:11:54] no i rather i'll take loveless over hmm i wonder if we can uh cut down this foliage pop right i

[01:12:02] don't really care we need a higher res texture on the side of this mountain don't care give me those

[01:12:10] unreal four ass textures and i rather i'll take loveless a hundred times out of a hundred yeah

[01:12:14] that's what we remember that's that's the impactful stuff man what did you think of opening with

[01:12:27] not just the nebelheim flashback but opening with zack because it's like because that makes it

[01:12:33] like a literal direct continuation after remake you know as as as direct as you could possibly be

[01:12:40] i think it really keeps us on our toes right because obviously this is not really a thing that

[01:12:45] happened in the original 97 experience so uh just the fact that you know zack is like dragging

[01:12:52] cloud around is is really curious and what really hit me personally was the x is over like the

[01:12:58] party's portraits right and i'm like yo what is going on with this man like this has to be like a

[01:13:04] different time one because charlie barron tevon are not dead right they're dead they were dead in that

[01:13:11] they were dead yeah and then like red 13 dies in the helicopter crash and saving erith and then

[01:13:17] like they're dead it's a way to really hit the ground running and really keep us on our toes and

[01:13:22] i'm like yo what the hell is happening i felt like zack was all of us when he remember that part

[01:13:28] where he's just looking around it's like this is so messed up remember that i was like that's us

[01:13:34] that's that's us saying that we never would have imagined like these cherished characters like

[01:13:39] gone man that's such a shocker speaking of shockers maybe the most shocking scene to me

[01:13:47] in the game just just as far as like came out of nowhere the bald bar in june on like what in the

[01:13:59] hell was that i don't even think you have to go there you don't because you're trying to recruit

[01:14:04] like people for like the inventory or whatever and so let's like just a path that you can just go

[01:14:09] down the stairs or whatever and like brood is brood it's just chilling there because he's

[01:14:13] obviously like the big ball well yeah i mean he did the little wink shine his head wink salute right

[01:14:19] and then they both walk down there and then you're like what the hell is this their old body you look

[01:14:25] out of you're like a fish out of water because you're trying to disguise yourself so you got like a

[01:14:29] helmet on everything doing you guys got took your helmet off to be here i'm like what

[01:14:35] yeah even the like the women are bald like everyone's bald it's it's it's

[01:14:40] it put me in a weird position because i'm like oh god like we can't remove her helmets because that

[01:14:46] blows our cover and it shows that we're not bald and of course cloud is like the exact opposite he's

[01:14:50] mr. fucking spiky spiky here man right yeah i mean his his hair was half his personality in the

[01:14:57] in the first game right it's an original game for him and his big sword exactly right so yeah

[01:15:03] sword and hair more than uh more than a dude but you seem to like that entire june on sequence

[01:15:08] in general i actually really like situations like that because uh things are like kind of like awkward

[01:15:14] because uh you're infiltrating right and you have to recruit people and like the whole time like

[01:15:20] thinking how the hell would cloud know how to do any of this shenra stuff he hasn't been part of

[01:15:23] this for such a long time but somehow he fakes the funk in a compelling way maybe there's maybe

[01:15:29] the management is just dumb but like no he manages to like recruit this whole thing and um but he

[01:15:34] actually straight up like builds like camaraderie with like these new teammates and i thought that

[01:15:38] was really enduring and cool even if it's like a little weird that you kind of bring people around

[01:15:43] to like beat up other people in shenra that kind of seems a little strange to me but it's a little

[01:15:48] it's a little weird it's a little weird i'm like i'm not sure why we're being the crap out of

[01:15:52] each other when we're trying to like find the like the intruder but um there's a part at the

[01:15:57] end of all that where cloud is about the depart because obviously he can't stay with these

[01:16:00] schmuckos so he's like all yo like uh i have to like he's he's altered by himself and the other

[01:16:07] troopers are all like hey uh like we're sorry to see you go well we see each other again

[01:16:13] and then cloud says like uh you can count on it but thinking back on this the whole game is kind

[01:16:20] of about promises or perhaps not keeping promises now isn't it yeah i thought that was weird yeah

[01:16:27] they really made like a thing out of it right and then like you if you try to assassinate rufus you

[01:16:32] know that was the that was the thing that happened right that all of that was yeah all of that was

[01:16:39] crazy that was so i mean you even have to do the minigame where you have to breathe in breathe in

[01:16:44] to line up the shot that's where the sniper the fake sniper part yeah fake sniper fake silencope

[01:16:49] with a ninja star i think i fucked it up because i don't think i like breathe properly the first

[01:16:55] time i fucked it up i fucked it up i fucked it up for sure i i fucked it the first time um

[01:17:02] okay queads blood tournament on the boat i'm not even sure i have anything to say again if you're

[01:17:09] listening to this you played the game you saw it it was crazy i you know what i would like in it too

[01:17:14] it might be a weird comparison but it remind that whole boat right it reminded me of like

[01:17:19] a classic sitcom episode or they go on vacation let's go to disneyland or something like that

[01:17:25] remember remember when disney bought abc in the mid 90s and then every sitcom went to disneyland

[01:17:30] remember that shit that's kind of that's what it that's that's what it reminded me of and um

[01:17:35] nowadays this might be referred to as like an anime beach episode this game has that too by the way

[01:17:41] but um this queen's blood thing was like straight out of b witch or something it felt like

[01:17:46] something that would happen in the 60s it was man i don't think i'll ever fully get over red

[01:17:51] 13 pretending to be like a human in that like standing on two legs i mean that that image would

[01:17:57] burn in my brain for life you know the animation is so done it's done so well too and he's like

[01:18:04] stumbling over extremely awkwardly he's doing his best man and apparently nobody really like found

[01:18:10] out i guess but um no he it's so like it's so visually like captivating and really over the

[01:18:16] top way just because like we never could have seen this coming man it's just such an expansion

[01:18:21] of existing things in ways we couldn't have seen and yeah i just loved how all the cast had a bit

[01:18:26] of an edge like if you try to play against eras she's like joking about how she's going to like beat

[01:18:29] you like carbs or whatever i'm like okay and chadley's out there just destroying everybody like

[01:18:38] it's great oh my god it's great oh my god there's a there's a scene uh i just thought of this

[01:18:43] there's a scene with chadley i know you didn't you didn't do all the proto relic stuff right

[01:18:47] i did not okay i think there's one in gun gaga if you're doing the gun gaga one he's involved in

[01:18:52] this of course he's involved with it because it's a proto relic but he's particularly involved

[01:18:56] with this one i forget why now but at the end of it they were talking about you know something

[01:19:02] about the live stream and then he just has a random thought he says out loud he's like

[01:19:06] it will i return to the live stream when i die considering like what i am

[01:19:12] ooh and then and then barrett was like yeah of course why wouldn't you huh and then and then

[01:19:19] everyone just something else happens and they move on but like i remember thinking like huh

[01:19:23] he actually said that wow that's deep it's interesting that he was so straight-leased

[01:19:28] about it yeah because like most of us wonder but hmm yeah yeah yeah i think maybe some of the others

[01:19:35] might may have been but it's it's interesting considering how barrett loves all that planet

[01:19:40] shit cares about the planet right i mean i guess that i guess for him it would be no big deal to say

[01:19:45] yeah if you're sentient you go back yeah yeah yeah but maybe some of the other i mean they didn't

[01:19:51] get into it too deeply obviously but yeah i like that uh little moment another moment i really enjoyed

[01:20:02] is when you go back to nebelheim in chapter 12 or whatever and two noteworthy things happen

[01:20:08] when you're climbing up the mountain where you're going up mountain dibbles so one cloud has

[01:20:14] that moment where he speaks exactly like sephiroth word for so creepy that was fucking oh why was

[01:20:21] weird did that that really clues you in i mean you already know he's fucked up that really clues you

[01:20:25] in it's like bro you're not sephiroth yeah well he said he may think he may think he is at that

[01:20:33] point and then too cloud remembered that it wasn't a random shinra flunky that who drowned going

[01:20:39] down the river that was zack and what this really does i think it's immense once and for all that we

[01:20:48] can't trust anything from clouds perspective no matter what and since most of the game is from

[01:20:54] his perspective we can't believe jack shit right and this obviously i thought that was a great

[01:21:00] setup going into the final two chapters because you need that final establishment of oh he just

[01:21:05] doesn't know he doesn't know someone tell him so until you were in nebelheim the whole time

[01:21:13] yeah yeah maybe maybe tifa could have just said so but hey you know whatever yeah so could have

[01:21:20] said so but here's the crazy part to me it's like he bent the narrative so far that he made

[01:21:26] it made sense to him but he wasn't even like doing these things yet he's placing zack in

[01:21:31] that position of being like fucked up right and it's like it really speaks to the depth of

[01:21:36] just his sort delusion and that's like crazy that is insane to me speaking of crazy how do you think

[01:21:44] they handled dine barrett and dine in this version the acting was so so good because dine is a

[01:21:54] sociopath man he sounds crazy he like it's in the original like 97 experience i thought it was just

[01:22:01] i don't remember anything about what they talked about i just remember like oh like this one v one

[01:22:06] me bro sort of thing and that's all that was my only takeaway from the whole thing but and here we

[01:22:10] get a glimpse into dine's deranged mental state he's even implying that he stole marlene

[01:22:16] that barrett stole marlene from him right and like that's like incredible and like this whole

[01:22:21] shot of him like having like marlene's sort of like photo in his hand and like there's like so

[01:22:26] many layers of just like mental shenanigans that it was just so impactful this time i'm sure it impacted

[01:22:33] you too yeah absolutely it was uh yeah for sure the director said that this is one aspect of the

[01:22:42] original game that they really wanted to improve on and i think they did oh easy oh yeah for us

[01:22:48] actually like care of this time and talk about it yeah um i thought it was crazy and it was my

[01:22:55] favorite zax scene where it was the one where he's asking marlene questions about you know because

[01:23:00] it's clear that she knows some stuff that zack doesn't so he's so zack's trying to prod her on

[01:23:05] this and then marlene eventually says like you have to make cloud get better because if erith

[01:23:10] wakes up a scary man is going to kill her cloud tries to save her but he doesn't make it in time

[01:23:15] who marlene says and it's like you want to talk about knowing the future like wink wink nudge nudge

[01:23:25] but what a what a crazy like sort of uh meta comment to make as it were right and uh and

[01:23:32] it's clear this is zack is here it's already like jumping jumping off the rails but the

[01:23:37] fact that she said that is really nutty because we know having played it and uh but also kind

[01:23:43] of creates a sort of situation where like hey can anything be done to avert this is like could

[01:23:47] it be different could it actually be different if she's she knows about this and we're wondering the

[01:23:52] whole time and that's great that was the whole point of those that those yeah it keeps you guessing

[01:23:59] that's how that's how you build intrigue into some into a game where everyone already knows

[01:24:04] all the events right you have absolutely you have to do stuff like that and you expect

[01:24:08] stuff like that i would never just want a straight on remake of these kind of games i'd be so

[01:24:12] boring yeah i would be so boring yeah so i i'm glad they did this maybe um i don't want to say my

[01:24:20] favorite scene but like you know what no it's okay it's not my favorite scene it's my it's my

[01:24:26] favorite cloud and erith interaction and it's after it's it's after the coast of the soul

[01:24:31] fight you know by the way that entire thing was crazy remember remember how cloud is acting so

[01:24:36] weird about seeing teeth and eritha in a bathing suit it's clear you're so embarrassed for some

[01:24:40] reason i don't know why he was acting that way it was weird and then uh like a child almost and

[01:24:45] then hojo shows up with the with the cyber octopus oh my god with the controls too right yeah yeah he

[01:24:51] was like pressing it kept it keeps getting back to him like pressing the control pad and then the

[01:24:56] then the cyber octopus does something it's so good scientist life it's so crazy and this is a part

[01:25:02] where claud whips out like an umbrella because his weapon's back at the hotel yeah he reaches

[01:25:08] where he's like uh and he just picks up a beach umbrella and starts whooping ass with it

[01:25:12] oh apparently that affects um remember the two groups are fighting that affects like affinity

[01:25:17] i guess which one you pick oh yeah i figured as much i think i chose erith that explains a few

[01:25:22] things okay i didn't really i didn't really think about that at the time but like yeah but the

[01:25:27] fact to give you the choice though that's crazy though i was like oh what that's i was expecting

[01:25:32] pig yeah um but so after that beach battle and it's sunset you get to talk to all the characters

[01:25:39] you have a little moment with everybody by the way i like that when you go into every town you get

[01:25:43] to basically talk to every character just hanging out you get to have a moment with them if you

[01:25:46] want i really like that but you get to do that here yeah on the beach you get to do that

[01:25:51] and when you talk to erith it was a really crazy conversation you know she starts talking about

[01:25:57] you know her and her mom she they were kidnapped because she was etc etc and she's talking about

[01:26:02] hojo i think the direct quote yeah it's right here after all the pain and horror he put us through

[01:26:08] i hate him sometimes i imagine the things i do to him if i got the chance i start thinking

[01:26:15] things so dark and ugly that it scares me oh my gosh and for her to say that she's like

[01:26:21] she's like super nice and nice and this is so shocking but that's so natural of course that

[01:26:27] she would feel that way i mean yeah of course you know but it's just it's it's wild that she vocalized

[01:26:33] and then you could say something is cloud and then it goes on from there i think i picked like

[01:26:37] well they're just thoughts you know they're you know it doesn't it's not real you know you're

[01:26:42] but yeah she says she says a little um she says a few sentences out loud and clouds like that's good

[01:26:48] or whatever and then and then she says not you that was to her my future self can't say when you'll

[01:26:54] meet but trust me you'll love her just you wait that's so crazy wow man what that's big brain is held

[01:27:02] to and that leads into the success of chapters it's so big that's so that's a while by the way

[01:27:08] i'd love the shot of uh yufi turning johnny into multiple johnnies like ninja johnnies with the

[01:27:13] oh yeah yeah yeah i almost forgot and then that leads to a side quest where there's multiple johnnies

[01:27:18] right i love that they like continued that it was so weird what a joke what a slapstick joke is great

[01:27:23] it's amazing i think we gotta talk about something that really stood out to us which was when you

[01:27:32] entered the gold saucer it was essentially a money burning on a screen which is a thing that we

[01:27:37] like to say about anything extravagant but it really was i mean between the whole like cabaret

[01:27:42] and like the sudo los vegas routine uh with like the stand up with dio and that's like and

[01:27:49] this costume changes like i could not believe what i was seeing and that was it was crazy just yufi

[01:27:55] just entered and she just magical girl transforms and the god knows what and he starts dancing

[01:28:01] like how would you know to do this yeah like how do you know to do this and then tiffan

[01:28:05] eras are dancing with her and it's like but you but you buy it right it's just like okay whatever

[01:28:11] i guess because this game is so insane this game is disneyland this is like sure you know how

[01:28:16] you buy anything in this game you know how we're just totally in the tank for it remember so dine

[01:28:21] comes to the gold saucer shoots it up right and then then you're talking to dio in the back

[01:28:26] because he thinks he thinks barrett did it obviously he's the only person he saw with a

[01:28:29] gun arm and he's like telling you the whole situation while flexing the whole time

[01:28:34] and there's like there's like there's like dead bodies and tarps like around you because it's

[01:28:39] literally a murder scene and this dude is flexing muscle daddy is flexing on your ass

[01:28:48] he doesn't care man just sell the top oh my gosh i forget i forget on twitter who called a

[01:28:54] muscle daddy but it's easy is you better find who did it flex yeah dude he couldn't look man if i were

[01:29:06] however old he was and i looked like that i'd tell you what i'd be flexing i mean

[01:29:10] oh that's great didn't didn't look young i'll tell you that much he he has it i had the

[01:29:15] glance at the seat again just to prepare myself and uh i forgot that yufi actually faints

[01:29:20] just like drops and look at these splits she's like oh my god

[01:29:26] yeah they're all faints super fast too yeah they're freaking out in the in the uh in the

[01:29:31] audience yeah she faints yeah it's really good really good stuff

[01:29:37] that was amazing okay real quick do we have anything else before we start talking about

[01:29:43] chapter 13 and 14 we're gonna try to do those all together in one spot because that's the best

[01:29:48] way to do that kind of thing but before we get there do we have anything else speak now or forever

[01:29:52] hold your peace we have something that's kind of odd and that's like uh the moogle design what the

[01:29:59] hell happened oh no why do they look like that what's with the teeth why do they have the teeth

[01:30:07] they look like really bad animatronics right they look they why not just use the mules from 16

[01:30:15] i don't i the most one of the most iconic font of fantasy critters turned into like a bear with

[01:30:22] like these beady quote unquote eyes it's the teeth for me that i can't get over i don't know why

[01:30:30] it's almost like they it's almost like the original cgi sonic design with the teeth it's like

[01:30:34] it was free to yeah that's pretty bad okay you're not wrong but you're not wrong yeah that's

[01:30:39] kind of yeah i don't know what happened um i thought it was interesting and probably the right call

[01:30:44] to not hide that kate sith is reeve yeah i don't think there's anything else yeah we all know that

[01:30:50] and there's nothing else they could have done in this game to like really trick that up

[01:30:54] so i'm glad they just kind of put it out there everyone knows i think it's just interesting

[01:30:57] though that is you he admits to being a shinra flunky like lickety split though he's like yeah

[01:31:02] i'm from shinra i'm like in the whole they play out for the whole run he's all bears like

[01:31:06] we don't trust you your shinra laptop like what are you doing here you're like a shinra

[01:31:09] person which like all obviously culminates in the whole thing at the end of chapter 12

[01:31:14] we're like you know inevitably kate sith hasn't do a thing so i'm just like when is he getting

[01:31:17] wins kate this is gonna do it is he even gonna backstab anyone well it's just like i don't

[01:31:21] what but yeah you know yeah you don't know how that could play out right yeah because like yeah

[01:31:25] you're right if we already know he's going to double cross us is at any point in doing it

[01:31:30] again i guess you have to because no i guess you really don't have to if you did that

[01:31:34] was the question we didn't know yeah so but but they did all right is that it you're ready to go

[01:31:41] to the point of no return just like in the game indeed we're going to the north or in uh the

[01:31:46] north land right north land or whatever i don't even know what it's called up north up north

[01:31:53] that forest up north i'm ready for us okay let's go all right we've landed we're going towards

[01:32:30] the temple of the agents we're here okay we're not going to touch on every single thing that

[01:32:34] happened these last two chapters and we've been talking long enough because we'll be here forever

[01:32:38] we're already been here a long time but we're just going to go through the stuff that we want

[01:32:43] to talk about in chronological order so we could just keep it straight you know oh you

[01:32:48] got to keep it straight there's too much in here if you don't yeah we've been jumping all over

[01:32:52] the place before this and it doesn't matter but here we want to we really want to keep it

[01:32:56] straight obviously so yeah i do let's start let's start at the beginning so they go to the

[01:33:01] they get to the temple they have that initial battle with the shinra soldiers right and then

[01:33:05] cloud sees a robed man who was formerly roche yeah you can tell because of the hair yeah yeah

[01:33:11] and then tifa asks cloud if he knows who that is and clouds just like let's go or whatever he

[01:33:15] doesn't really answer okay thanks for answering the question man that's kind of uh i never

[01:33:20] thought i would pity that guy right i always just kind of thought of him as a weird diversion

[01:33:25] but i never thought he would turn out to be that pathetic that's like an injection from hojo and

[01:33:32] stuff i didn't really think they'd take him that direction but i guess that's the end of that

[01:33:35] character so i didn't expect it either yeah that was a real shock yeah you won't talk shock though

[01:33:42] oh god yeah so they go through all they they go through the temple blah blah blah i know

[01:33:47] you had a bit of trouble just one gameplay thing if we can you had a bit of trouble with the

[01:33:51] erith like the energy and like siphoning it to like different like it took a little bit it took a

[01:33:57] little bit yeah i remember what the temple was like the lever and the man like there was a path i

[01:34:03] didn't see or something i got i was like paying too much attention to like the mini map so i

[01:34:06] thought i had been there but i actually had not been there so i got side turned man side

[01:34:11] turn yeah it's it's easy to do yeah i'm not i'm no no no uh you know no shame it's just

[01:34:16] you know it's it's tough yeah um okay but after all that you get to each character's personal

[01:34:24] trials if you will everyone has to go in a door yeah and experience a trial but i don't think

[01:34:31] they're trials at all i think they're just misery they're not trials they're not trials

[01:34:37] they're nightmares they are nightmares dude i don't even oh man red 13 with the oh the

[01:34:45] experimentation shit or whatever or trying to yeah that was rough i think for me it's erith

[01:34:51] i mean i know that's the easy answer but the fact that you actually have to play as her as a little

[01:34:56] girl her mom is dying you find i god i can never remember the name of her surrogate mother god damn

[01:35:04] oh my rose her surrogate oh my right oh my right yeah um she finds her i mean just that

[01:35:09] whole that whole thing if she comes back and her mother's already dead that whole thing was crazy i just

[01:35:16] i didn't think they'd actually make you play that out that was nuts it's really crazily impactful

[01:35:22] because like the other people in town don't don't care right they just like don't even like help her

[01:35:29] at all she's like yo you know where a doctor is and people yeah i didn't give it right so it's

[01:35:35] like crazy and just it makes you feel really bad for erith right yeah yeah um i think what got me

[01:35:43] though was barrett's um because you flashback to coral and you see his wife right only for coral

[01:35:49] will just like instantly like get like blown up in the wake of the reactor but the game cuts to

[01:35:55] like a camera shot of like his arm but it's like the bloody stump arm like way up close to the

[01:36:00] camera and like because it threw me off because right beforehand he had both of his arms because

[01:36:05] that's a flashback yeah then all of a sudden it's like jk jk here's a stone i'm like yo man is this

[01:36:11] pushing up against the rating of the game like this is really bloody they really pushed this teen

[01:36:15] rating yeah they pushed it they really did i can't believe they got away with what they got away

[01:36:19] with honestly yeah they couldn't do everything like you know like in the dying flashbacks or

[01:36:24] whatever when uh that one bitch from shinra i can't remember her name right now scarlet you

[01:36:29] fee says yes scarlet you feel oh god that was one of the best line reads in the game and you

[01:36:33] feel was like that bitch she's fucking hates her yeah she should that was a subtext that we never

[01:36:43] even got in the original games like they added that man but like you know when they're shooting

[01:36:49] them in the arms and they fall over they didn't like literally like blow up their arm i mean

[01:36:54] they couldn't really do that probably yeah it cuts away well i mean it's shooting them in

[01:36:57] the arms but they couldn't like really show oh that's what it is yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah they

[01:37:03] can't really you know because otherwise they'll you know um but yeah the barrett thing was weird

[01:37:09] you know what really struck me about that is that it was him in quote-unquote real life

[01:37:14] experiencing that because like he looks at his arms like oh should i have my arm back but then

[01:37:18] he goes to myrna his wife and he's and then she's like why are you acting so weird or whatever

[01:37:24] but he's like experiencing this for you know that that juxtaposition was like that's what

[01:37:29] made it crazy to me and he actually acts like he's back like in the like he actually

[01:37:35] acts for a time like he's back home but even though like biological sort of like like definition

[01:37:42] he's like obviously dreaming right but he plays he plays it up he's like oh yeah i'm gonna chill

[01:37:47] back home and until he doesn't right but yeah yeah but then of course everyone comes out of their

[01:37:54] trial rooms everyone looks fucking fucked up right because yeah everyone looks miserable as hell

[01:38:02] and and then erith notices this and that's what she makes her motivational speech punctuated by

[01:38:08] cloud sneering like are you finished oh just crazy that's so crazy to me and then they leave

[01:38:15] and then that's when you're really like uh oh because it's clear at that point that cloud is too

[01:38:22] gaslit by sephroth to do much else he's based sephroth has basically completely taken him over

[01:38:28] the closer they get to this black material the closer you get to this goal he's just been

[01:38:32] becoming more and more just messed up and like that's a subtext did not come across in the

[01:38:39] original game because i know that he says that but it just comes across of him being like a

[01:38:42] again it's just him being a dick but now you know why that's happening yeah there's all you

[01:38:48] because he's he's sephroth way too one too many times his mind is messed up because he should never

[01:38:54] be acted away towards erith he actually like is connecting with her up to this point and but

[01:38:58] like they're cutting off so abruptly it's like wow what a fucking douchebag but even then can

[01:39:03] he really help it well i mean i think that's why they don't like really go after him about

[01:39:08] it like hey you're being an asshole right now they don't really say that because they know that

[01:39:12] they know that he's fucked up right he's got some one too many maca cells yeah um okay there's one

[01:39:18] thing i didn't really understand when they get to the black materia cloud is clearly possessed by it

[01:39:23] barrett grabs and tosses it and you know that's when cloud has this whiny it's mine or whatever

[01:39:28] what does he say i love that part no what is it what does he say i forget

[01:39:34] yeah he says uh hey that's mine okay i just say that's mine yeah and he's like yeah go get it asshole

[01:39:45] but why why did why did erith say it's a fake see this is the part that kind of screws me up

[01:39:52] because i'm conflating my memories of the original which are not necessarily relevant here and then

[01:39:56] the original like the temple of the inches becomes the black materia or something of

[01:40:00] that sort but you don't see that happen here so like oh yeah is this still happening is this not

[01:40:06] happening it's like i mean if it is a fake then where's the real one right so i'm like oh i don't

[01:40:14] yeah and then like yeah back outside of course like erith tries to retreat with the materia this

[01:40:20] is after like he takes her from who has it first tifa or something or and then i think so yeah he

[01:40:25] tries to take he takes it from her and you know because he's totally possessed he probably

[01:40:29] would kill her at that point if he didn't give it up and then erith takes it and then that's when

[01:40:35] we get the weird sequence of like him being sort of possessed sort of walking towards her and

[01:40:40] he's being creepy as hell that erith just so creepy let's talk let's talk yeah it's like whoa

[01:40:49] oh that's some serial killer shit dude holy

[01:40:55] i don't see this guy in the dark alley holy

[01:40:59] but why yeah i yeah i remember uh again i watched you stream these last two chapters and you were

[01:41:06] hella loling at uh clouds bitch made uh like hey that's mine or whatever that's mine it's like

[01:41:13] bro come on man how old are you yeah it's like how old are you well i guess he's still 16 or whatever

[01:41:21] and his stupid mind um but yeah erith just excellent stuff just uh yeah and then and then

[01:41:30] then we know the rest obviously he gets the material they both fall then they go into the abyss

[01:41:36] yeah so that's the way to kick off the end of chapter 13 right and going into the next part

[01:41:41] like you see like um the shinra dudes uh rufus and uh hojo are in their chopper and they're they're

[01:41:47] seeing the temple collapse and uh there's a bunch of whispers everywhere because of course there are

[01:41:52] whispers everywhere and uh rufus asks hojo what to make of this and of course uh hojo is crazy

[01:41:58] he's like uh well he claims he doesn't know but he says that shinra can stand the dream

[01:42:03] far bigger whatever the fuck that's supposed to mean you know he sees the potential i mean

[01:42:09] this guy created mako soldiers and this whole bit right like he's a real villain of the game obviously

[01:42:15] he is he kicks off everything yeah absolutely he's a real villain i mean he always has been

[01:42:20] yeah except for all this just the aftermath of all of it yeah god i cannot wait to kill him in part

[01:42:24] three oh my god oh yeah i can't wait they're gonna play that up too it was gonna be so yeah they

[01:42:30] really did even the original game they kind of you know they did yeah he has the whole

[01:42:34] transformation yeah but yeah like i don't know what that means stand to dream far bigger but

[01:42:38] obviously he sees the potential in whatever this is to do with other weird shit yeah because he's a

[01:42:45] freaking mad scientist and he's sociopathic and then something happens so here's the craziest

[01:42:53] thing right so we go back to zack who is so like the whole game there was been these

[01:42:57] cut ends with zack and then of course now he's back so he's trying to act yeah zack is back um

[01:43:03] he's sort of like in this tunnel but it has a two-way split so he just he points left and right

[01:43:09] and back and forth and he literally has to choose between finding a cure for cloud or trying to

[01:43:15] stop bigs from blowing up reactor six so uh he's he's he's pointing and then he makes his

[01:43:22] he like decides one of them he like i think he drives the path where like he's gonna save

[01:43:27] cloud or whatever trying to find hojo the other path like flashes white like it glows like

[01:43:33] light shaft just glows white i'm like okay that's kind of like a strange yeah it's kind of it was

[01:43:37] like a rainbow effect almost yeah kind of like shan had like sort of a thing right yeah i'm just

[01:43:43] like what yeah and it was just like okay what was that that was the scene for me okay because

[01:43:53] more than any other scene in these final moments that was the scene for me that made

[01:43:56] me go what the actual fuck am i watching yeah i that part blue i was like okay what are we even doing

[01:44:06] and of course right when that happens you get thrown right into erith and cloud date scene

[01:44:13] in the zack timeline erith wakes up cloud wakes up out of the wheelchair whatever he's in and

[01:44:19] erith knows what's going on this isn't like a different erith that's like omnipotent erith

[01:44:24] or whatever yeah whatever i forget her term for her yeah but clearly she's trying to lead cloud along

[01:44:34] here so he's not too disoriented she knows and they're going on that weird date all that date

[01:44:40] stuff was weird wasn't it i think the thing that stuck out for me was the the was the photographer

[01:44:46] thing where she where they said they look like they're at a funeral yeah i mean which kind of

[01:44:52] like place until sort of like the motif of the thing where like that could be true like yes but

[01:44:59] it's so weird that he made that observation though it's just huh that was weird all that date stuff

[01:45:07] was weird and of course she of course cloud doesn't get he's like why are you acting so weird

[01:45:11] he says at the whole time like what's wrong like what's going on but then of course the audience

[01:45:15] is glued in we see the black feather and here's sephra was like ah this is where you've been

[01:45:20] hiding i think he says this is where you've been hiding a world that's already accepted its fate

[01:45:25] yes yes so he says yeah and i'm like oh man like what's wrong this place this place is fucked dude

[01:45:32] yeah and then they of course they get to the church she gives them the white materia

[01:45:38] sephra basically opens the door to kill her yeah and then she's like i what i i could be

[01:45:43] misremembering this but she said i think she says whatever happens don't blame yourself

[01:45:49] yes yeah and then she pushes them through the flowers to another dimension to another yeah

[01:45:54] it's a white space though the flowers become this white portal and he's like yeah as he falls down

[01:45:58] the portal i'm like what because she knows because sephra found her and he has to he has to get

[01:46:03] the fuck out of there before because you know because she knows if he sees sephra he's he's

[01:46:08] going to try to fight her and save save her whatever the hell he's gonna try to try to quote

[01:46:13] quote fade or whatever right and that would fuck up the whole thing because he needs to have the white

[01:46:17] materia and gtfo but the weirdest parts of me is how does even a portal in the first place they

[01:46:22] don't really explain how like she's able to push him through that's god she's gone it's

[01:46:27] it's gone erith she can do whatever the hell she wants of course of course do you know that

[01:46:31] part during um when she appears during the final battle where he's where sephra was like oh i

[01:46:36] underestimated you or something like that yeah see they're on the same level oh god sephra

[01:46:43] though that's scary well i mean he is he can appear he can do whatever the fuck he can cut a whale

[01:46:49] materia belly in half and save tifa for some reason i guess it's the power of l'oreal

[01:46:54] yeah oh yeah it's the power of panting provie uh the hair products moisturizer and condition

[01:47:00] looks good even underwater you know the weirdest part to me though is that like

[01:47:07] so like those it cuts back to zack right and he's doing all these these choices or whatever but

[01:47:14] the next thing shows him with bigs which is the opposite of what we saw like a few minutes ago

[01:47:18] because he i could have sworn he had chosen to like go save cloud so like the fact that he's

[01:47:23] with bigs and i'm like what the hell are you doing here do like what so he kind of

[01:47:27] really confused me because i i almost got gas on myself so um that was the point though i think

[01:47:34] that was the point yeah so like they have this whole thing about you know zack is trying to cheer him

[01:47:39] up and only for you know bigs to go down by shinra gunfire right and then it's like this whole thing

[01:47:45] where zack like jumps over like the railing into like his unknown fate or something it's like

[01:47:51] i don't know if i would be jumping over railing seems kind of dangerous but it's crazy though

[01:47:55] but in retrospect they're playing off the multiple timeline thing like they're the one world could

[01:48:00] have had this happen maybe another world had this happen i think that's the only explanation

[01:48:04] yeah but i think they're trying to say that all the things do actually happen it's just a matter of

[01:48:12] i mean it makes sense later when the i mean i guess you don't see it in the strictest sense

[01:48:16] but the convergence you know that's what sefroth keeps talking about converging the worlds together

[01:48:21] which is what he wants no more of this split shit yeah and that's what he lays out as clout you know

[01:48:29] after erith pushes him through the portal there and then and then clout see sefroth and then you

[01:48:34] know he's he's falling through and sefroth appears and he basically lays out the whole game this is

[01:48:39] a true nature of reality yada yada and there's just showing scenes of re yeah showing like remake

[01:48:45] and like all this other stuff you know like all these worlds and blah blah blah multitude of worlds

[01:48:50] he lays it all out there and i'm glad they actually said that in plain terms with sefroth explaining

[01:48:57] it basically to the audience yeah because i didn't want them to keep going on assuming everybody

[01:49:02] knows what's going on just in case they didn't know hey here's what's actually happening

[01:49:07] it's a really crazy visual because just seeing these other scenes in this ethereal space like

[01:49:11] it's actually really trippy right but that kind of plays into the whole like motif of what's going on

[01:49:17] and uh the the craziest thing to me is that uh he once again drops his familiar seven seconds until

[01:49:23] the end line which was uttered in remake and i'm like we still don't really know what this means

[01:49:28] yeah but what will you do with it i think he says after seven seconds to the end what will

[01:49:33] you do with it it's like well what do you mean i have seven seconds what is that well there's

[01:49:38] like clock shit remember in the temple of the ancients when they go back a few hours earlier

[01:49:43] whatever and they go to the other party that's like gears it's like a clock little gears yes

[01:49:48] literal gears yeah so that's that's that something's going on here with time

[01:49:54] remember in the original game you had to do the clock puzzle you had to go in the

[01:49:57] hands of the clock to get to the different doors yeah you don't do that in this game but

[01:50:02] like well this shows the visual between is like a stinger like a like a little transition

[01:50:06] between things instead yeah right so it's it's uh it's it's something but yeah then they then

[01:50:13] obviously it's pushed through the portal they show some quick scenes of what happened uh

[01:50:18] what cloud holding eras hand to prevent them from falling you know cloud on the ground the

[01:50:23] party trying to tend to him or whatever and he's like knocked out yeah he's like a first

[01:50:28] person camera yeah right right and then they're like going through the forest there and barith

[01:50:32] barith did I just did I just make another ship are you hybridizing everybody

[01:50:40] it yeah barit and eras barith what am I doing today you could you could find that on your fan art

[01:50:47] side of choice maybe also i'm just kidding fan fiction done that definitely has a lot of barith

[01:50:55] a lot yeah there's probably some yeah oh come on it's final fanciness happen there's a lot of

[01:51:01] everything right anyway barit is carrying cloud he wakes up and he's like oh you know hey

[01:51:07] you're finally awake or whatever and then you by the way uh you if he's talking to him hey I heard

[01:51:13] sephroth kicked your ass back there blah blah blah that's that was clearly erith covering for cloud

[01:51:20] yeah that's so weird that she i think it's crazy that she did that she could have easily said

[01:51:25] oh cloud tried to attack me he was possessed by whatever and then I gave him the black bacteria I

[01:51:30] mean that never that happened she covered no no serial no serial killer talk erith

[01:51:39] yeah it's did you think it was interesting that she covered for him I mean I guess she would at this

[01:51:44] point but she's so nicey nicey but honestly like any one of us would have been like yeah he was

[01:51:49] possessed but I think maybe she realized that it wasn't in the biggest best interest to like

[01:51:54] say what literally happened I guess but yeah yeah but I really like the part where clouds like

[01:52:01] try to play it off like he didn't get his ass kicked and eventually he relents he's like fine

[01:52:05] I got the shit kicked out of me by sephroth

[01:52:10] yeah he uh and he took it okay enough stalling let's let's talk about the moment we have to

[01:52:33] do it okay yeah the most memorable part she's praying there she goes up there all the

[01:52:38] whispers all around sephroth descends from the ceiling to do the thing cloud sword clashes with him

[01:52:48] and he seemingly deflects his sword yeah I was like what?

[01:52:53] it's like what?

[01:52:55] whoa they actually and here look this is the thing I said for four years I said for four years

[01:53:00] erith is not gonna die I said it for four years didn't I I was like that was always my big

[01:53:05] prediction about this game and then of course

[01:53:07] yeah that's my super expectations right and then for five seconds I get up and you're like

[01:53:10] yes I was right and then I wasn't right and then I was right and then I wasn't right

[01:53:17] but they distort it in such a weird way because we literally see massimouti like deflected onto the

[01:53:21] ground but then the visuals like effects come in and everything distorts and all of a

[01:53:25] sudden we're like wait what? huh what? and then it happens I'm like wait what the fuck just happened

[01:53:30] yeah and then yeah but the visuals to sort the sword's in the ground and then it distorts to

[01:53:35] a version of the sword with blood on it yeah the blood is rescues the holy materia falls out of her

[01:53:41] hair clinks down into the drink and she's dead it's like it happened okay even though like we

[01:53:50] supposedly averted fate but maybe in retrospect maybe some conversions took place or something

[01:53:55] right it's like who knows but that's wild to me it's like we succeeded that we did it

[01:53:59] but then as cloud is creating her body right holding her body it keeps cutting to other

[01:54:05] realities where he's like actually talking to her yeah but then in in our timeline he's not

[01:54:11] yeah that's right but he's speaking so my interpretation of that is that's what's

[01:54:17] actually happening he's saying because doesn't he have a little speech after that happens

[01:54:22] we'll never get to see her again blah blah blah I think that's like referring to that I think in the

[01:54:26] original Final Fantasy 7 he's talking as he's cradling her body I think that's what they're

[01:54:31] trying to show us I think so yeah I think but in clouds fucked up reality he's just holding

[01:54:36] her and then he's like wait I got this I saved her I saved Aerith I deflected Sephra sword

[01:54:42] he's having a conversation with her but the rest of the party can't possibly see that

[01:54:47] possibly see that no I think she's dead I think she's just saying his final goodbyes or whatever

[01:54:54] well yeah I mean but he's having the the the delusion like as if he's able to have a conversation

[01:54:58] when for all intents and purposes he's just talking to himself right yeah I guess so because

[01:55:04] like I again when I first saw this I had that's why I watch you stream this not just to see

[01:55:09] your reactions or whatever I mean that too but I had to watch it again myself just to make sure

[01:55:14] of what I saw because I was shell shocked you're like what the hell did I just see it's like what

[01:55:20] so distortion heavy man but no yeah it's it's it's a it's a scene that needs to be re-watched to be

[01:55:28] properly uh properly interpreted I guess well not I don't even know if we can properly

[01:55:32] well yeah see we're sitting here talking okay like again I mean I watched you but like

[01:55:36] what did you think did you think like okay saved her okay didn't save her could you possibly

[01:55:41] remember what you thought at this time because I thought I mean at the time I thought we successfully

[01:55:48] did it however that doesn't I think I was too shell shocked to really come up with a logical

[01:55:54] explanation to be honest with you and I think that's that's the intended effect they want

[01:55:58] you to be shell shocked and because oh and here's something I noticed here's something I noticed

[01:56:03] and I didn't notice us until your playthrough when he deflects a sword the rainbow shit happens

[01:56:09] like Zach in the tunnel yes so maybe that signified a timeline split or a right I can see that yeah

[01:56:18] actually I saw that shit maybe I could be reading into that but it definitely happened well I think

[01:56:23] there's definitely splits to some degree if he's able to deflect the sword because again the

[01:56:27] sword was flying it's like not even close at least seemingly so but anyway so yeah all the

[01:56:35] all the final battles happen or whatever you fight the Genova life Glinger we we saw that we

[01:56:39] talked about that already with the music that was crazy yeah Zach factors into this he fights an

[01:56:46] aspect of Genova as well playing as him was he was he was he was so good as lotus shit he

[01:56:53] has every yeah this shit's crazy you can use like every spell like on everybody it's like oh my

[01:56:59] god he had like everything I didn't get to use this limit break I think of her god but

[01:57:04] it's cool no it was cool I almost forgot to do it but yeah it's it's it's it lives up to the

[01:57:09] the intrigue of power of Zach yeah and then Zach Zach and cloud actually get to fight together

[01:57:17] you know that whole bit which is I guess cloud didn't really seem I don't know he had a weird

[01:57:22] reaction to this as if it was supposed to happen you know the weird part to be is that

[01:57:27] so supposedly in cloud's head like Zach like fell down river and died but Zach like after you

[01:57:32] walks you ethereal space and taps him in the shoulder and Zach's like hey you've been up to

[01:57:36] some cool stuff or like whatever not so many words but then Zach cloud only says Zach and

[01:57:41] that's all he says and I'm like wait like wouldn't this be more of a shock see like your supposed

[01:57:46] best friend like shouldn't you like have more of a reaction he didn't say shit no say a goddamn

[01:57:52] thing no I was just like okay I guess so weird but yeah they they fight um they they fight that

[01:58:01] aspect as Sephiroth himself if you will comes and then our Eritreps report oh I'm here let's

[01:58:07] fight Sephiroth together they beat him and then they're standing back to back holding hands you

[01:58:11] know going back to quote-unquote reality and then she slowly fades away as as that happens

[01:58:17] but immediately after that they get back he's holding her lifeless body again and he's like

[01:58:23] erith wake up and then she wakes up what so I thought like I thought she died but

[01:58:31] and then immediately after that they're all sitting around the pool all sad and then Barrett's

[01:58:36] like okay we gotta go and then and then clouds like first of all he has a very robotic answer

[01:58:43] yep sounds good it's super robotic you're right yeah and then Tifa's like fuck you you know like the

[01:58:49] way the way she the way she looks at him but then he has that kind of like psychotic his head hurts

[01:58:54] again and then she then he sees erith yeah like the little static effect happens yeah basically

[01:59:00] what I'm trying to say is we're on the goddamn roller coaster right now right is she or is she

[01:59:06] not because like every scene we're getting something else and it's like well wait a second

[01:59:11] it's alternating yeah it's and like this bamboozled you I know for sure uh but so like

[01:59:20] as they're beginning to leave like I actually sort of noticed like as there's a far out shot showing

[01:59:25] them all walking away but erith is not actually in that shot it's hard to see but she's not

[01:59:30] walking in that stuff in that shot but which is in direct opposition to the shot that just

[01:59:35] happened where she's sitting right next to him because obviously positionally she should be

[01:59:39] like right next to him if they're all walking together right so like she also well but she also

[01:59:44] looked kind of creepy when she was sitting there and she looked at cloud I mean it looked kind of

[01:59:49] creepy to me maybe it was a way he was lit or something oh I didn't see that okay yeah it looked

[01:59:55] weird oh I mean like it was creepy when he smiled back at her when she when he said erith wake

[01:59:59] up and she did close up and then he smiled yeah but like that's what he needs to believe

[02:00:06] yeah because he's Mako he's fucked up from on the Mako

[02:00:12] and then okay so then there's the final CGI scene the very final scene of the game where I mean

[02:00:19] oh god I don't know how to properly encapsulate this here's okay let's start here then the thing

[02:00:25] I really can't reconcile with my own theory is the fact that fake-ass erith at cloud sees went

[02:00:32] up behind red 13 and he kind of looks at me like erith remember that he reacts to yeah red reacts to it

[02:00:39] right so like to me at this particular time I'm like cloud is probably imagining it but if red actually

[02:00:46] responds that implies it's not totally in clouds head unless the unreliable narrator thing happens

[02:00:52] and er in cloud just imagines him saying that yeah see we don't we don't know right because

[02:00:59] we can't trust a goddamn thing that we see right at this point so yeah but just the roller coaster

[02:01:06] of it right she's there she's back she fades away she opens her eyes she's she appears again in another

[02:01:12] scene looking creepy she's there she's in one shot she's not in another shot yeah and like

[02:01:18] it's so it's so bizarre and I have to add one thing super bizarre really quick so like he has an

[02:01:23] empty white material in his hand right and so he pockets it or he seemingly puts it away

[02:01:28] and but then he lifts his hand again and it's like a black material like what he actually

[02:01:32] literally says what the hell right and I'm like he gets another like static he headache or whatever

[02:01:37] and then he says like never union or something or other like and then put the craziest thing

[02:01:41] that makes he actually like taps it into his sword and assimilates it which is not something

[02:01:45] we've ever seen before yeah that was weird it is like that was that was fucking weird

[02:01:54] you know this is a completely unseen thing so just like how the hell is this happening right

[02:02:01] how's any of this happening I don't know man that was bizarre yeah I don't know I don't know

[02:02:07] what to make of that at all but then of course like the final you know everyone's getting on

[02:02:12] the tiny Bronco and then cloud is having his final conversation with himself I guess if Arith is

[02:02:18] there I guess he's talking to her and that conversation was so weird it sounded like just

[02:02:27] clips of like just stuff that he remembers her saying clearly okay I'll put it this way when

[02:02:33] when Arith like take care and then clouds like oh will you be okay she's like don't worry it's like

[02:02:38] a second home it's like what second home are you talking about that's something she I feel

[02:02:44] like that's something she says in Midgar in remake oh maybe oh maybe yeah I think I could be wrong

[02:02:50] I feel like that's like not a line that's like but then also she says oh don't worry I'll stop the

[02:02:57] meteor I'll put everything into my prayers what she says that and then she's also says like

[02:03:04] I could just light a fire if I'm it's if I need or something like that right I'll send up like

[02:03:09] send us smoke send up smoke yeah but that's what she says when you call the tiny that's what

[02:03:13] you do when you call Sid so he's clearly making I would imagine in his head he's just

[02:03:20] making cloud fiction.net yeah like I mean it's just it's crazy I'll stop the meteor the meteor

[02:03:27] that we have not seen by the way that's right yeah we don't we he hasn't been summoned yet

[02:03:32] so it's like right what the god he's fucked see so fucked he's so fucked he's more fucked up

[02:03:39] than he ever was in the original game that's what's gonna make part three that's what's gonna

[02:03:45] make the the entire you know his entire character moment probably even bigger and more I don't know

[02:03:51] grandiose is the right word but I think you know what I'm getting at here it's yeah it thinks we'll

[02:03:56] come to a head yeah because he has a resolve that's all on his head in the lifesheema

[02:03:59] or whatever right so they're going to play that up like crazy how are you gonna sort like

[02:04:03] there's already like the tifa space build nonsense that was already really nuts and

[02:04:07] they're gonna like play lean into it like super hard when that scene arrives in the third game and

[02:04:12] cloud fiction.net dude it's so true man it's so true yeah it's a the freaking cloud fanfiction

[02:04:22] writer about air still being alive what if she's still survived or whatever right yeah but then he

[02:04:26] also he also says like remember he says to the party like don't look up it's you don't be shocked

[02:04:32] it's not real or something like that and bear it's like well I guess now I have to look and

[02:04:37] I don't see anything so yeah but but there's a camera shot of cloud looking up and there's a

[02:04:42] giant rift in the sky akin to the same rift that he saw like earlier in the chapter right

[02:04:47] right but like he's but he tifa tifa can't even look at him even like that look that she gave

[02:04:56] him was he were leaving the pool that by the way do you want to talk about that they didn't

[02:05:02] show us the classic scene of cloud lowering earth into the desert dead body into the pool

[02:05:08] and everyone like they showed the after everyone sitting around afterwards but they didn't actually

[02:05:14] show that part so there's several options right which is to say he still did it off camera but

[02:05:19] that doesn't make any sense if he's got this fanfic in his head right so maybe the implications

[02:05:24] that someone else did it and then he just kind of blew it off and like made shit up to reconcile

[02:05:29] I think he did it I think you did it yeah he did it they just can't show us that because

[02:05:35] that doesn't fit his narrative oh I saved her he did it but then he like kind of just forgot

[02:05:41] well no they just can't show us that part because that wouldn't be that wouldn't align with his

[02:05:47] idea or whatever he wants to believe in his head that he saved her when he deflected saffron

[02:05:53] sword oh but he so he did it but then his memories are kind of aligned a certain way

[02:05:57] yeah I can see that yeah sure yeah well he's just choosing he well he's just he's choosing not to like

[02:06:04] acknowledge that that happened essentially of sure that's I think that's why they didn't show us that

[02:06:11] man because because I saw I saw a lot of stuff online of people who did not like this ending

[02:06:16] who really were kind of mad that they did not show that yeah that's kind of a sticking

[02:06:20] point with people really but also like I think if someone's not carefully watching they might

[02:06:27] actually literally think she's alive because of the the way it's shot even though to us that's

[02:06:33] she's that's what I think one of the best things Maximilian dude said about

[02:06:39] this that whole thing is that like you can believe that if you want to

[02:06:43] but if you do believe that you are cloud in the scene you are you become cloud

[02:06:49] well literally there's nothing wrong with that but at the same time he's also making shit up

[02:06:55] yeah he's he it's clear because they didn't again they didn't he omitted that from our view of what

[02:07:02] happened there the earth and the pool because again that doesn't fit his narrative yeah for

[02:07:08] being alive I saved her and she's gonna somehow get to her second home with somehow the grasslands

[02:07:15] are not her second home or wherever the hell they are so why would she say that he's just

[02:07:21] regurgitating word lines that she said in other places I'll send up smoke yeah even the way she's

[02:07:28] like even clouds like I'll stop Sephiroth trust me you promise they even felt weird you promise

[02:07:37] yeah and he so he says he promised he sees promise but the game ends with the quote no promises

[02:07:44] await at journey's end which subverts literally everything that just happened cloud is so fucked up

[02:07:52] you just don't know you can't believe anything and just no and just obviously again it just

[02:07:58] sets up for part three for his reckoning but what a game it's great dude like what an ending and

[02:08:05] what I mean everything's just so expanded it keeps us guessing and yet I loved every bit of it

[02:08:23] all right what now is the time like shit over are all the alternate dimensions emerged as

[02:08:28] Sephiroth said that he wanted to do right and if so we left off what we didn't talk about this

[02:08:34] Zach was in the church at the end at the with the flowers so does that mean he's in our quote

[02:08:39] unquote our world now yeah because he literally says who's to say they can't the world can't come

[02:08:45] together again but if we take that at face value the implication is that they may still be split

[02:08:52] to a degree and honestly I think there's a very high likelihood that they are merged but I'm not

[02:08:57] really 100 convinced just because like there's still a kind of the ambiguity thereof just from

[02:09:04] the way that the chapter is shot right so but on the other hand he also might not know that they

[02:09:10] have been merged because he's just chilling this church by himself he just got dropped there so

[02:09:15] he doesn't know anything so they could be maybe just doesn't know yeah he may not know where he

[02:09:19] is either yeah right so well that would be interesting if you said like Zach scenes in

[02:09:26] the third game would be like trying to find the party because they're in the same world now

[02:09:31] that would be that would be cool because obviously they can't just forget about Zach they have to

[02:09:36] meet at some point I would as well he will he will materialize at some point yeah absolutely

[02:09:43] he's he's in this too much should not exactly I forget who said this and this is this is not

[02:09:48] my original thought by any means but there's a theory that basically the alternate timelines

[02:09:54] were essentially just wish fulfillment that's a matter right like just just what ifs like what if Zach

[02:09:59] was alive what if cloud saved Eryth right like what if Zach and cloud teamed up to fight Sefroth

[02:10:06] like all that shit happened in rebirth or seemingly happen seemingly happened right

[02:10:12] but you got to play them at the very least and that so matters and if that's the case

[02:10:17] that's why I think the timelines aren't needed anymore they already serve their

[02:10:20] like cloud fiction.net purpose right so like they have been merged just maybe not literally

[02:10:26] so on screen or whatever right I mean that is possible for sure but I mean it would be weird if

[02:10:32] they didn't like literally show I mean like do they have to have a visual of like that Sefroth

[02:10:39] like all the all the all the scenes and stuff like coming into one literally coming into one

[02:10:44] thing I mean they don't literally have to show that it's just they should probably hint at it

[02:10:47] at some point right but but that's the third game mystery right sure is how do you think cloud

[02:10:54] seeing quote-unquote seeing Eryth is gonna matter best because again Tifa knows she's just embarrassed

[02:11:03] at him and herself probably too we've been referring to cloud being so awkward and

[02:11:09] being so conversationally dense and it's only going to explode further in the third game because

[02:11:16] things are not going to be very smooth they're they're gonna like talk to but hey like do you

[02:11:20] remember Eryth you remember her doing something and he's like he's going to like he's gonna clash

[02:11:25] his thoughts in his perspective of things is going to clash with the parties absolutely and

[02:11:31] I mean there's gonna be some characters will be nicey nicey about it like red but

[02:11:37] I don't imagine things will go so smooth. Barrett isn't gonna put up with him like being

[02:11:41] like no Eryth is a lie I mean I don't think cloud is gonna literally say that of course that yeah but

[02:11:47] but it's gonna be so weird they know they know how messed up he is um I've heard a theory online

[02:11:56] that the perto relic stuff is leading to Knights of the Round you know what do you think of that

[02:12:03] god like that's the best thing to do right and like you actually make Knights of the Round

[02:12:09] like an actual like subplot right that would be great I think that'd be amazing and like they

[02:12:15] don't have much of an explanation in the original so I think that's the ultimate like this is probably

[02:12:20] among the most iconic summons in all of the JRPGs right so like yeah I don't see why you should

[02:12:25] not have to blow that up. Yeah it's like I said earlier it was things that were optional in

[02:12:30] the original we know they're not optional are you really gonna do a Final Fantasy 7 run without

[02:12:35] getting Yuffie or Vincent or Knights of the Round or a gold come on that's like part of the

[02:12:39] game you can okay you don't have to do it right are you really gonna like not go to Wu Tai you are

[02:12:47] yeah I can't wait for that by the way we haven't talked about any of the Wu Tai war or Shinra

[02:12:52] stuff but like that I cannot wait for in the third game that's gonna be so cool. Yeah they're

[02:12:58] building up a lot of political intrigue that just wasn't really there there's so much tension

[02:13:02] and it's gonna come to a head right and that's gonna be great to see absolutely.

[02:13:07] I think the final thing I have to say about all of this is that I'm not sure the third game will be

[02:13:12] like this as far as like a okay I'll put it this way we talked about earlier okay the way remake was

[02:13:21] that's the best you could probably do on PS4 right you couldn't really do you can't really do a

[02:13:26] game like Rebirth on PS4 I mean you could try but oh baby. I don't want to mention it.

[02:13:32] Yeah no thanks right they knew this was gonna be a PS5 game from the start so let's do our big

[02:13:37] open world thing on there I genuinely would not mind if the third game went back to being more

[02:13:44] linear. I really wouldn't mind it. So the biggest. I know that might piss a lot of people off but

[02:13:51] like I don't know the ends of these types of games ended up being pretty linear anyway so

[02:13:56] it wouldn't make any difference to me we already had our big adventure right? We did yeah. We don't

[02:13:59] need to do like the exact same thing and if it means like this game comes out in like 2027

[02:14:05] and not like 2029 fine but I'm okay with it what do you say? I'm okay with it however there's so many

[02:14:12] mysteries in my head right because this game is already like quite size sizable like it takes

[02:14:17] up a lot of two discs a lot of gigabytes and stuff like that right so the biggest question in my

[02:14:23] head ultimately is to what degree will previous areas be able to be revisited it's good because

[02:14:31] I feel like it'd be really strange if you could just do everything in these like

[02:14:36] existing open world areas against like all this time to go back to the grasslands and do

[02:14:39] everything as is I feel like that's kind of a inefficient uses space. It also wouldn't be

[02:14:45] interesting because we already did that. We already did it so I would imagine elements of these

[02:14:51] overworlds if not all of them will be excluded however you have an airship though so like

[02:14:58] what kind of in-universe explanation would you have to have an airship and not be able to revisit

[02:15:02] stuff right like in theory you could fly to whatever town you can fly back to calm if you

[02:15:06] really wanted to so like maybe something cataclysmic will happen that will prevent specific areas from

[02:15:12] being revisitable I guess right but like the weapon stuff right ruby weapon doesn't that

[02:15:18] don't you spend time chasing them shits around the map or something like that or like

[02:15:22] yeah well ruby weapons just chilling around the saucer area so maybe that could play into

[02:15:25] things somehow maybe specific areas will come back right but like I see that would benefit a

[02:15:30] linear game though if you have to do all this globe hopping and go everywhere well you know what

[02:15:35] though you can't because they have you have to fly the high wind you have to that's that's the

[02:15:42] reason why okay maybe i'm wrong you have to have the high wind it's not final fantasy seven if

[02:15:47] you don't yeah but it's just a matter of what you're going to be able to do with it

[02:15:51] and will you be able to let a world map of where like you choose a thing like it's fucking grandia

[02:15:58] too or something you got it you gotta like you gotta have you can land everywhere you don't

[02:16:04] know how freaking ghetto it would be if you were able to basically pilot the boat tiny bronco

[02:16:11] everywhere and then jk jk by the way you're you have this badass like airship and you

[02:16:18] can't do shit with it no you they would never take that away from us yeah they did all the

[02:16:23] chocobo shit of climbing walls and flying and water shit right they did they did all you can't

[02:16:30] you can't take that away from the player so maybe i'm wrong and the tiny bronco has a

[02:16:34] fucking like motion sensor like gyroscope ass thing man you can tell tell him stuff

[02:16:39] so like that when you're going to next destination that was like a preview right

[02:16:42] that was a preview of part three right gotta be even though you're on like a path you could still

[02:16:48] kind of like move it around there's no way it's going to be that on reels in part three that's

[02:16:53] that's inconceivable to me that that would be such a massive letdown and such a massive downgrade

[02:16:59] from everything in this game so they gotta let you do it i just want to know what you can land

[02:17:02] on man that's what i want to know you gotta land on everything you have to i don't see everything

[02:17:07] i understand it's hard to do but like look man this game has all the mini games and they added

[02:17:13] more mini games they did everything they did every fucking thing they got to let you do that with the

[02:17:18] high winder don't have it but every single overworld coming back is too hard though i think okay but

[02:17:27] man i don't know i think the town will come back to a degree but i don't know man i guess i

[02:17:31] guess we'll find out in a few years i hope it's not too long away the game's gonna be a

[02:17:36] gizillion gigabytes if like literally every overworld is back so i don't know this is already like what

[02:17:40] 150 yeah something like that the only two just ps5 game i know of so maybe they can maybe they can

[02:17:47] find some sort of compression technique in that by then i don't know my compression technique three

[02:17:52] discs that's not compression at all that's 250 gigs or something maybe i don't know baby

[02:18:00] okay what a mystery looking forward to it yeah looking forward to it final fantasy seven

[02:18:05] rebirth was really special we both loved it as you can tell from this very long discussion thanks

[02:18:11] for sticking with us yeah i think you got anything else uh materia materia pal the materia pal the

[02:18:18] set shirt in crime is tapped out me too check the description of this podcast to our links

[02:18:25] on social media until then we'll see you next time bye we'll get you next time it has been fine