Helldivers 2

[00:00:00] Ladies and gentlemen welcome back to another episode of The Pre-Order Bonus Podcast. I'm

[00:00:14] one of your host Cameron Warren and I'm joined as always by Jacob Price. It's March 14th,

[00:00:21] 24 and we're back to talk about video games. Jake, what?

[00:00:26] Dragons, dogma, to vocation are you going to pick?

[00:00:31] I'm sorry everybody I just picked the most basic masculine fighter.

[00:00:38] Mainly dude. Okay the cool thing I've been talking about this a little bit on social media

[00:00:46] and on Discord but like releasing that character creator demo amazing. I'm glad

[00:00:52] that they did it actually sat down with my kids and did it so my kids kind of helped design.

[00:00:57] My kids were super into the tattoos oh man. So my dude has the tats. Yeah dude he's got

[00:01:04] his just massive arms with massive tattoos on him and like super jacked.

[00:01:11] He's not like super jacked but my kids wanted his arms to be bigger.

[00:01:16] Which thanks to this character creator you can literally do a lot of arms but not that much chest.

[00:01:20] Yeah that makes sense. Yeah yeah yeah. Um, animo hawk.

[00:01:25] So if you want to go for the medieval physique you really need a huge shoulders, solid sized

[00:01:33] forms and then just okay like biceps and chest because you're doing a lot of swordswing and

[00:01:39] like you're not giving a lot of chest press in there. So is that what you did for your character?

[00:01:45] I kind of I tried to make just to be it's funny that you said you just did like a basic fighter

[00:01:51] because I was like I'm just making aroggorne straight up. Oh nice.

[00:01:55] I'm just doing aroggorne and I'm just like that's the look I'm going for and I'm naming

[00:02:00] the character straight up aroggorne. It's just Lord of the Rings fantasy that's all I'm doing dude

[00:02:04] you can't go wrong with him though. Error going is top tier. Oh yeah maybe this needs to be

[00:02:09] our next ranking just like top tier basic melee fighters. Top tier basic bro who are the top 10

[00:02:19] basic bros of video games? Well we're counting Error going already he's in there. Solid snake.

[00:02:25] Oh yeah. Oh nice.

[00:02:30] Calcastic. Calcastic. Cloud strife.

[00:02:36] Who else is just like a basic bro but we love love the most basic bro of all time. Oh captain

[00:02:42] chef or commander shepherd. Super basic like oh my gosh you can't even get more brown-haired brown

[00:02:49] I had than that.

[00:02:53] Oh but okay I'm not saying captain shepherd is this but we got to be careful not to get into

[00:02:58] him bow territory because that is a little different than just basic bro. That is true.

[00:03:03] I've heard actually that the female femship is actually the way to go apparently.

[00:03:09] You know I've seen that a lot too. In another life when I had an infinite time to play video games

[00:03:16] I'd go back and do a whole other play through with femship but I don't live in that universe.

[00:03:22] I live in this one. You know you had to pick bro chef because there's romance in it and you're you

[00:03:26] know heterosexual males and you just you know you want to pick the ladies it's part of the fantasy

[00:03:34] anyway. Nice. I mean the sci-fi. It's part of the sci-fi. Sure sure yeah science fiction.

[00:03:45] Yeah yeah same thing. Let's see um yeah the character creator is just amazing okay but I was

[00:03:49] gonna ask though what about your pond? What did you do for your pond? Gandalf but a cat.

[00:03:55] Gandalf like cat. Oh that sounds great. Cat golf cat gaff. Cat gaff. What would be a cat

[00:04:03] dolphin? What would be the ideal? I don't know man I don't know. Cat golf I think.

[00:04:09] Here's the thing now. I made a serious mistake. I spent like probably an hour character creator and

[00:04:14] then I realized that was on the wrong steam account so that's so that does suck. So I'm probably

[00:04:19] gonna do it again but that's okay because I feel like I've gotten better at the character creator

[00:04:23] so maybe do a better job but that's how complex I think the character creator is for dragons dog

[00:04:29] dogma two where it's so complex you probably do need a trial run and then go back once you figure out

[00:04:34] how to use all the tools correctly. I feel like this is a type of game where here's the thing

[00:04:39] that bothers me about this type of game. I have ADHD super bad so I'm gonna I'm gonna I did the most

[00:04:44] basic warrior thing because I just couldn't I'm like I'm gonna be drawn to all these different types

[00:04:51] of play styles and classes and crap yeah and then I'm gonna get sucked into one of my crap like

[00:04:56] I actually do that one of these other ones is like you know what I'm just gonna like put blinders on

[00:05:01] and just be the most basic warrior possible and then my ponds can have all the fun I don't know

[00:05:05] that's kind of what I thought about it yeah uh yeah we'll see though it says that this I'm pretty

[00:05:10] sure it's that the vocations can change so I wonder if like they're just gonna allow for easy respect

[00:05:15] or not and you just like respect and do whatever I feel like I'm good not vibe that you probably

[00:05:20] can yeah so my which I think would be the way to go. Pretty excited for that but mostly have been

[00:05:28] playing super super super deep into Final Fantasy 7 rebirth I'm about 40 hours deep into that so

[00:05:40] just absolutely just plan the heck out of that game um I have started to slow down not because the

[00:05:49] game's like getting worse or anything but just because it is freaking huge yeah this game is

[00:05:57] absolutely massive this game is probably a little bit too big I'm just gonna say it I think it's

[00:06:07] probably a bit too big here's the thing so I hate I'm assuming I'm towards the very end of chapter

[00:06:15] 8 and the thing about chapter 8 that I realized was there is so much side content in this game

[00:06:21] that I'm not gonna get to like yeah tall that's the realization you come to yeah there is so so much

[00:06:29] and like I know you and I came and we both got like 100% world intel in the first area and grasslands

[00:06:35] and I you know that number has slowly been trickling down as I get further into the game. Yeah every

[00:06:40] area it's like a little bit less but yeah I hit this point in chapter 8 and I won't mention it

[00:06:47] because a bunch of people are still playing but I hit a point for me I was like yeah side content

[00:06:52] is gonna be pretty minimal from here on out just because I realized how how much is in this game

[00:06:58] it kind of actually I've had a similar observation with this other game that I've been playing

[00:07:04] which I'm going to finish tonight I'm literally at the doorstep of the final moment

[00:07:08] it's banishers go some new Eden um which honestly has been a pretty good game I really like it

[00:07:15] but again that game surprisingly has so much content in it that I'm like man I think I'm probably

[00:07:24] gonna end up with like 25 hours in it mostly mainlining it because I again I reached another point

[00:07:30] in that game where I was like there is a lot of side content in here and so just two games that

[00:07:35] came out this year might kind of take away for rebirth and for like um banishers is that if you

[00:07:41] like either of these games you could play this game in nothing else for months and be really happy

[00:07:46] which I think is a good thing you know yeah I mean normally I'm not this is a like and well

[00:07:53] obviously huge episode coming on phone this is Evan rebirth but we're in like the heat of it right

[00:08:00] now so just hard not to comment but it's it's a checklist style open world yeah and just it's just

[00:08:09] a massive checklist and it's a really good checklist like admittedly it is like a really solid

[00:08:14] satisfying check like it's satisfying to go check it a lot better in my opinion more effective than

[00:08:21] recent iterations of like Far Cry and Assassin's Creed who invented that style of open world right

[00:08:26] they even has towers in it for goodness sake like it's um but yeah no but but yeah it's just so

[00:08:34] huge that a certain point like for people like Jake and I it's like we are playing a lot of

[00:08:39] different games and just the ADHD is overpowering right and you just you can't and there's just

[00:08:45] something about just playing the same thing for 60 plus hours when there's just so many other things

[00:08:52] that like you want to put your hands on and you just have to make a decision at some point on time

[00:08:55] this is a good I think extended edition topic Jake talking about side quests side content yeah

[00:09:02] so keep an eye on that for the future we'll discuss that but um yeah I agree and

[00:09:07] and this is another one of those moments just to reiterate right we camera and I've been doing

[00:09:11] this podcast for many years now at those point I want to say we've been doing it for about four

[00:09:14] years and um the way that we play video games and the way that we discuss them is maybe not the

[00:09:21] way that you play video games right and so um I think that's that's kind of the point I want to

[00:09:27] make is like I could see myself only playing banishers or only playing rebirth for a long time because

[00:09:35] there's a lot of really enjoyable content in both of those games um but obviously for Cameron and I

[00:09:41] the way that we do the show and the way we maintain our episodes and the way that we play it's it's

[00:09:46] kind of just a weird feeling I feel like to be like I could see myself really get into this game

[00:09:51] but I'm not gonna right so yeah but that's all I really have to say there be on the lookout for our

[00:09:57] episode on rebirth it's coming it's down the pipeline uh Cameron I actually have a deadline for us

[00:10:02] to to finish it so we got to get cranking on that yeah I don't think I'm gonna make that I'm gonna try

[00:10:11] I'm hoping to get a lot of time in this weekend um and next week obviously but

[00:10:18] going on Scott got dragon dog but two incoming next Friday whoo and it's gonna be really hard

[00:10:25] not to turn that on like once it's in the open yeah I'm gonna be out like yeah you know I'm just gonna

[00:10:30] cuz I'm just I'm still so fascinated at like I played dragon dog dragon dog my one

[00:10:36] I have like some idea of like what the game is but I still don't really know what the game is

[00:10:40] and so I'm excited to kind of figure out for myself they've shown a lot but they haven't shown

[00:10:45] everything which I really appreciate I think the newest video they just put out this afternoon

[00:10:51] which is uh uh like voiced over introduction to the world of dragons dog but probably is the most

[00:10:58] revealing video on like kind of what the game is which it was pretty good right anyways yeah video games

[00:11:07] other than that Jake we've been playing a lot of another game multiplayer called helldivers too

[00:11:13] which has taken over the internet yes and we're gonna talk about this one on today's episode Jake

[00:11:19] how are we gonna break it down we will be talking about helldivers to the smash hit one of the many

[00:11:24] smash hits of the beginning of this year but we'll be talking about it in our characteristic four

[00:11:29] categories so the first one is the narrative um folks just uh we typically don't do spoilers will

[00:11:36] typically only go into the first 20 30% of a game helldivers too we're gonna be talking about all

[00:11:41] of it because the narrative is what it is so there isn't really much to spoil but just you're kind

[00:11:48] of you're kind of warned I would say there um and then second category is mechanics a lot of

[00:11:53] mechanics in this game we talk about how we sort of interact with it how um different systems take

[00:11:59] place how gunplay is like essentially what you were doing in each mission and then thirdly we'll be

[00:12:04] talking about the gameplay loop and so what is keeping you coming back why so many people are still

[00:12:10] playing this game and um just sort of those circuits that are built in that might define a play

[00:12:16] session or how you play helldivers too and then finally impact on the industry and I'm really

[00:12:25] looking forward to this portion of our conversation tonight um because Cameron and I lately have been

[00:12:31] discussing quite a lot about layoffs in sort of this big moments of turmoil that the video games

[00:12:36] industry is dealing with when it comes to funding and just huge costs and trying to recoup those

[00:12:41] costs and so I think helldivers too is gonna be really fascinating sort of case study in the middle

[00:12:46] of all that chaos that's happening but we'll get to that as our final category at the end of the show

[00:12:50] this evening. Helldivers to narrative I think the narrative of this game is not the narrative in the

[00:13:06] game itself but the narrative being created by the very very savvy social media team that's

[00:13:18] arrowhead and the community reacting exactly the way that I think arrowhead once them wanted them to

[00:13:26] which is the whole concept of like the helldivers being the military of this giant fascist government

[00:13:37] of super earth that is going out to defend the motherland against you know the bugs and the

[00:13:43] automaton's but then there's these little like tick-tock and twitter and tweets and like various

[00:13:50] things that get posted that are like well are we actually the bad guys yeah and there's an entire

[00:13:59] like content stream around this idea of like the propaganda of the helldivers universe and that

[00:14:07] we are actually the bad guys and it is hilarious it is absolutely hilarious and just

[00:14:16] and I think that and that and you know the narrative set piece of the game is like there's this

[00:14:21] introductory video that's essentially Starship troopers it's like come join the helldivers and fight for

[00:14:27] us for super earth defend against bubbly blah and it's very like propaganda you know kind of war

[00:14:34] bond style like video for this like future dystopian earth right yeah and yeah and that's pretty much

[00:14:43] all the context you get and then you're going to like fighting these bugs and these robots

[00:14:51] and it's through like the tweets and like the posts from the developers and then like people playing

[00:14:56] into that content and because the games like been received so well it's just taken off on social media

[00:15:02] and it's become this it's become like this massive inside joke to to just like feed into this whole

[00:15:09] like universe and it's it's crazy it's absolutely crazy yeah um I think you absolutely nailed it the

[00:15:17] the story itself of the game is really bare bones is explained mostly through exposition that's

[00:15:22] given during the tutorial you go in you become a helldiver and you're essentially killing these

[00:15:28] bad guys to help maintain and support democracy for super earth it is all very tongue and cheek

[00:15:35] it is all satire and it is all really funny now the joke itself that's the game is the one

[00:15:41] joke and that's kind of it and so I think if you're looking for a bunch of narrative depth and you're

[00:15:45] not finding it in that aspect of the game right like you just come into it and here check out

[00:15:51] this this attire that's it but like cameras pointed out the best thing that this game has done

[00:15:57] is create its own meta narrative right about what is happening with the players how they're

[00:16:03] responding to different things that are going on better narrative use correctly Jake yeah that's

[00:16:07] what I was going for but yeah I mean that's it that's that's the really fun part of it and so

[00:16:11] social media I feel like there's social media manager and kind of how they're interacting with

[00:16:16] the player base has just been phenomenal it's really really been top notch and it's been cool to

[00:16:23] see them making jokes but also being like okay hey we need to liberate these planets and if the

[00:16:30] players can liberate these planets and you get this in-game reward and so most recently that

[00:16:34] would be like the mechs right and so the whole meta narrative of like we're all sort of knowingly

[00:16:42] pretending that we're part of this universe and then the the devs are telling us meet these goals

[00:16:49] get these rewards and this is what you're doing to advance sort of the story to advance the front

[00:16:53] line to win the war for humanity and for democracy in game and it's just it's just such a great

[00:16:59] way to engage a community and to give a lot of incentive to just keep going back in there so they've

[00:17:07] created this super interesting dynamic but like you've said and I'm repeating myself here in summary

[00:17:14] it's about really it's about that meta narrative it's about creating that desire absolutely to get

[00:17:20] the players really jazzed about going back in and playing the game some more because otherwise

[00:17:27] there's no there's no like protagonist there's no one person that we're rooting for it's all about

[00:17:33] ideas that are being represented and that are being satirized yeah it's the the meta narrative is kind of

[00:17:42] everything um for that and it's like when I first booted up the game like for the very first time

[00:17:49] I was like you know it's it is it's like the gameplay is there and we'll talk about in a second

[00:17:56] and it has great aesthetics and like everything looks and like feels really good and it's like okay

[00:18:01] I get what we're doing here we're like this you know we're this giant army and we're killing bugs

[00:18:07] and that's about as simple as it gets but man there are so many hilarious like the most recent one

[00:18:12] that's been the funniest is the the developers it was the dev account for arrow for arrowhead

[00:18:18] was tweeting that there are no flying enemies in the game yeah there's no flying it but then

[00:18:26] they people are posting screenshots of the flying and the game uh and so it's this whole like

[00:18:34] tongue and cheek like he said Jake like propaganda machine yeah on behalf of the quote unquote

[00:18:40] hell divers that's just so fun and like funny to watch and this game is also blowing up streaming

[00:18:47] like lots of huge streamers like plan plan is yeah and it's it's still going they've had a like

[00:18:51] pretty nice content stream like you just mentioned the recent really interesting we'll talk about

[00:18:58] kind of mechanics gameplay loop in a second on this but really interesting deployment of live

[00:19:02] service where they had an in-game event where it was like hey here's this planet and like we can't

[00:19:09] release the max until you guys take over this planet and so that was this like community wide oh

[00:19:13] okay we gotta go let's all go jump on we got a plane out so we can unlock the mech strategy and then

[00:19:21] it made it free for like a day in game or whatever which is this is like really cool way to

[00:19:26] to kind of combine this idea of narrative with this sort of very interesting application of like

[00:19:33] a live service element yeah um this will probably be the final thing I say when it comes to narrative

[00:19:39] but the the community aspect of this game is one like they really are leveraging I think in a

[00:19:46] really great way this this tongue and cheek joke everybody's in on the inside joke you don't

[00:19:52] you're not left out like you play hell divers too you get the joke and the joke keeps going

[00:19:57] and it has in-game rewards and that is just I think the best way to really drive that sort of

[00:20:03] community spirit and unity like you said um when when the game has a call when there's a major

[00:20:10] order like hey we need to get this stuff done you know and then people they'll rally to the cause

[00:20:15] because they're in on the joke and then they become in on the community and they're in on that

[00:20:21] meta-narrative experience and it's all the more worthwhile to just keep playing the game so it's

[00:20:26] just really brilliant um use of meta-narrative which which honestly it's so funny because I feel

[00:20:34] like this really flies in the face of the popular trend of like connected worlds and connected

[00:20:42] universes and stories that are told within the same universe where it feels like those narratives

[00:20:48] have to break their backs or bend in weird ways to try to create like cohesion between all these

[00:20:54] multiple stories and here in hell divers too like that's how they create their meta-narrative right

[00:21:00] I would say outside of hell divers too was like okay we're gonna say that oh but this is actually part

[00:21:05] of this universe and this is how it fits in neatly whereas hell divers two is like here's the inside

[00:21:10] joke everybody's welcome the joke just keeps on rolling and as it rolls it just has a snowball effect

[00:21:16] that accumulates more and more people I'm not sure if that's super clear but I just think it's

[00:21:20] two very different strategies to try to build a meta-narrative and build a wider community

[00:21:25] and it works for Airhead Studios man they just nailed it

[00:21:31] yeah do it really well let's talk about mechanics um I mean obviously none of this

[00:21:37] meta-narrative would be happening if the game just didn't just wasn't fun yeah

[00:21:43] and and I think they knocked out of the park like the game feel is just phenomenal

[00:21:50] like it's a it's a third person shooter and the way that they've combined really um I always

[00:21:59] struggle to find the words that like describe movement that just feels really um good yeah

[00:22:08] I can't think of better adjective like it feels good but in a way that it's almost like sort of

[00:22:14] a realistic grounded movement with a lot of physics to it and heaviness to it that

[00:22:21] that just translates to oh man like when you play the game it gives us another element to the

[00:22:28] mechanics everything you're doing like the shooting and the jumping around and the sliding and

[00:22:33] you know diving off cliffs and all that stuff and just how the characters move and these kind

[00:22:38] of small ways it's all just really satisfying and they pull off this really great um

[00:22:44] said I mean at the end of the day it's just third person shooter um but because of the way

[00:22:51] that you move around it just it just takes it to um it just elevates it yeah I would say the movement

[00:22:59] in this game I agree with this it is it's I feel like this was a huge risk because yeah totally

[00:23:07] with a lot of it's not smooth right no and it's in most games I would consider this type of

[00:23:13] movement cumbersome because cumbersome yes it is it is not fast however it is extremely responsive

[00:23:22] and tactile right which which really plays into what you're doing in the game as you're trying to

[00:23:28] mo down these enemies these hordes of enemies that are coming upon you as you're completing objectives

[00:23:33] and I just think um probably one of the chief important mechanics for me is that you if you want

[00:23:40] a clean shot you got to be stationary and so you have to really be preemptive when it comes to

[00:23:48] being you know just engaging in these fire fights because if you're on the run and you're trying

[00:23:53] to shoot most your bolts are gonna miss you're the all enemies are faster than you and you're gonna

[00:23:59] get taken over and so this sort of movement makes it feel like you just have to play smarter not

[00:24:06] harder and when you can sort of buy into that and I feel like every game session I have to be like

[00:24:12] okay I'm not there's no power fantasy here I need to I need to get back you know I need to think

[00:24:18] more tactically and I think for me the reason why this works really well in this game is because

[00:24:23] it is extremely rewarding if you can play smart you can make a huge dent in the enemies that are

[00:24:30] coming out around you and so I've been playing this on ps5 and I just got to say this is the best

[00:24:36] use I think of the ps5 controllers have to feedback and just I haven't played a game that has felt

[00:24:43] nearly this good to play on PlayStation and I I just love the way that the triggers especially

[00:24:49] respond if I run out of bullets or zoom in or just the ps5 controller like this this was a game

[00:24:57] that was like yes this controller is next gen I love this it is amazing and so the controller

[00:25:03] giving you that sort of feedback in addition to the way that the movement operates that rewards

[00:25:09] smoother smaller tactical movement and fire just makes a game much more fun and much more enjoyable

[00:25:18] to to really dig into yeah that tactile movement and just having like a really good physics

[00:25:28] where your guy you get hit by a bomb and you just like fly across the map there's something so

[00:25:34] fun and hilarious about that that just makes dying so much more interesting and hilarious man

[00:25:42] oh my gosh interesting and hilarious yeah like you get team killed and you're like kind of mad

[00:25:47] but at the same time you're like laughing which that's just that's just one of those sort of intangibles

[00:25:54] that you can't I don't know if you like you can't really like design that in that's just like

[00:26:00] something I think that like happens it's like oh yeah how do we make team killing and like

[00:26:05] blowing each other up how do we make that fun I don't know how you figure that out like on paper

[00:26:10] I just think like you make something and it kind of emerges and there's so much of that emergent

[00:26:15] gameplay here where it's just like oh I you know you're running around and then you have a

[00:26:19] series of stratagem which is another thing that this game does which on on paper seems crazy

[00:26:26] right you're saying hey here's all of your abilities these are like your giant bombs or air strikes or

[00:26:35] like machine gun post that you can throw down or like additional weapons these are your

[00:26:40] stratagem that you select when you go into a mission you have to actually like tactically input

[00:26:47] a series of you know up down left right buttons to get them to happen which on paper is like

[00:26:54] oh man why would you put the player through that paint but there's something about like the stress

[00:26:58] and the tension and having that extra bit of like gamifying the use of the stratagem by requiring

[00:27:06] the player put in an input and then adding even like a little bit of a skill on into that and then

[00:27:11] a little bit of tension because if you're in a really dire situation it's kind of hard to put

[00:27:17] in the inputs like in the right way and so as this extra element of tension to the gameplay

[00:27:24] that just really works and it's something on paper that you're like just let me just let me like

[00:27:29] hit A and throw the stupid thing right but but adding that little piece in again it just elevates

[00:27:36] the game so i i'm workshopping my thoughts here to kind of see why i think this works and i think

[00:27:43] hell divers two functions is almost like an inverse roguelite in that when you take big risks

[00:27:51] it's not the end of the world right you can get spawned back in you live and learn like i just

[00:27:57] feel like there's a lot of generosity in there um for the player to be able to take those kind

[00:28:06] of risks and just figure out like oh can i pull this off right now can i pull off this elaborate

[00:28:11] stratagem right now and some stratagem are only four inputs long but some are like eight plus inputs

[00:28:16] long and i feel like if you can memorize your stratagem if you can really get those inputs put in

[00:28:22] quickly then you get the reward you know maybe you die in the process but dying is so secondary

[00:28:29] to other things that you're trying to accomplish in this game it's like hey i know if i could get a

[00:28:33] napalm strike to land right here it's gonna really help out my team and so you call in the napalm

[00:28:39] strike you break all of your limbs and then you can't move and then you're killed and you laugh about

[00:28:45] it right and then the napalm which is also hilarious like they've made it fun to fail yes i think

[00:28:52] maybe which is amazing that is the succinct way of putting how i i'm getting this like inverse roguelike

[00:28:58] feeling right where you know in a bunch of roguelikes you get deep into a run the run dies maybe to

[00:29:05] something really stupid a stupid decision you made or just some stupid rng in the game and you're

[00:29:10] crap i have to do this whole thing all over again right but every time you fail and held

[00:29:14] divers too like you're either laughing about it or you're learning from it and so your progress

[00:29:19] isn't all that halted as you're getting as you're playing through the game

[00:29:27] yeah um jake any other thoughts on mechanics i think i want to move into gameplay loop because

[00:29:33] talk about i have some thoughts there i just the final thing i want to say is that um it kind of

[00:29:39] takes a little while before you get a variety of guns um at your disposal but once you play

[00:29:46] enough to sort of get that variety like more of a variety in your arsenal um it becomes a lot more

[00:29:53] fun i like i really didn't like the starting loadout for example but now that i've unlocked a few

[00:29:58] guns and i can kind of understand like situationally like what i'm better with and how i can use these

[00:30:05] guns um and which ones i like most and how to just use what's at my disposal then i think the weapon

[00:30:14] design got a lot more interesting and a lot more fun but kind of a steep learning curve i feel like

[00:30:21] yeah so gameplay wise or gameplay loop wise you have um there's a paid battle pass

[00:30:28] and then there's a uh just a built-in it's not called a battle pass what's it called

[00:30:36] i mean i've been calling it a battle pass i remember is it a battle pass it's called something else

[00:30:40] but anyway i can't remember anyway there's two passes when you play when you go down and do a mission

[00:30:45] you pick like a spot in you know the galaxy you get onto the planet usually depending on your

[00:30:53] level of difficulty there'll be two to three different missions if you complete those missions in

[00:30:58] succession each of those missions offer like a very variety of different types of objectives that

[00:31:02] you have to complete one example would be like launching a nuclear weapon another one is like

[00:31:07] blow up a bug hive or another one is um just a defense defense mission like a horde mode

[00:31:15] and when in those missions you can pick up um a couple different kinds of currencies so the more

[00:31:21] objectives that you complete you'll pick up like i can't remember the name of the yellow currency

[00:31:27] but you can use that currency to buy new strategies and as you level up your player

[00:31:33] you also get experienced from each mission so as you level up you can use that money to buy new

[00:31:39] strategies and as you level up you get access to new ones the higher level you are

[00:31:43] and then you can also pick up um another kind of currency so so there's there's lots of currencies

[00:31:50] in this game so there's a yellow currency they used to buy strategies there's like green and orange

[00:31:57] what do they what do they call it again i don't even know i just identify them by color to be honest

[00:32:02] they're yeah they're they have a specific name but anyway you use those that gives you a whole

[00:32:06] access to a whole different set of upgrades that make your strategies more powerful and those are

[00:32:12] kind of scattered throughout each map um and you have to go out and find them and if you don't

[00:32:18] if you don't escape from the level at the end if you don't um if you don't get out

[00:32:23] you'll actually lose those and so and if you play on a hard mode it's actually pretty difficult to

[00:32:30] get a lot of those and hang onto them because you'll die a lot yeah and so it adds like an element

[00:32:34] of strategy and amount and a little bit of tension there and then the other piece is getting um just

[00:32:41] the medals and the medals come from completing missions and succession you can pick them up in

[00:32:48] each level as you play them and then if you do major orders which are the sort of game wide

[00:32:54] achievements you'll get like a huge influx of medals yeah you'll get like 25 or 50 i logged in

[00:33:01] yesterday and add 150 of them yeah which is crazy um and so then you can go through these battle

[00:33:06] passes and just go unlock a whole bunch of stuff uh like new weapons capes armor and then again

[00:33:12] there's a free one and there's a paid one yeah this is like the loop this isn't really

[00:33:19] I mean I don't know that it's necessarily doing anything differently than a lot of other

[00:33:27] sort of live service games with this style of progression unlock system but I do sit what

[00:33:33] I will say is that it does feel very generous and like easy to achieve new stuff in a way that

[00:33:45] I don't think I felt any of their games since like fortnight whereas fortnight is also like feels

[00:33:49] very generous and like how you unlock things this game also has that where it gives you the sense

[00:33:56] of progression with your character without feeling grindy yeah and I think the way that it manages to

[00:34:03] achieve that is through its many currencies which typically I don't like and I'm not going to say

[00:34:09] that I necessarily like that about hull divers too it's like oh my gosh how many currencies what

[00:34:13] currency do I need to do to do this it's like not that big of a roadblock but the way that I feel

[00:34:18] like hell divers too feels like it's not grindy is that every time you come back after a mission you

[00:34:26] probably reach some sort of threshold with one of the currencies of something you were saving up for

[00:34:31] whether that be okay so I need x amount of more metals I'll probably get that this next mission

[00:34:37] or it's like oh this next mission I've got enough xp to level up I could check out what new

[00:34:41] strategies I can buy oh I got a new you know the yellow currency I can't remember what it's called

[00:34:46] but hey I got a huge chunk of that now I could buy the strategy on but that I've been waiting to buy

[00:34:51] and so I feel like all of the currencies are offset just enough that you're hitting those thresholds

[00:34:57] that you're able to use them between maybe not every mission but every two like every other mission

[00:35:05] maybe and so it doesn't ever feel like you're sitting there grinding things out

[00:35:14] and I like that quite a lot it is it could be a huge pain in the butt or a kick in the pants

[00:35:19] right when it's just like oh wait it looks like I'm gonna have to grind out another five missions

[00:35:24] before I'm able to do this the other thing in camera you mentioned this is that like the major

[00:35:29] orders like this is a super community focused game and thank you to the to the no lifeers out there

[00:35:37] thank you to the streamers who are putting in hours and hours and hours of work because the rest

[00:35:42] of us were benefiting it from from it right you can you can log in and you're like oh shoot I just

[00:35:47] got 50 extra metals and so you go through one of the battle passes right if you have the premium

[00:35:52] one or if you have just the basic seasonal one and you're like great 50 metals is it pretty big chunk

[00:35:57] of change to spend on things and then you're in your like oh great I have 50 new metals I came by

[00:36:04] one new gun let's try this out this looks really cool looks like it has some good perks

[00:36:09] hey that might be able to fill in where you know and you just get excited about the kind of things

[00:36:13] that you can unlock thanks to the community putting in so much work and so yeah I mean the gameplay

[00:36:21] loop really is there for you to just keep going mission like mission after mission in and out

[00:36:29] and that's probably I think that maybe dangerous thing about this is the the game is like

[00:36:35] one more mission I'll just do one more mission you know some missions are crazy short you only

[00:36:39] have like a 10 minute timer and some that gave you up to 40 minutes but it might only take you 25

[00:36:44] and so you're like yeah they should take about 15 minutes let me do another one and then next thing

[00:36:48] you know it's been an hour right so the gameplay loop is really really addicting in that way

[00:36:55] yeah and then there's other elements to it where like as your level goes up you unlock higher tears

[00:37:00] of difficulty and as you get better weapons like you make those tears of difficulty like easier

[00:37:06] and that's and so it behooves you to go in get out with like the orange and green currency that

[00:37:13] allows you to upgrade your stratagem so you can make those more powerful or else you're going

[00:37:17] to be screwed over in like the hard and extreme levels of difficulty and I think it goes up to

[00:37:23] I want to say nine levels of difficulty and I haven't actually played like the highest levels but

[00:37:28] I've seen some videos and it just looks like ridiculous like ridiculous insane levels of challenge

[00:37:37] but that's that's kind of the that's kind of the whole stick to this like if you're really into the game

[00:37:43] um if you're really into the game and I think that's what the streamers are kind of going after is

[00:37:50] like hey how hard can we go and how many like how much current how many samples that's what they're

[00:37:57] called samples yeah oh yeah yeah how many of these rare samples can we get out of the mission with

[00:38:03] and when you really try and max that out the game gets really tough you have to use a lot of

[00:38:09] strategy there's like a lot of planning involved and so that's kind of where it gets interesting

[00:38:14] and like in depth and tactical as you get up into those hard difficulty levels but you absolutely

[00:38:20] don't have to do that you can just absolutely just jump in play a quick mission medium get your

[00:38:27] experience points have fun kill them bugs and you're out that honestly I think it's the biggest

[00:38:32] triumph of hell divers too it is so so difficult and this is a problem that our group of friends

[00:38:40] our core group of like friends that we play games with we really struggle to find a game where

[00:38:45] we all have different play styles some we all have different amount of time different amounts of

[00:38:50] time that we can dedicate to playing the game so what game could we all jump in together you know

[00:38:55] when we're tired and it's after bedtime um and just play together right in hell divers who manages

[00:39:03] to do that it manages to make it that if you were only playing this game two hours a week or if

[00:39:08] you're playing this game 20 hours a week you can team up in the same squad and you can play

[00:39:16] the game and still enjoy it together and that is to me that's absolutely wild and it's crazy rare

[00:39:24] to see an online multiplayer game where it is so accommodating to somebody different play styles

[00:39:29] whether that be and so I've just touched on like how much time that you have to play a game but

[00:39:33] Cameron is talking about like if you were playing this game a ton if you're a streamer well guess what

[00:39:40] you can crank the difficulty crazy high get some huge rewards and you can you know that type of

[00:39:47] player can actually keep going and feel like they have more and more to do in this game and that

[00:39:52] is insane like I don't know how they managed to pull that off and I don't even know if that was

[00:39:57] their goal necessarily right because what's interesting about hell divers two right is people were

[00:40:03] asking for different features or modes to be added to the game and even the devs themselves said

[00:40:09] like a game made for everybody's a game made for nobody but at the same time they managed to make

[00:40:15] an experience where pretty much anybody can jump in and get something out of it even if the

[00:40:21] people that they play with have different play styles truly remarkable yeah really smart design

[00:40:29] decisions here and it just like speaks in the game like really well there's a really nice difficulty

[00:40:34] curve that to your point like yeah they said it like a game designed for everyone's games ever no

[00:40:40] one but yeah you that's absolutely true like they they gave every spectrum here of ways to enjoy

[00:40:48] this game which is which is great um I think we've been super super positive on this game I don't

[00:40:55] really have many negative things to say I think the game really truly does accomplish everything that

[00:41:04] it sets out to do that being said like what it sets out to do may not before you that's maybe the

[00:41:09] only negative thing I can say is like it's not it may not be for you right it doesn't have pvp

[00:41:16] it doesn't have a really beefy single player campaign it doesn't have really much of a story at all

[00:41:22] like it's a third person shooter so if you don't like those things like you are definitely not

[00:41:28] going to like this game because it goes really hard into the elements that it does which I think

[00:41:33] to its benefit um but yeah I don't think it is for everyone to be honest yeah and I think in that

[00:41:41] regard it very much follows that sort of that mantra of a game made for everybody's a game made

[00:41:47] for nobody this isn't extremely like hyper specific pve experience and that's it that's the

[00:41:55] package deal and if you don't like that you're not going to like the game however I would also

[00:42:01] just add that if you want to play it you know get the get the friends together get the game

[00:42:07] together to play a game this is the one that's gonna do it for you right anybody you can do it

[00:42:13] at this time um yeah and it's really fantastic I'd also say that if you are hoping for a power

[00:42:19] fantasy this game is not it like this game beats you up this game beats you down especially if

[00:42:28] the difficulties up yeah it's it's not a power fantasy it's it's about the moment to moment fun

[00:42:33] like ragdoll like most extremely ridiculous deaths um the giant the random like

[00:42:40] volcanic activity that shows up on one of the planets now oh yeah they have like environmental

[00:42:46] hazards now like firestorms and asteroids and crap and it's just like well I got hit by you know

[00:42:56] a lava bomb a meteor I guess that's it you know um so yeah I don't know I'm trying to think

[00:43:03] if there's anything else I mean it's just one of those things I think it's a game that is hyper

[00:43:07] focused but beautifully and perfectly packaged for what it's trying to accomplish and so if you're

[00:43:13] on the fence about this game what I would recommend is just watch some streams find your favorite

[00:43:17] streamer or find any streamer and just mute them that's playing the game if you don't really care

[00:43:21] about the streamer and just see like see see it see an action right um but yeah I don't know I

[00:43:29] would I guess my one criticism is that for me personally there's a little bit of a learning curve

[00:43:35] because I was used to um having more tools in my disposal immediately with some like third-person

[00:43:42] action shooter games this game does really start you with minimum bare bones yeah and you do have

[00:43:49] to put in the effort to get the use to the feel of the game and get a few missions under your belt

[00:43:56] before you can expand your arsenal and really dive into the more interesting mechanics of the game

[00:44:01] um so I feel like at first it feels like a steep climb uphill with the grind but one there's

[00:44:07] like a breaking point and I couldn't tell you where it is mathematically or anything but

[00:44:12] once you hit that point it's smooth sailing yeah I would agree I think just uh I mean say

[00:44:17] something negative I do think I I mean but this is just it's not really negative it's just saying

[00:44:21] like the game is not trying to do this um but yeah I'm always love to have a great story in a game

[00:44:28] and so I would love to see and maybe this isn't the plans right is to have some beefier like in-game

[00:44:35] narrative type elements and maybe not and that's fine and this game is not built for that and

[00:44:41] doesn't absolutely does not need to do that this is just me saying like I it would be fun to have

[00:44:47] some sort of like story campaign co-op situation but that's just a personal personal want

[00:44:53] that will probably never happen but this brings us into the interesting part of the conversation

[00:44:58] with this game this is a talking about the impact on the industry this is a live service game

[00:45:03] this is straight up a live service multiplayer game which had been much maligned over the past

[00:45:09] couple years and we have had so so so many failures in this space we've had suicide squad absolute

[00:45:16] flop anthem several years ago now it's been feels like 20 years since we've had anthanasia at this

[00:45:24] point but suicide squad being the most recent avengers before that um I mean there's a million

[00:45:32] examples uh that Ubisoft's battle royale game that completely failed there was the

[00:45:41] Ubisoft battle royale game yeah there's the dodgeball game that failed there was the

[00:45:48] bleeding edge the wrestling battle royale game that failed anyway there's been so many you

[00:45:56] know what I'm talking about I can't think of the names of these games because they're out of the

[00:46:00] public conscious right I mean they're shut down like the servers are down yeah wrestling battle

[00:46:06] right and there was a lot of hype uh rumble verse shut down six months rumble verse yep

[00:46:14] and in the EA dodgeball battle royale was um oh that was kind of fun wasn't it

[00:46:21] it was kind of fun yeah yeah totally was uh knockout city knockout city that was kind of

[00:46:26] too it only lasted two years shutting shut down two years I think of this day and age so it's

[00:46:31] pretty good right well it was probably like hanging on by a shoestring and in avengers obviously

[00:46:36] like huge marvel ip on at the you know around the time was like the biggest ip in the world

[00:46:42] avengers did that do an emomo though this real dude it looks really good right looks super good okay yeah

[00:46:53] sorry I'm off try hey the point is all these failures and then you have this game that completely

[00:46:58] marketed itself as like hey this is a multiplayer live service title from PlayStation massive mega hit

[00:47:08] right and so it never really was about the live service it's just a moment in a game that's fun

[00:47:15] yeah it's a streamlined experience too right I mean hell divers dude I'm blanking it's like a $40

[00:47:22] price tag is that right so it's a $40 price tag so from the get go right this isn't free to play um

[00:47:31] and the assumption of course is that because there's a price tag that you're not going to

[00:47:36] just spend a ton of money on micro transactions which is extremely true of this game right you don't

[00:47:42] micro transactions are in there but they it feels like micro transactions from four or five years

[00:47:48] ago where they're pretty un-uninvasive you know it's they're easy to do and you can actually earn a

[00:47:54] ton of the in game currency which is the fifth currency I think yeah the premium currency you can

[00:48:03] actually earn that like a lot of it actually in game yeah so that's what the thing is says

[00:48:09] that's what it is right it's a really streamlined experience it's not an MMO it's not trying to be

[00:48:15] combat farming sim crafting base building survival all the genres roll into one to completely

[00:48:22] absorb and dedicate your entire life to and I just think that's why it probably works as a

[00:48:28] live service game because one you don't have to feel like you keep up the grind it's hop in hop out

[00:48:34] right two with the price tag you have access to the entire game right you it's up to you to just

[00:48:41] continue to play it to get into the further parts of the game and three it's fun as heck like it

[00:48:45] is it's a ton of fun it's super well designed of course they had tons of server issues when the

[00:48:50] game launched just because it was a good game in word-of-mouth you know people were like hey you

[00:48:56] guys got to play this game and so as is pretty typical for live service games it took him a while

[00:49:01] to sort of get their ducks in a row but when they did when things were fixed and ready it's been

[00:49:07] smooth sailing from here on out and I just it just makes me wonder in this greater conversation

[00:49:13] of live service games like and most of them I feel like have this free to play model does it

[00:49:21] just make more sense to have an extremely streamlined experience and make that your live service

[00:49:27] game like really distil like what is the essence of your game distill it and cut the fat and say

[00:49:33] this is our game this is the core this is what's really good let's just do this yeah I mean again

[00:49:41] I we're armchair devs obviously so this is saying with a ginormous grain of salt yes but it does

[00:49:47] seem like the games that do succeed at this that have succeeded at live service and hell divers

[00:49:56] too isn't anomaly because everyone was saying a couple months ago it's like the markets too crowded

[00:50:01] like you can't get people to give up their fortnight's in their out there and I think that's

[00:50:05] still actually true I think you still can't actually get people to give up their fortnight's but

[00:50:10] for people who are still on the fence which there are some you can get people to move around

[00:50:15] and hell divers is proving that I think it's a Tuesday it was 300,000 concurrence on steam alone right

[00:50:21] so now who knows of that I'll continue very long but that's okay it doesn't have to be a 300,000

[00:50:27] like it could survive really well with around like 25 to 30,000 for a long time and then have

[00:50:33] these big uptakes with new content that comes out and they've already been successful enough that now

[00:50:37] they can do that for a long time so I think so back to my point is like the the games that have

[00:50:49] succeeded is they figured out like they've found the fun and then they've taken like a sort of

[00:50:58] simple ish component of that fun and like you said Jake distilled it down and started small right

[00:51:04] like hook people in to the super fun element keep things scope down enough right there's no narrative

[00:51:10] campaign here there's no cinematic visuals there's no while the game looks really good like

[00:51:15] there's no voice acting they're very minimal voice acting like they've toned down a lot of these

[00:51:22] other elements to just focus on the specific part of the game that's the fun hook in part

[00:51:29] and then they've started with that and then as they become successful like they added stuff to it

[00:51:33] and I can absolutely see hell divers adding a huge amount of content over the next couple years

[00:51:38] right as they ramp up because they've earned the right to do that whereas something like

[00:51:44] suicide squad just using as example and obviously I don't know what happened inside that studio

[00:51:48] nobody really knows but I think it was the opposite case where it's like hey let's try and make

[00:51:52] the any and all everything game with incredible visuals incredible cinematics an amazing story

[00:52:01] awesome gunplay and classes and live service style activities and raids and like all this

[00:52:07] and they tried to throw it all in and none of it was very fun or very good because you just can't do

[00:52:11] everything to 100% you just can't it's impossible yeah I think we're definitely past those days right

[00:52:20] where you could try to throw every single idea into a single video game and have that just be

[00:52:27] retain all the players and the players dump all of their money into it that's just not

[00:52:32] a realistic expectation for a live service game but like you said with hell divers too because

[00:52:38] they've really honed their craft and they've come up with this distilled package it allows them to

[00:52:44] innovate and be creative within that space and a lot of times creativity actually doesn't suffer

[00:52:50] but blossoms when there are specific limitations in place yeah restrictions breed tons of creativity

[00:52:57] yeah so I feel like with hell divers too it's like okay what kind of new planets could they come up with

[00:53:02] what kind of new enemy types could there be what kind of new objectives could be on a specific planet

[00:53:07] right and so the gameplay itself probably isn't gonna vary the gameplay loop especially won't vary

[00:53:13] all that much but the different things that you're doing moment to moment within hell divers too

[00:53:18] there I mean the sky's the limit I really feel like in terms of the different ways that you can create

[00:53:23] different um sorry my brain just went into Spanish but um you could create different ways for

[00:53:30] the player to engage with what is happening in the game you know what I mean uh

[00:53:36] semi-foto I'm sorry my brain's getting tired but um so yeah I just think that this is such an

[00:53:43] awesome beacon of hope when it comes to live service and that it's just do some maybe do one

[00:53:51] thing extremely well and that's enough to be financially viable yeah and I think this is

[00:54:00] positive in a number of ways like okay if the industry is really well not the industry I

[00:54:06] shouldn't say the industry as a whole but you know pretty pretty much uh Warner Brothers

[00:54:13] being Warner Brothers being the Stark example it's like Warner Brothers okay if your strategy really

[00:54:17] is and we talked about this on the last episode if you're seriously gonna throw out your

[00:54:24] triple A plans even after you release the highest selling triple A single player narrative experience

[00:54:32] of the year then you'd need to look at like you need to stop looking at destiny and you need

[00:54:40] to stop looking at uh sorry I can't I know you're allowed to say destiny scratch that from the record

[00:54:46] I didn't hear you just stop looking at you need to stop looking at apex and stop looking at fortnight

[00:54:53] and stop looking at these other like mainstays because the only way they are going to break through

[00:54:57] this market is to do your own thing that's super fun that does it like you said Jake this very

[00:55:03] specific thing that way players can easily find the fun and that hooks them in and let creative

[00:55:10] teams like build something around that concept instead of saying like hey let's make let's make a

[00:55:17] DC superhero game but have like live events and open world activities and gear in it right

[00:55:24] instead of having the checklist and again once again I'm not saying that that's what they did

[00:55:29] but the end product is evidence that that sounds pretty much what they did because they had a big

[00:55:34] checklist of all this stuff that needed to be in the game and then they tried to like craft against

[00:55:40] that checklist instead of like having a vision of an experience that they wanted to have

[00:55:45] and building around that vision which it looks like hell divers was able to accomplish

[00:55:50] yeah hell hell divers has really strong legs it's gonna go a long ways and like you said

[00:55:55] a game like hell divers right there's a lot of conversation about what healthy average player

[00:56:01] population is and I think a lot of it is most people it's like people like us armchair devs who

[00:56:07] are speaking other butts although you do data analytics so you would be able to speak to this

[00:56:11] actually with some authority and expertise but I think the idea like you said like hell divers

[00:56:16] two even if has a player base of 20 to 30 thousand people the game is still fun and they're still

[00:56:21] playing it and they're still keeping that game going and then it gets content spikes right like

[00:56:26] I just feel like because hell divers two does allow for a lot of different people to engage with

[00:56:33] it allows for a big place variety of play styles that it is so much easier to maintain

[00:56:41] a healthy player base right unlike games that like MMOs for example new world right new world is

[00:56:47] a game that I played I played with some friends and I actually like new world but if I wanted to

[00:56:52] get ahead and keep making progress in new world I was gonna have to start playing it part time you

[00:56:57] know like I was gonna have to put more and more hours into it and quite frankly I'm not that

[00:57:03] demographic anymore I'm not the person that can put that many hours into a single game to try to

[00:57:09] stay on top of it and feel like I'm still having fun um and I just I just question like that

[00:57:15] demographic that's willing to devote their entire cells and their wallets to a single game right

[00:57:21] that demographic isn't switching games easily because they've already invested so much time

[00:57:26] in money into whatever their game of choice is right and so trying to get them to move feels kind

[00:57:31] of dumb but trying to get them to move maybe one day out of the week like maybe if I'm a die hard

[00:57:38] black desert player and I'm like oh but the buds we're playing held divers two and Friday yeah

[00:57:42] I can do that you know because I could get back into that game and I can get out of it easily I

[00:57:49] I don't know for me the player demographic that I represent I think something like held

[00:57:53] divers makes perfect sense Jake if you like we need to have a retrospective episode on Star Wars

[00:58:01] galaxies because you just reminded me of my like retrospective I posted on the discord

[00:58:08] of an article somebody posted on the creator of Star Wars galaxies is making is working on a new

[00:58:13] MMO and I was talking about how like I played that game in like 2003 or whenever it came out and I

[00:58:21] was like 13 years old and did that Star Wars galaxies it was like second-life Star Wars

[00:58:27] crazy game crazy game I never played that I think in 2003 was runescape around then

[00:58:34] yeah it was a PC only it was that area right every quest Star Wars galaxies world of warcraft

[00:58:46] I played a lot of Star Wars galaxies just had this incredible community because you could

[00:58:51] literally like you could pick a profession of this is a tangent real quick I'll circle back around

[00:58:58] you could pick a profession as like a canteen a performer what so you would literally like

[00:59:06] pick your instrument and it would be like a weird Star Wars instrument and then you would go in the

[00:59:10] canteen and then you would perform and the more people you could get to watch your performance like

[00:59:17] the higher experience that you would get and as you level up you got like access to like better

[00:59:23] perform like songs and dance moves and like different things that like enhanced your performance

[00:59:29] I can do this amount of like immersion I don't think I've ever been more like that game was

[00:59:34] like living in the so and becoming a Jedi was super super rare and so there's this entire community

[00:59:40] around like okay how do you become a Jedi well somebody heard that there's like a Jedi hologram

[00:59:45] on this planet and if you walk for an hour and 20 minutes north by northeast there's a cave

[00:59:52] and they think that like there's a taunt on in there and if you get on that and it was like it was

[00:59:58] crazy anyway circling back just you know find the fun and have a creative vision it's easier said

[01:00:06] said than done right I think if there was an algorithm which there's not there is no algorithm

[01:00:11] for making a great video game but if there was an algorithm I think the best I could think of is

[01:00:18] super fun addicting mechanic and amazingly strong content pipeline

[01:00:25] and that's how you can do live service I think that's the only way you can do it.

[01:00:28] Boom higher camera boom do it that easy guys that easy.

[01:00:33] That easy folks just just it's funny though because the example that came to mind when you said

[01:00:38] that was like vampire survivors right vampire survivors is that and they they have like

[01:00:46] one dollar DLCs that they've released since then but yeah I'm with you I mean in so much doom

[01:00:53] and gloom that is happening right now in video games it is so nice to see a ray of sunshine which

[01:01:00] is hell diverse too. A game that's come out and it's just doing incredibly well it is I think a

[01:01:07] beacon of hope for live service it represents what live service I think can be should be and should

[01:01:13] involve into and in the wake of hell divers too a bunch of rumors and I don't I can't remember how

[01:01:22] substantiated they are I can't remember so please fact check me on this if you're listening

[01:01:26] if a dev from 343 industries came out and said that they pitched something like this

[01:01:31] for halo but it was not greenlit and it just makes me think man these types of highly produced

[01:01:42] you know manicured gaming experiences we need more of them probably in the AAA space

[01:01:50] in order for AAA to just not one spend so much money on their games

[01:01:56] and to just to be able to keep certain IPs and franchises going strong so that's all I have

[01:02:01] to say about that I think hell divers too is done a lot of good for impact on the industry and I'm

[01:02:06] just hoping that we see more games sort of follow that trend it doesn't have to be the same sort of

[01:02:12] you know pve extraction objective based multiplayer game but just a highly refined package where

[01:02:19] there's enough restriction for infinite creativity give us more that

[01:02:26] give us more of that well ladies and gentlemen this has been another episode of the

[01:02:29] PrietoBenz podcast talking hell divers to its out on PlayStation steam go check it out

[01:02:37] jump at the discord there's a looking for group channel in there if you want to play some hell

[01:02:40] divers with us drop us a line let us know we can go fight democracy or spread democracy

[01:02:47] with you or fight against democracy treason treason team kill fall saw twitter app

[01:02:57] twitter cast I note speaking of analytics 50% of you listen to the show and don't follow or subscribe

[01:03:04] to it oh hit that subscribe button and then that's our new episodes are just going to automatically

[01:03:11] pop into your podcast service if that's what you want but please but please but you're already

[01:03:17] listening to it anyways you might as well just hit the button that's going to help more people find

[01:03:21] the show reviews help more people find the show so leave us one you can also help us out support us

[01:03:27] on patreon.com slash peer to cast you get early access to our regular episodes you get jakes

[01:03:31] in the impressions you get all the extra goodies that we're doing on there for five bucks a month

[01:03:36] or you can leave us a tip at the one dollar tier just one buck a month if you want to support the

[01:03:40] show and see us get bigger do more stuff get a bigger audience thank you so much for listening

[01:03:47] have a great night