The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King | Middle-earth’s Hidden Gem
A game based on a movie? On a handheld??
Today we assemble a list of the best 2d platformers and pick the four absolute pillars of the genre. Super Mario to Sonic, Celest to Super Meat Boy; a calm and rational podcast episode we can all agree on right?
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00:00 --> 00:14 All right, guys, this may be the four pillars or platforms, but let's not forget the five rules of platforming. Dodging, diving, ducking, dipping, and dodging. Today on.
00:35 --> 00:37 Don'T dodge over the intro.
00:37 --> 00:43 Don't sue us. Dodgeball, please. Just a bunch of Average Joe's patches of Houlahan.
00:44 --> 00:47 No. To listen to the podcast. Ben Stiller, you know, he listens every week.
00:48 --> 00:49 And Lance Armstrong.
00:50 --> 01:42 Wow. Welcome, everybody, to another episode of Press me to cancel your favorite gaming adjacent podcast. This week we are talking about. What do we talk about? 2D platforming games. We're going to do another episode on the four pillars of a genre. These are not necessarily the best games of the genre, but the most impactful. The legacy. The ones where when aliens come to take over our planet with the space whales tomorrow, then they say, what the hell is a platforming game? We have four games for them. That's what we're doing. So we're going to toss out a few 2D platformers, our favorites and impactful ones, give them their flowers, and then we're going to try and pick just four 2D platformers. I'm sure we're all going to get along. There'll be no shouting. I'm sure nobody will get angry, especially after this week. And I'm sure we all have the same hot takes. How do we begin with this?
01:42 --> 01:44 Dark Souls is a platformer, right?
01:44 --> 01:48 I already need more apple juice for this conversation.
01:48 --> 02:02 Well, this is why we're sticking to 2D platformers. Because when we say platformers, there's like, all kinds of 3D ones, and we're going to save those for another episode. And in which case, Dark Souls would be a funny one to try and squeeze in there, because there is technically jumping.
02:02 --> 02:14 I think we're going to really argue ground rules for, like, 90% of this episode, because, like, what. What in Metroidvania, etc. Etc. Right. I mean.
02:14 --> 02:43 Right. I mean, a lot of the older stuff is the basis of platforming that then evolved into Metroidvanias or. Yeah, whatever. Like, so we would argue that, and we don't always agree that maybe, you know, we would say Metroid would be a platformer in its original state, probably. But did it not turn into a genre of totally. Something totally different. Does that now take it out of the platforming window?
02:43 --> 02:45 Because we're arguing over Jake's intro.
02:47 --> 02:48 It's okay.
02:48 --> 02:51 That's how we were getting started. I'm starting.
02:51 --> 03:25 Okay, so here's. Here's the thing. So last time we did an episode on this. We. We explicitly said Metroid wouldn't count for a platformer or something similar because it's. Metroidvania is such a huge genre on its own. So that's why we were taking it from that. So we don't. We consider that a Metroidvania, but I think there is overlap. And you know what? I'm going to call it my first one as I try and fix a window really badly live, which is not working. I'm just so done. The Messenger. That is the one I'm going to propose we start with. And I know we had mentioned the messenger has Metroidvania elements to it.
03:26 --> 03:29 Damn. Jake comes out swinging.
03:29 --> 03:29 Yeah.
03:29 --> 03:47 I would argue the messenger, at its core it's a solid, tight, awesome, fun platforming game first and foremost. The Metroidvania I would argue doesn't even. Is not even why the game is good. I think that's a secondary part of the game. So my, my, my vote first is, is the messenger as, as a platforming game.
03:47 --> 04:09 I would like to agree with your sentiment on that. It is vaguely Metroidvania, but I don't think it's Metroidvania enough. It's pretty linear in how you explore and do things. Whereas most Metroidvanias really let you kind of wander. As soon as you find a new ability, you can go to all the places that you can go. The messenger doesn't really do that.
04:10 --> 04:10 No.
04:10 --> 04:24 Instead it's you get a new ability and now you can continue on further. And it's not so much a new ability as it's a new platforming mechanic. Most of the time that changes up how much you have to react to things.
04:25 --> 04:48 Right. And most top notch. Right. Most of the traversal in the messenger is strategically placed platforms that you have to navigate. Right. That's the challenge when I play the Messenger. It's not the enemies, it's getting around the map, which to me is the sole root of a platformer.
04:49 --> 05:09 You have things you can bounce off. You have things you can hook to. You have things. I mean you are literally going from platform to platform. Like I think that I'm going to agree as well. Now, I don't know if this is a four pillar level, but the messenger is a fantastic platformer for sure.
05:10 --> 05:33 We could figure out the four later, but I think it's one of the strongest platformers I've played in a very long time. I know we've done. We've talked about this game in multiple episodes. I know Wolf, you and I Especially talked about it for an hour. We love this game. I. I do think it's just from a pure gameplay perspective. I think it's one of my favorite platformers. So not exactly retro, but definitely a solid platforming game. So I'm gonna. That's my very first go.
05:33 --> 05:33 I mean.
05:34 --> 05:35 Oh, for sure. Yeah.
05:35 --> 05:38 Right. So I feel like it hangs out on there, but.
05:38 --> 05:38 But. But what?
05:38 --> 05:48 Did we argue that kind of the main thing that inspires that a little bit. Ninja. Ninja Gaiden might have something to do.
05:48 --> 05:53 With some platforming in there. It's a little Ninja Gaiden ish. Without awful wall grabs.
05:53 --> 06:01 Well, that's part of the platforming, right? Accidental wall grab is part of platforming. You just can't crawl up and until.
06:01 --> 06:06 Two or three and all an awful part of it, but sure, yeah, it's there.
06:07 --> 06:24 Ninja Gaiden is one of those ones where I've always wanted to beat it, and I. I get stuck on, I think, six four all the damn time. I can't. I can't get past 6, 4. It is definitely a platforming game, though. And I would argue it controls really well and the music is pretty decent and it's solid. So I. I'm fine adding to the. The list here of games.
06:25 --> 06:35 Well, do we want to go. Do we want to go around like we normally do, or do we just want to call them out as we go? Because there's a ton in this, so it might be worth just calling it out as we go.
06:35 --> 06:36 Okay.
06:36 --> 06:48 We can. We can give them their flowers or just kind of briefly mention a name, and then we don't spend 500 years talking about Mario 3 that we've discussed 800 times. The better Super Mario World.
06:48 --> 06:55 Of course, if we want to call out that Ninja Gaiden has awful wall grabs. Good, we're done. Move, move along.
06:56 --> 06:59 Try and keep this within our hour to an hour and a half time.
06:59 --> 07:09 Okay. Well, I was gonna say Super Mar. Or the original Mario Bros. Do you.
07:09 --> 07:16 Think that the original. Okay, I'm with you on Super Mario Brothers, hands down. For sure. We need that there. Do you think the original is a good game, though?
07:18 --> 07:21 I mean, does it have to be a good to be a platformer, though?
07:21 --> 07:27 Okay, so you're right. Yeah. Not a good game. But is it. Is it impactful enough to the genre? The original Mary Brothers?
07:28 --> 07:31 I have the advantage of being old.
07:31 --> 07:35 As hell, so everybody has a superpower.
07:35 --> 08:06 My ankles are an advantage, people. They're an advantage. I remember going into, you know, pizza parlor arcades and Seeing the original Super Mario or, sorry, the original Mario brothers. And in 1980, we'll call it 1980, whatever year it was, it was a spectacular game. Now has it aged well? I don't know.
08:07 --> 09:06 So my thing is, I've also been to Chuck E. Cheese. Thank you very much. I've also played the original Mario Brothers in a Chuck E. Cheese when I was. I was a kid. So I guess I'm old as shit too. My ankles. My ankles are just doing just fine. I would say that playing the original Donkey Kong alongside Mario Brothers, I would take Donkey Kong over Mario Brothers. That said, I don't think Donkey Kong. I don't think that hangs in this list. I would like to see one of the old school platforming games, make it as one of the four. But I don't know if I would think. I don't think 81, 82 there is going to work personally. So I don't know. I just think of Mary Brothers. The platforming sucks, dude. Every time I played, even, even now when I play it and just came from the top of the bottom of the level jumping from the girders and you miss the hitbox of the character. Mario's fat ass does not hit the girder. And by the time you get the top, the crabs are already down in the bottom of the screen. And then you got to wait for them to come back around.
09:07 --> 09:11 We're not saying Ice Climbers is a great game either, right?
09:11 --> 09:13 I wasn't going to mention that one.
09:13 --> 09:20 If we're talking, if we're talking awful hitboxes, you have to mention Ice Climbers.
09:20 --> 09:22 I mean, right, the four pillars of shitty platformers.
09:22 --> 09:26 Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. We'll do that episode later, folks.
09:26 --> 09:28 Four pillars of the worst ice levels ever.
09:28 --> 09:40 No, I'm with you. But remember that Mario Brothers, more than Super Mario Brothers was a quarter sucker. And it was designed to be a quarter sucker.
09:40 --> 09:46 Yes, but I mean, that's the argument for most arcades, right? They're designed to steal your money. They're not.
09:46 --> 09:56 Absolutely. My, my, my namesake Sinistar is an awful game, but I love the, I love the, I love the, the V. The vogue. Voiceover.
09:56 --> 09:59 Yeah, yeah. The only good thing about it, I.
09:59 --> 10:31 Would say you had mentioned Super Mario Brothers, which I think is a fantastic platforming game. I think that, I think for me personally, I think that should be one of the four. We can figure that out later if only because. Yes, it's. Does it hold up today, gameplay wise? I think it still does. Graphic wise, obviously doesn't But I think the controls in the original Super Mario Brothers are really tight, really fast pace. I love the physics on the jumping. I love how you can run through a level and speed through it. And you really have to finesse that jump button to get through a stage as fast as you can. I love that it feels good to play even today.
10:32 --> 10:59 Super Mario Brothers. The original Super Mario Brothers was a game changer for platformers. We went from single screen G, you know, platformers to the scrolling platformer that had this logical progression to teach you as you played as you said. The jumping mechanic was great. All of the power ups are fantastic. 82.
11:02 --> 11:05 Could beat on my lunch break. It's fine, it's fine.
11:06 --> 11:07 Why you got to hurt me like that?
11:07 --> 11:12 I got a 30 minute lunch. I got an hour lunch. But, you know, it's easy, just.
11:12 --> 11:13 No, I agree.
11:13 --> 11:13 Okay.
11:14 --> 11:28 Super Mario Brothers is a much better game and I know we're arguing pillars already, but it is a much better edition of Mario Brothers as a pillar than, than Mario Brothers.
11:30 --> 11:32 I would agree with that completely.
11:33 --> 11:33 Yeah.
11:34 --> 11:58 I think as a platformer, Mario Brothers doesn't quite cut it because it's also somewhat of a. It's, it's a lot like the single screen games of the past, like Popeye and stuff like that. And it's just, it's not platforming focused the way Super Mario Brothers is. And then it's also somewhat versus if you got two players.
11:58 --> 11:58 Yeah.
11:58 --> 12:00 So, yeah, right.
12:00 --> 12:27 It is, it is akin. And I know this is a weird comparison, but, but Mario Brothers is like a platforming version of Tapper. Like it is all about getting to the right spot and popping the crab. It is, you know, it's like getting to the right spot and capturing the, the return to, you know, beer glass. Right. I mean, it's Tapper.
12:28 --> 12:51 Well, I mean, what about let's go, let's go Wayback Machine and we can talk maybe like Pitfall. I mean, how do we feel about that? That's had numerous recreations of the game too. And isn't Pitfall considered to be kind of a platforming type thing? The whole point is to get past hazardous locations on with a whip, especially.
12:51 --> 12:55 When it comes to alligators. That is some sheer platforming right there.
12:56 --> 13:15 I mean, we're talking Atari 2600 here. I mean, yeah, jumping over like, you know, jumping over the pits and the, and the holes and, and all that from Activision. This is, this is, is this not like the grandmother of platforming in certain aspects? And I'm sure there's things that are older than that. Jump man being one another one.
13:15 --> 13:30 But yeah, Jump man was before this one. Right. For sure. Yeah. People love Pitfall. Pitfall was definitely an iconic game for its time. It's still, I think people consider one of the best on the Atari for sure. Was it. Was it an arcade game too? Or was it just home console?
13:30 --> 13:32 I. I never saw it in the arcade.
13:32 --> 13:41 I can't say that I know. All I know is that it's been recreated for like the PlayStation and I believe Genesis and Super Nintendo.
13:41 --> 13:59 Yeah, there was. There was like a reboot of it, I guess. Yeah. Pitfall the Mind Adventure. I rented that for the Genesis back in the day. Actually. A really solid platformer. It's actually pretty good. I remember enjoying that one. Is there enough platforms in Pitfall if we're going to disqualify it or is it. Does it work?
14:00 --> 14:04 I mean, are you. You're jumping, traversing. I mean, so.
14:04 --> 14:16 So, I mean, Moby Games says gameplay platform, and there was. Does not appear to be an arcade release of it.
14:16 --> 14:18 Okay. Yeah.
14:19 --> 14:40 Your pl. You're traversing and jumping. Does that not. I mean, there's not per se. Your platform is the solid ground that you start on that turns either opens up underneath you or, you know, whatever. So you're not traversing from Mario Brothers type platform to platform, but you're still platforming. So.
14:40 --> 14:45 Yeah, there's. There's pits to fall in. Yeah, you have to jump over.
14:47 --> 14:48 Plus there's.
14:48 --> 14:50 What is the platform without its pits?
14:50 --> 14:55 There's that absolutely wonderful log sound when the logs interact with you.
14:55 --> 14:58 Right. So, yeah, I don't know.
14:58 --> 15:39 It's hard for me because there's a lot of games that included like the. The basic jumping mechanics. Right. Like Keystone Capers is one of my favorite 2600 games. I don't know if it qualifies as a platformer because more of just like a plane you go across in a mall and there's just three tiers, but there's no risk of falling off a platform. Or like when I look at something like Circus Charlie, which I think at its heart and in the spirit is probably a platforming game, even though it's not really platforms. Don't shake your head at me. It's a platformer guy just rubbing. Just because you're riding the back of an angry lion or riding a speeding horse, jumping on trampolines. What more says platform than a trampoline that you have to traverse over a horseback.
15:39 --> 15:46 I'm getting. I'm gonna give Jake this one. Circus Charlie is a platformer.
15:46 --> 15:59 I mean, I would assume yes to that, because you are. If it. If we're gonna count pitfall, then we technically would have to count that, right? Because it's doing pretty much the same thing. It's just doing it on a tightrope on the back of the Lion.
16:01 --> 16:07 We're just gonna put it up here under the four pillars. We don't have to keep it there, but I'm just gonna put up there for a little while and just see.
16:07 --> 16:08 Placeholder. Huh?
16:10 --> 16:15 Warm up there in that pillar. That's. That's all I'm going to do. We're just going to leave there. Let's see what it looks like up there for a while. That's all.
16:15 --> 16:21 You land on platforms. You land on platforms in joust. You land on platforms in joust.
16:21 --> 16:27 Let's see what this looks like. Just to see if we can marinate on it. Existing there for a while. Get used to it.
16:27 --> 16:54 Season it. Season it. Look, honestly, you know how hard it is for me not to say balloon fight as well. I love balloon fight, and I also think that's a platformer, but I feel like instead of jumping, it's flying. And even though there's a lot of control in the flight, which I feel is a part of platforming, I feel like you spend too much time in the air, not enough on the platform, so. I did not say balloon fight. I restrained myself. I'm trying to keep to the spirit of the episode. Yeah. Circus Charlie deserves to be.
16:54 --> 17:05 To be there, and I kind of. I want to cater on what Wolf said earlier. That's more of a versus kind of thing. Right? Like, yeah. And the adventure mode has no balloons. Right. You're. You're fighting.
17:05 --> 17:09 This is true. Yeah. The balloon trip has no platforms whatsoever.
17:09 --> 17:13 Right. You're not traversing anything. You're just flying around the city.
17:14 --> 17:18 Sorry. I'm gonna. I'm gonna move us along because we've got a lot to cover.
17:19 --> 17:25 All right. I'm gonna throw out one Ghouls and ghosts.
17:25 --> 17:34 Yes, absolutely. Absolutely. Are we talking this all ilk the Genesis version?
17:34 --> 17:50 Right, Or I personally hate the Genesis version, but that's because I'm so used to the Super Nintendo version. They look so similar, but it plays like the NES game, and so my brain doesn't. You're crossing the streams. It's not cool.
17:51 --> 17:57 Can we agree that ghouls and ghosts can also be represented by ghosts and goblins?
17:57 --> 18:00 Yes. Well, yeah, I kind of feel like that.
18:00 --> 18:06 I mean, the whole franchise is very much like, okay, trying to find Sega games to put in there.
18:09 --> 18:13 My experience with. My experience was actually in their arcade with these games.
18:13 --> 18:17 Yeah, this and this one is the arcade version just on the Genesis.
18:17 --> 18:21 Yeah, the Genesis port was very faithful to the arcade version. Yep, yep, yep, yep.
18:21 --> 18:31 Yeah, no, absolutely. A platformer and an excruciatingly painful platformer can be.
18:31 --> 18:35 Yeah, so painful you have to do it twice. Right, yeah.
18:35 --> 18:37 And with the worst weapon in the game.
18:38 --> 18:39 Yeah.
18:39 --> 19:30 So to me, there's only so much that's affected by RNG in these games. Most of it is very much camera placement and the players choices. Yeah, that's like 99% of things that can go wrong is on the player. Right. You just. You have to learn where things happen, what happens, like where. How far you can go before you're causing problems for yourself, things like that. Whereas, you know, you take other games and I'm shitting on battletoads a little bit here. Battletoads relies so heavily on the rng you cannot read that shit. Whereas Super Ghouls and Ghosts, you know, up front it appears to be just an onslaught of chaos, but it's not. It's controlled chaos.
19:30 --> 19:33 Right, Yeah, I could see.
19:33 --> 19:33 Okay.
19:34 --> 19:42 And. But Battletoads, again, mostly a beat em up mostly. Yeah. It has platforming elements of course, but. Right, right, right, right.
19:42 --> 19:55 People love battletoads and I think I can't get into it because of the rng. People hate Super Ghouls and Ghosts. I think it's amazing because it lacks the rng. Everything is in the player's control.
19:55 --> 19:57 Right, Yep, that's true.
19:57 --> 20:09 Okay. All right, super goals and goes. What else we got? Mario Brothers 3 Super Mario Bros. World, I think. I mean, I think you can put it on there. We don't need to spend a lot of time talking about it. Those are legendary.
20:09 --> 20:16 I think we pick a Mario because honestly, Mario could take all four pillars if we really wanted it to. Right.
20:16 --> 20:53 Yeah, there's. Okay, there's one. I just thought about that. I think we have to at least mention Mario Maker for the Wii U and how impactful that was because that was the sequel. Nowhere near as important as the original on the Wii U. The ability to make levels, share them with people officially. Right. This is not some hacked level editor that we've seen before in ROM hacks. This is official level maker for Mario. It was huge. People were playing this for like the solid years of the Wii U's lifespan. I mean, I think it was one of the killer apps for the Wii U. It actually made Sense to have the tablet with the stylus because of Maromaker.
20:53 --> 20:53 Yeah.
20:53 --> 20:55 I think this is my pick.
20:55 --> 20:57 Let's throw it on the list for sure.
20:58 --> 21:02 Anything. Kieso. Kaizo. However, the. How you pronounce that.
21:02 --> 21:03 Kaizo.
21:04 --> 21:06 Kaizo. Well, you can make Kaiser levels. Yeah.
21:07 --> 21:17 Do we want the most punishing platformers ever? The Pillars of Punishing Platformers. See, there's an alliteration. Pillars of Punishing Platformers.
21:17 --> 21:19 That's like our five Ds.
21:19 --> 21:20 Yeah.
21:21 --> 21:44 I'm. I'm gonna throw it out there because we kind of talked about this. I think Mega Man 2 is an absolute platformer. I know there's a little Run and Gun, but I will tell you right now, Flash Man Stage alone. Not Flash Man. Sorry. Quick Man Stage alone is enough of a stage to make that a platformer that could even be on a pillar, if you ask me. That game.
21:44 --> 21:45 Yeah. I mean, it's.
21:46 --> 21:49 Yeah. I've lost more platforming than bosses.
21:51 --> 21:57 Yeah. Bubble man. Like it. It's. It's a difficult game with heavy platform. Heat Man. Right?
21:57 --> 21:58 Yeah.
21:58 --> 22:05 That's the one where you'd like. There's a whole segment where you have to time with the platforms, otherwise you just fall into a pit of death.
22:05 --> 22:05 Yeah.
22:06 --> 22:06 Yep.
22:06 --> 22:10 And then there's. There's even a boss. You're being chased across platforms.
22:11 --> 22:12 Right. The dragon.
22:12 --> 22:13 The dragon.
22:13 --> 22:15 And then the power ups where you actually spawn platforms even.
22:15 --> 22:16 Right.
22:16 --> 22:26 To get through some areas. So I like, I thought about Mega Man. I'm like, I wasn't sure because it's run a gun. But then the more I think about it. No. A lot of the core of that game and this whole franchise is jumping on platformers. Right?
22:26 --> 22:27 Yeah.
22:27 --> 22:27 Right.
22:27 --> 22:43 Like what they call them Yoko Blocks. The ones that disappear. That's a core trope of Mega Man. And out of all the Mega man games on the nes, I think the second one is arguably probably the better one. I mean, I know we talked about this in a prior episode, but I. I think Mega Man 2 is definitely a great one.
22:43 --> 22:53 Out of all of them, I. I just. I throw two up there because of the disappearing blocks and Heat man stage, like, like Wolf said, but also the. The Quick man stage with the lasers that you have to.
22:54 --> 22:54 Yeah.
22:54 --> 23:13 Navigate. You can either use Flashman's power to get past it, or if you practice and get really good at it, you can do it without it. But that is like core platforming all within itself. And I don't even think of Mega Man. Any of the Mega Mans really is a run And Gun, I've always thought them to be more platforming than anything.
23:13 --> 23:23 So the stages, I'll never forget Airman stage, where the summoning the heads come flying in and then you have to jump from the cloud things. Yeah, it's absolutely a platforming game and a really great one, too.
23:23 --> 23:27 I would throw that up in one of the pillars to keep another one of those pillars warm.
23:28 --> 23:38 How do you guys think about Sonic? Do we even think Sonic belongs on this list? And I say this as a guy who likes Genesis and had a Genesis growing up, but I like Sonic 3 a lot.
23:38 --> 23:45 What about Sonic isn't a platformer? Because, honestly, it's a faster version of Mario Brothers.
23:46 --> 23:49 The argument. Go ahead, Wolf. You got you go ahead.
23:50 --> 24:01 The thing about Sonic is it tricks the players, right? It's. It implies that the whole game is about going fast, but most of the time, going fast is what screws you.
24:02 --> 24:03 Yep.
24:03 --> 24:18 Yeah, it's. I'm not saying Sonic is bad, but I think Sonic is very much its own little beast that does not really represent the best of platformers or the most impactful of platformers.
24:18 --> 24:18 Right.
24:18 --> 24:23 That's. I love the Sonic games. Shitload of them.
24:23 --> 24:29 Yeah. But I argue. I argue that they are platformers. They're just.
24:29 --> 24:29 Oh, they.
24:30 --> 24:31 Yeah, Fast.
24:32 --> 25:00 Right. I. I think. I find it difficult to put it in a platforming sense. I mean, you take like, aquatic zone where you're. You're zipping around the corkscrews and you're running across the water. It's almost like. I mean, there's. There's jumping. You have to get to platforms to traverse, but it's. It's just. It's almost too fast for me to be considered in the platforming genre, I guess. I mean, I'm just arguing the same thing that everybody else is saying.
25:00 --> 25:01 It's.
25:01 --> 25:11 It's so fast that it's not really a platformer. But it is, and I know it is. I'm not going to argue that it's not, but it's just quick. Super quick. So, I don't know.
25:11 --> 25:21 I was trying to talk and I muted. I would lean though, that if we were going to put a Sonic game on the list, I think Sonic 2 is where it's at, personally.
25:22 --> 25:29 Yeah. I like three more, but I recognize that most fans of the franchise before the second game.
25:29 --> 25:40 Oh, no, I. I do think three did some great things for the franchise, but I think two, particularly as a platformer, is the better, more and even representative title.
25:41 --> 25:55 And even with some people in the podcast disdain For Tails, that did add another extra element of platforming, with him being able to pick you up and put you places. So there is some platforming in that as well.
25:56 --> 26:13 Just saying November. For those listening later, November said, if Hollow Knight and Super Meat Boy aren't making the list, I'm unfollowing. They will make at least the list toward the pillars. They will make the list toward the pillars. We're not sure if they're pillars.
26:14 --> 26:15 I didn't even think about it.
26:15 --> 26:29 Let's talk about them. So Hollow Knight and I like Hollow Knight a lot. I think it's more of a Metroidvania, and I think it's a strong Metroidvania. So I think when we do a Pillars of Metroidvania, I think that's where we talk about Hollow Knight. Meat Boy, though. Meat Boy is a platformer.
26:29 --> 26:31 Oh, very much so.
26:31 --> 26:32 Absolutely a platformer.
26:32 --> 26:33 Absolutely.
26:33 --> 26:44 And as far as, like a modern retro platformer, it's probably King. It might make a pillar. It might. It might.
26:44 --> 26:48 Is. Is Jump King considered king of platformers?
26:50 --> 26:56 I never played Jump King. I've heard nothing. It's like a strategy playing it.
26:56 --> 27:19 No, it's. It's basically a vertical. A vertical you hate yourself game. It's much like. It's like get over it. You would jump. You jump to each level, but if you missed, you can fall all the way back down to the beginning. And it's hours and hours and levels and levels of jumping straight up.
27:19 --> 27:39 I'm going to talk about getting over it because you said it is a platformer. You're right. But our rules here are aliens come down to this planet and need four platformers to represent what platformers are. I'm sorry, I'm getting over it. They would destroy the Earth.
27:40 --> 27:40 They would.
27:41 --> 28:23 Obviously no signs of intelligent life here if they're playing this garbage. Yeah, I know. You're right. No, I wouldn't want that. But Meat Boy, though, definitely, I think, belongs in this list. I think the best parts of Meat Boy for me is how quick the stages are. I mean, yes, you die a lot and perfect it, but once you have the rundown for a stage, super satisfying in a lot of ways. It reminds me of Mario Brothers. Super Mario Brothers one. Right. Just the. You can go. You can take it slow to figure a route through a stage in Mario, but half the fun for me is speedrunning through Mario Brothers one. And I got that feeling from Meat Boy and just how great that was in the Xbox360. That was one of my favorite games in the Xbox360. And it's certainly not a game that pushed that system to its limits at all. But it just felt really good.
28:23 --> 28:29 Right. Doesn't have to be beautiful to be good. Right. I mean, unless you're clear. Obscura.
28:29 --> 28:57 So I think we need to add Meat Boy to the list. Hollow Knight. I think you're right. I think we do that under the pillars of Metroidvania. I'm gonna throw out one that we've talked about offline but needs to be here. Might be a pillar. Jumpman. I mean, we're talking like, original. Original platformers. Jumpman.
28:59 --> 29:00 For the Commodore 64.
29:01 --> 29:02 And I played it on the Apple, too.
29:05 --> 29:09 So I have never played Jumpman before. I can't say that I have.
29:10 --> 29:41 One of the greatest things about Jump man is is each level has some level, some sort of uniqueness to it. Like, sometimes they're little. These little, like. I don't know if I'd call them bullets or pellets or whatever that move across either, you know, vertically or horizontally. And when they align with you, they kind of like bullet toward you. There are others where it's a little bit of a puzzle aspect there. I mean, they're. Each level is unique. So.
29:41 --> 29:46 And this is like the first platforming game, I think. Isn't. Is. Isn't what the argument was for Jumpman.
29:46 --> 29:48 It's. If not, it's pretty darn close.
29:49 --> 30:06 Yeah. So, I mean, that's one of the reasons why Mario was in Donkey Kong. He was called Jumpman. Right. In Japan. That was one of the reasons why. Because an influence of this game. Yeah. I think this is maybe a pillar, but it's definitely one on the list for sure. When did we talk about this one? Was it Hidden Gems?
30:06 --> 30:07 I think we.
30:07 --> 30:09 Recently. We talked about this one.
30:09 --> 30:10 Yeah. We talked about this not too long ago.
30:10 --> 30:10 Yeah.
30:10 --> 30:12 Or was it the Apple episode? Apple games.
30:12 --> 30:14 I think it was the Apple games episode.
30:14 --> 30:14 Yeah.
30:14 --> 30:18 I think it was that. Because we also talked about your Taxi game.
30:19 --> 30:20 Crazy Taxi. Or not Crazy Taxi.
30:21 --> 30:22 Taxi Space.
30:25 --> 30:37 Yeah. Yeah. Jumpman's a great one. And I think obviously dated nowadays, But I still. I still had my fun playing with it on the mister behind me. Like, I played quite a bit of this. Lousy at it, but it was really cool.
30:37 --> 30:40 I don't think anybody's good at it.
30:40 --> 30:44 No, I don't think you're born being good at that one.
30:44 --> 30:56 Yeah. Like, this is. This is during the era where they were like, arcade games will be fun at home, too. You can press start instead of putting your quarter in.
30:57 --> 30:57 Right.
30:59 --> 30:59 So.
30:59 --> 31:00 Okay.
31:00 --> 31:06 But yeah, I. I'm gonna argue at least as far as first representative Jumpman.
31:07 --> 31:07 Okay.
31:08 --> 31:14 I'd like one of the Disney ones to get on there, either Rescue Ranger or a Darkwing duck or a DuckTales.
31:15 --> 31:15 DuckTales.
31:16 --> 31:21 I feel like DuckTales is probably more into it than the other two, maybe is.
31:21 --> 31:28 Yeah, I. Abs. Gosh, I absolutely love Chippendale. Rescue Rangers.
31:28 --> 31:30 Same. I beat.
31:30 --> 31:35 I think. I think DuckTales is probably the stronger platformer.
31:36 --> 31:37 I would agree. I would agree with that.
31:39 --> 31:44 And it kind of falls in line with Mega Man. I think it's the same engine. Right. It's just.
31:44 --> 31:45 Yeah, it's Capcom. Right.
31:45 --> 31:47 It's heavier on the platforming.
31:47 --> 31:47 Yeah.
31:48 --> 31:54 I know. Darkwing Duck was the same engine as Mega man, or it was the bones of the Mega man engine they expanded on for Darkwing Duck.
31:54 --> 31:55 Yeah.
31:55 --> 32:08 I don't remember if DuckTales was the same engine or not, but I'm with you. Out of all the Disney platformers done by capcom, I think DuckTales is like the most impactful. I like Chippendale too. But I think. I think the uniqueness to the Scrooge McDuck's moveset is pretty awesome.
32:08 --> 32:36 And it's the spring cane kind of adds to that specific. That. That platforming element that the other two don't have because there's no. There's no shooting in. In. In DuckTales. It is. I mean, you can kick the rocks with your cane or whatever, but it is primarily traversing via platforming and getting around that way and then jumping on things to get past them while. Has the. Has the gas gun and Chippendale, you can throw things, you know, in a horizontal way, so.
32:37 --> 32:45 But we can't disqualify some sort of firepower because we have put Super Mario and it has power.
32:46 --> 32:48 So. I mean, Mega man has a mega.
32:48 --> 32:56 I know. I'm just saying, like, we. We can't discount for at least some little aspect of Run and Gun to shorten our list.
32:57 --> 32:59 I'm taking the running goods out of the Disney one.
33:00 --> 33:12 Well, so. Because we talked about this, right? Like Contra. Contra is technically a platforming game, but I figure it's more of a. The gameplay is more shooting focus. It's more of a Run and Gun. But there's a ton of platforms in Condra. But I don't recommend this list.
33:12 --> 33:17 I'm not going to throw out Rolling Thunder, even though. Because it's a Run and gun. Right.
33:17 --> 33:18 Right.
33:19 --> 33:26 Now, would games like Marble Madness be considered kind of a platforming, just in a different isometrical look.
33:27 --> 33:30 3D.Ish. And we're talking 2D right now.
33:30 --> 33:31 Does that count as a. Gosh.
33:32 --> 33:34 Is that for the 3D platformer episode? That would be funny.
33:35 --> 33:36 That would be interesting.
33:36 --> 33:40 Are we talking, like. Because that's isometric, right? We're talking, like snake, lateral roll.
33:40 --> 33:47 And. Yeah, you literally can go. You can go any direction and the map shifts any direction.
33:47 --> 33:48 Right, Right.
33:48 --> 33:59 Can I make an argument against Marble Madness? Regardless, there are very few points in that game where you actually jump over pits and don't die.
34:00 --> 34:00 That's true.
34:00 --> 34:10 Because most of the time you either fall too far and shatter or you fall to your death because you're not supposed to go over the pits most of the time.
34:10 --> 34:16 Okay. All right. See, that's. And that's why I wanted to ask those. I wanted to ask that I'm gonna.
34:16 --> 34:18 Argue is more of a puzzler.
34:18 --> 34:21 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
34:21 --> 34:22 An active puzzler.
34:22 --> 34:24 Yeah, an active puzzler.
34:24 --> 34:26 A puzzle platformer.
34:26 --> 34:27 It's my nickname in high school.
34:29 --> 34:33 That's another one. Okay, so did somebody add ducktales to the list?
34:33 --> 34:34 I will.
34:34 --> 34:35 No. Oh, we can.
34:36 --> 35:03 That definitely fits. I'm just looking at Blue Sky. I did. I did do a community outreach for Blue sky and on Discord. So we had a few people. Actually, Dale, I can't talk today. Dave from Tales in the backlog, as well as Dave for member 64. So two Daves and Stormageddon from his podcast as well, all recommended Celeste. I've. I. My great shame is I've not played Celeste for more than five minutes, but what I played of. It seems great. And it's a platformer.
35:04 --> 35:13 Celeste is top tier platforming. It really is. And it's okay. It has so much content.
35:14 --> 35:15 Yeah.
35:15 --> 35:22 Like an absurd amount to the point where I actually fell off trying to do everything.
35:23 --> 35:23 Wow.
35:24 --> 35:42 Because you beat it and then you unlock another tier of stuff, and then you beat that, and then there's another tier of stuff, and it. There's just so many unlockings. There's like F versions of stages. Right. A through F. Right. Last time I fired it up, it might have more. I don't know.
35:43 --> 35:45 So what you're saying is it's your oblivion.
35:46 --> 35:47 Jesus.
35:47 --> 35:49 No, I never beat oblivion.
35:49 --> 35:50 I either.
35:50 --> 35:59 The main campaign of Celeste, I just didn't beat all the extras. Oblivion. I got caught up in the extras.
35:59 --> 36:03 Yeah. I don't. I think it goes without saying about Celeste.
36:03 --> 36:03 That's.
36:03 --> 36:06 It sounds like Celeste goes in the list for sure. Yep.
36:06 --> 36:14 Yes. And then from Blue sky, the other one mentioned, has anybody played Rayman? Rayman Origin? Rayman Legends.
36:14 --> 36:17 I think I told you my story with Rayman.
36:19 --> 36:20 You should tell for the podcast.
36:20 --> 36:53 Yeah, well, okay, real quick. Yeah, real quick. So being a Linux administrator by trade, I saw that Rayman. I don't remember which might have been Rayman Legends, but whatever, it had a Linux version. This is before the Steam deck. This is before all of the compatibility that we have now. And I saw that it had Linux and I was like, sweet. And I bought it and I installed it and I couldn't get that fucking thing to run, so I uninstalled it and got my refund. That's as much as I've played Rayman.
36:55 --> 36:55 It's fair.
36:56 --> 37:13 Okay, well, Tommy from Tommy and Grant go podcasting podcast. Notable fan of Onions. I like their podcast and they're also part of our superpod network. He recommended Rayman. So, Wolf, you played Rayman? This is another one I wish I played, but I've not touched.
37:13 --> 37:56 Okay, so I have played the old Raymans and the new ones. The new ones are far superior to the old ones. The old ones were, you know, technically spectacular, but not the best platformers. The new ones are really good platformers and they do some really cool stuff, like from stage to stage, they really change it up. And it's built really well to work with anywhere from one to four players. However, I've never gone back to play it much by myself. I only played it some with my brother. And I was impressed, but not impressed enough to go pick it up on my own or anything like that. So.
37:56 --> 38:04 Right. Can we talk about, like, some of the worst platformers out there? Like Bugsy?
38:04 --> 38:21 Let's finish up Rayman. Do we think Rayman belongs in the list? First off, like, I have not played it. Every time I hear about Rayman, it's always been that it's an Ubisoft staple from back in the day. The art style is always considered really amazing, but I don't know about the gameplay itself. So is it worth having? The list doesn't sound like it's a pillar from what you're.
38:21 --> 38:38 You're saying, Wolf, I would not make it a pillar before. Nothing against it, but everything it did well. Other games did those things well beforehand. It just really made a good mixed bag of a lot of things you expect from platformers.
38:39 --> 38:47 Okay, what about before we get to. To bad chart? Sorry, before we get to bad, what about Earthworm Jim?
38:51 --> 39:01 I really like the first Earthworm Jim. But I don't know if I like it because of the platforming. I think, I think I hate the platforming. I think I like it because of the humor and, and the music and the vibe.
39:03 --> 39:06 I like whipping my head out and like using it as a.
39:08 --> 39:18 I mean, yes, it's core platforming, right, but it has the same kind of issue that Battletoads has where there's a lot of different things inside of it that can take away from it.
39:19 --> 39:19 Okay.
39:19 --> 39:25 Like riding the rockets or going in the under. You know, the doing the underwater thing and trying to break the glass and all that stuff.
39:25 --> 39:26 That's.
39:26 --> 39:50 It also doesn't have hard established rules for platforms and walkways and things like that. Sometimes you're walking left and all of a sudden you're going up a 90 degree angle, like passing. That's just like, whoop, up I go. Because it's. Stylistically, it works for the game, but when you think of a platformer, it doesn't really lend itself to precision like that.
39:51 --> 39:52 I'm. I'm in.
39:53 --> 39:53 Damn.
39:55 --> 39:59 One more before we get to bad. Sorry. One more before we get to bad.
40:00 --> 40:02 I also have some picks from Discord after you guys are. Are done.
40:03 --> 40:09 Okay. We don't have to go on mine. We all know Bugsy is a terrible fucking game, so I'm not going to worry about it.
40:09 --> 40:20 No, we're not going to put Bugs. Prince of Persia actually Sinister, now that you mentioned it. T08.8 from Blue sky also mentioned. He mentioned Dangerous Dave and also Prince of Persia. I know you're really big on Prince of Persia.
40:20 --> 40:24 I also mentioned Prince of Persia before I saw Sinistar did so.
40:24 --> 41:25 Prince of Persia is a platformer with puzzle aspects. That's how I'm going to argue it because there are definitely jumps that are very much timed jumps. There are, you know, moving up and down between. Between platforms sometimes. If we're going to go with some of the platformers where there are sometimes blind jumps or blind drops, I don't know. I think, I mean, every aspect of that that is a puzzle is part of the platforming. You know, you have to stand on this thing or in this order. You have to get to this door before it closes. You have to, you know, et cetera, involving jumping between platforms or dropping down to the next tier or climbing up. So to me, Prince of Persia is a platformer and it also was kind of the very first introduction of rotoscoping.
41:28 --> 41:35 Well then if we put Prince of Persian, do we need to talk flashback? Do we need to talk the flashback.
41:35 --> 41:37 Was a follow on to Prince of Persia.
41:38 --> 41:38 Just.
41:38 --> 41:40 Yeah, I'd rather go with the original, I think.
41:40 --> 41:41 Yeah.
41:41 --> 41:42 Okay.
41:43 --> 41:51 I mean, I would throw out Kuritika, but Karateka is a fighter. It's. But it's. It's that same rotoscoping as Principal Karate.
41:52 --> 41:52 Yes.
41:55 --> 41:57 Karateka, as I called her as a kid.
41:57 --> 41:58 Artery.
41:58 --> 42:06 Yeah. And Karateka, as I call it as an adult. You know, I used to call it Aclobeth. Now it's a Calabeth.
42:08 --> 42:09 Paxanadu.
42:09 --> 42:20 Yeah, yeah. Yes, exactly. Okay. I'm gonna. I don't know if it's a pillar, but I think it has a strong argument as a pillar. Prince of Persia.
42:20 --> 42:28 Sinistar's been dying on this hill most of the week, so I have. I have probably should probably humor him a little bit.
42:29 --> 42:46 November from Chad is mentioning Shovel Knight. And as well, I think Thrack from Discord also mentioned Shovel Knight. And that was also one of my original games I was thinking about until I thought about. I'd rather the messenger, but I. I really like shoveling it a lot. What do you guys think about Shovel Knight as a platformer?
42:48 --> 42:51 I don't have a lot of time in Shovel Knight.
42:52 --> 42:55 I think Wolf would be probably the better person to answer this one, to be honest with you.
42:59 --> 43:12 It's. It's good, but I don't think it's as good as other games we've mentioned. Right. Like, the whole package is something spectacular and memorable, but it's platforming by itself is not what I remember about the.
43:12 --> 43:18 Game, really, because it's not a Metroidvania. Right. Like, there's not really much the way it's not. Well, no, I guess there is.
43:19 --> 43:34 I mean, it has aspects like that. I think it's more in line with what you get from Mega man, where you get power ups, but it's not about, like, you know, opening up new areas for you to explore.
43:34 --> 43:37 Power ups don't help. Right.
43:37 --> 43:40 It's. It's more like you can open up an alternate path or a secret.
43:41 --> 43:46 Right, Right. Okay. I'm going to put on the list.
43:46 --> 43:48 But I don't think it's in that description.
43:49 --> 43:50 I'd put it on there.
43:51 --> 43:56 Can. I want to. I want to throw it out there because I want to see your reaction when I do it on here. Vvv.
43:58 --> 43:58 This guy.
44:01 --> 44:04 I own ages since I played that.
44:04 --> 44:16 This is in my backlog. I need to do this as part of my backlog blitz. I own this game. I have never played it, honestly, because I'm like, that is the dumbest name I have ever seen.
44:17 --> 44:20 It is a dumb name. I will agree with that.
44:20 --> 44:20 Okay.
44:21 --> 44:24 And honestly, the name is kind of a pun in itself.
44:25 --> 44:26 Okay.
44:26 --> 44:33 Because the whole game, it's not that you jump, it's that you alter the character's gravity up or down.
44:33 --> 44:34 Right.
44:34 --> 44:41 And so it's supposed to be the arrow pointing down because it's gravity. And there are six characters in the game whose, Whose names all start with.
44:41 --> 44:43 V. This is.
44:46 --> 44:50 V the movie or V for Vendetta. Got it.
44:51 --> 44:52 V for vvv.
44:53 --> 44:58 Yeah. No, I swear I own this one. I've just never played it.
44:58 --> 45:02 Do we. Do we need jumping to be a. To be considered a platformer or. Or not?
45:02 --> 45:02 I do own it.
45:02 --> 45:20 I'd say yes. I think jumping is kind of a. A major. I mean, traversing through the air. I mean, I mean, if you're not. If you're altering gravity and not jumping per se, but you're still. You got to land on a. Something that's floating in the air to traverse to the next area.
45:21 --> 45:24 Yeah. Because at that point we have to bring in Metal Storm.
45:25 --> 45:27 That's. That's not a. That's not a platformer.
45:28 --> 45:29 It's the same. Same idea, though.
45:29 --> 45:32 That's. Yeah, that's an auto scroller. I don't believe that that's.
45:33 --> 45:33 Man, I am.
45:33 --> 45:36 Yeah, but Mario has auto scrolling stages.
45:36 --> 45:42 They have auto scrolling levels. But I don't believe that Metal Storm is even remotely a platformer.
45:44 --> 45:47 Let me run through Discord real quick. We only have a couple picks left there.
45:47 --> 45:48 Yeah, let's.
45:48 --> 45:55 Let's jack O. Ziggy Moons also mentioned Celeste, which we definitely have there. Cthuzios. Jeff mentioned Cuphead, which I think is a run and gun.
45:56 --> 45:56 Yeah.
45:57 --> 46:00 Jazz Jackrabbit. I've never played that game.
46:00 --> 46:00 No. Jazz Jack.
46:00 --> 46:01 I know, it's like a classic.
46:01 --> 46:03 Absolutely. A platformer.
46:03 --> 46:05 I have also never played it.
46:05 --> 46:26 It's very much a almost Super Mario Brothers style where you can jump on the enemies you're going and collecting. Instead of coins, you're collecting carrots, you know, et cetera. But I do think it has. If I remember right, I think it has a. I think Jazz has a gun, but I could be wrong. It's been a long time.
46:26 --> 46:30 Remember, we're not limiting ourselves to people with sidearms.
46:30 --> 46:32 That's true. Because we have Mega man on the list.
46:32 --> 46:33 Right.
46:33 --> 46:45 Jazz Jackrabbit does absolutely belong on the list, at least of platformers. I mean, as does Commander Keen. It's. They're both DOS games.
46:46 --> 46:51 They're both DOS games, Commander King, we have to mention. Right. That's for sure.
46:51 --> 46:53 What about like Alex Kidd or.
46:55 --> 46:58 Miracle World? Absolutely right.
46:59 --> 47:01 Alex Kid in Miracle World. Okay.
47:01 --> 47:08 Yeah. There's points in that where you. Your precision platforming has to be so tight, it's ridiculous.
47:08 --> 47:09 Right, Okay.
47:09 --> 47:17 I mean, don't hate us, listeners, because we're going to forget 90% of platformers while we're talking.
47:17 --> 47:29 Oh, yeah, I absolutely love Alex Kidd. And it was somebody. Somebody in Discord. Can't think of it off the top of my head, but I had forgotten about it entirely.
47:30 --> 47:31 Yeah, that was Thrack. Yeah.
47:31 --> 47:31 Yeah.
47:31 --> 47:33 You mentioned a bunch of SEGA games.
47:33 --> 47:36 I mean, you mentioned like two or three games that I was like, how did I not think of that?
47:37 --> 47:42 Yeah. We haven't put Donkey Kong, Donkey Kong country on the list, Kirby.
47:42 --> 47:49 And I do want Donkey Kong country on this. No, because it's supposed to be a list of impactful ones, not train wreck of a goddamn ice level.
47:49 --> 47:51 We haven't put Popeye on this list.
47:53 --> 47:56 Donkey Kong Country. No, no.
47:56 --> 47:58 I'm just saying if we're.
47:58 --> 47:59 I'm trying out of here.
47:59 --> 48:03 I'm trying to. I'm trying to help Chat understand that we're being a little discerning.
48:04 --> 48:14 Yeah. The other one, the other Chat recommended Aaron. Aaron mentioned Warrior Land. Yeah. How familiar are you guys with the Warrior Land games? I barely touched.
48:15 --> 48:19 I played a little bit of. It's the one where you get the hats, they give you the power ups in certain instances and stuff.
48:19 --> 48:20 Yeah.
48:20 --> 48:22 I've only played the Wario mini games.
48:22 --> 48:30 It's. It's Mario Brothers. It's. It's the same. It's. It's the same thing with different power ups. It's the same kind of concept.
48:30 --> 48:30 Okay.
48:31 --> 48:48 I. It's, you know, if you're talking about Mario, if you're gonna throw Warrior out there that you've already talked about Mario or talking about about the same thing. You know, it's. It's just more the same with different aspects because, I mean, you talk about Super Mario Land on the Game Boy, Those are very much. Platformers.
48:50 --> 48:51 Is a great game.
48:51 --> 48:57 Right. Is it any different than the previous Mario Brothers? Not particularly, no.
48:58 --> 49:45 So, okay, is there anything else from our list? So I'm going to quickly run down our list for the audio listeners while you guys think if we're missing anything. All right, so just our list in general. Super Meat boy, Mega Man 2, Super Ghouls n Ghosts, Pitfall Ninja Gaiden the Messenger, Mario Brothers 3 Mario World Super Mario Brothers 1. The original Mario Brothers Mario Maker Circus Goddamn Charlie Friday Jumpman DuckTales Celeste Rayman Origins Prince of Persia Jazz Jackrabbit Shovel Knight Commander Keane Alex Kidd. In Miracle World, Wolf has gotten out of his chair and is now looking at his shelf. Mark your bingo cards. Is there anything else I would recognize as a key platformer?
49:45 --> 49:47 I'm going to point at my empty background here.
49:47 --> 49:53 I want to throw. I want to throw Kirby into the mix. I want to throw Jake's most difficult game he's ever played.
49:53 --> 49:55 Kirby. Kirby.
49:56 --> 49:58 Don't you shake your head at me, Wolf.
49:58 --> 50:07 No, I'm with you. Kirby, I think needs to be on the the list. Not the pillars necessarily, but I think.
50:07 --> 50:08 It'D be on the list.
50:09 --> 50:18 Kirby is Kirby's adventure for the nes, especially with the sheer number of power ups and stages. And I know I about it all the time, but I really do like that game.
50:19 --> 50:25 Eating the. Eating the characters and becoming. Get that Bard's tail out of here. Eating the characters.
50:25 --> 50:27 What is a platform if not a dungeon floor?
50:29 --> 50:37 It is a platform. Should I go get my Dark Souls games? Should I go grab those and start flashing those off, Showing those things around? I am wearing.
50:37 --> 50:47 Sorry, sorry. I moved. So I don't have my old background so I had to go get something for bingo. Sinister talked about Bard's tale, Sekiro.
50:47 --> 50:49 That's 3D though. That's not 2D.
50:49 --> 50:56 Yeah, let's save those for the 3D episode. Never mentioned Mirror's Edge and I think that's a good one for a 3D platform.
50:56 --> 50:56 Oh, yeah, it is.
50:56 --> 51:00 Oh, Mirror's Edges. Absolutely stellar.
51:00 --> 51:01 Parkour all day.
51:02 --> 51:04 Yeah. Parkour. Platforming all day.
51:04 --> 51:04 Parkour.
51:05 --> 51:07 Parkour, yeah.
51:07 --> 51:09 Anything else on my shelf that I.
51:09 --> 51:10 Want to add to the list?
51:10 --> 51:20 I think we have at least. I mean, I think any of these games we could talk to an alien and be like, go play these. We have to get it down to four.
51:21 --> 51:21 Four.
51:23 --> 51:32 Do we want to like make it a category of something? Like, of the four. Like, one is a Mario game. One's like an old one. One's a modern one. How do we want to break it down?
51:33 --> 51:37 Like wedding stuff? Like something old, something new, something borrowed, something blue.
51:38 --> 51:40 Wolf's got something to say. What's up, Wolf?
51:40 --> 52:00 Can I recommend Super Mario Brothers as one of them? Not because it's a Mario game, but because it does represent that early precision platforming, multi screen scrolling kind of thing. Very I.
52:00 --> 52:01 But that's just me.
52:01 --> 52:17 I'm with Wolf. If we have a representation of Super Mario Brothers as like the representative of this game taught you how to play Super Mario Brothers.
52:17 --> 52:44 And it very could possibly be people of our age group, at least. Wolf's, mine and Jake's. This might be our. Their first platformer when they got their first gaming console. I mean, yeah, some of us were playing Commodores more or Apple IIS or something in the past, but 90% of the millennial Gen X people were playing Super Nintendo or. Sorry, yeah, nes. And this, I can argue this was my first platformer.
52:44 --> 52:53 So, you know, if you, if you want to say Mario 3 or Mario World, I would argue those are just slight evolutions on. Yeah, the formula that was Super Mario Brothers.
52:53 --> 52:54 They're the best kind of.
52:55 --> 52:56 You're right.
52:56 --> 53:02 If there is a representative of what Super Mario Brothers is, it is number one.
53:03 --> 53:04 I agree. I'll agree with that.
53:04 --> 53:24 Yeah, I won't like it, but I don't think I'd want more than one Mario game just because there's so, so few slots. But I think Mario Brothers 1 is a great one to put on on the list there. And Good point. Chart like it's. It's what is likely very much for our generation. The first big platformer game you played or you remember. I did play a few on the Atari, but it's. It's the Nintendo ones that I remember the most.
53:24 --> 53:40 And I would say scrolling backgrounds. I would say Super Mario Brothers also encompasses stuff like Alex Kidd because Alex Kidd is very similar to Mario. Like, I love me some Alex Kidd. I do think Mario Brothers did it first and did it strong.
53:41 --> 53:41 Okay.
53:42 --> 54:01 And I'm going to argue. Sorry, I'm going to argue that Sonic is going to fall under this category as well because you jump on enemies, you collect rings instead of coins, you, you know, et cetera, et cetera. The only difference is, is they had the. The faster processor and they had farty base.
54:02 --> 54:03 They do have far base.
54:03 --> 54:07 I. I like Sonic a lot, but I don't think it's one of the four. I'm. I'm with you. I think it's covered.
54:08 --> 54:13 I'm kind of leaning on that too. And I'm a bigger Sonic fan than Mario myself. But.
54:13 --> 54:30 Yeah, do we want to mark Celeste as a pillar? Just for the fact that first off is an indie title and how impactful that was. It's one of the indie titles to play and it's one. It's one of those games that a lot of people own it, whether they realize it or not. And it's stellar Platforming. Right. And there's, like I said, a lot of content there.
54:31 --> 54:33 Let's put it in the pillars for now.
54:34 --> 54:39 I would argue at Super Meat Boy doesn't share the same. Same thing.
54:41 --> 54:49 I think I would take Celeste Boy. Yeah, I would pick Celeste. I like Meat Boy a lot, but. But I think Celeste is the better game.
54:49 --> 54:49 Right.
54:51 --> 55:09 Okay, I know. I know we have Jumpman on the list, but I'm gonna argue Commander Keane is a better representative of kind of the PC platforming era.
55:11 --> 55:12 Okay?
55:12 --> 55:12 If.
55:12 --> 55:16 If we cannot argue for or against. I have not played enough of those.
55:16 --> 55:51 If we had to. If we had aliens come down and say, show me a DOS PC, you know, Commodore 64, a computer platformer. I. I love Jumpman. I love Prince of Persia, but I really think Commander Keen is kind of that representative. I really do. It's tight. The controls are tight. It has, you know, a little background story. Ish. To it. It's got some world exploration, like, you know, Super Mario 3.
55:53 --> 56:02 Yeah, that's what I'm. Synthstress is right. Telling aliens to play Commander Keen might piss them off, though. That's. That's kind of where my head's at.
56:02 --> 56:04 I've never played it. Is it hard?
56:04 --> 56:08 Well, no, no, no. That's the. Commander Keen Aliens.
56:08 --> 56:09 Oh, you're fighting aliens.
56:09 --> 56:09 Yeah.
56:09 --> 56:10 Yeah.
56:11 --> 56:12 Well, okay, well.
56:13 --> 56:36 Well, hold on, hold on. I. I haven't. I have kind of an argument in favor for Jumpman. Jumpman's kind of the guy, right? It's like, it's the thing before the things, and it's the first one, right? So shouldn't that be a. Shouldn't that just automatically be a pillar? I mean, it's not like. It was terrible, right? It's. It's.
56:36 --> 56:40 No, it was a good game. It is a fantastic game.
56:40 --> 57:15 I mean, if. If Bubsy was, like, the first game ever, you'd be like, obviously they got all these things wrong. We're gonna pick Mario instead because it did it better. But. But if Jumpman is a platforming to the core and it's good, and it brought along all the other games, I don't think Commander Keen really holds up to the one. Right. It's like the Neo of platforming games, right? It's the one. The Oracle made him eat a cookie and sent him to go break down the system. That's. That's what Jumpman is.
57:16 --> 57:16 Don't worry about.
57:16 --> 57:21 I think I would take. I would take Jumpman over Commander Keane personally myself.
57:21 --> 57:21 Okay.
57:21 --> 57:31 Because it's the first one, and it's also the PC or like a computer representation, which I think is. Is. You're right. Sinister is important. I think Jump Man.
57:31 --> 57:39 I'm. I. I just think Aliens would have a better time playing Commander Keen, but I'm. I'm willing to go with.
57:39 --> 57:46 I think it would stave off a Xeno war if we didn't give them Commander Keane, so I'm cool with that.
57:47 --> 57:48 Okay.
57:48 --> 57:49 Wolf, what do you think?
57:50 --> 57:55 I don't have a horse in this race because I've never played either one much.
57:56 --> 57:56 Okay.
57:56 --> 58:01 I think I've only played a little bit of Commander Keen, and I don't remember a ton of platforming and what I played.
58:01 --> 58:22 I'm coming at it from. I have vast experience in Commander Keane, Jazz Jackrabbit, and Jump Man. And I'm saying Commander Keane. But if we want to say grandfather of platforming, then it's going to be Jump Man, Right?
58:22 --> 58:26 Yeah. Let's put it there for now, and then we'll. We'll figure it out.
58:26 --> 58:27 Okay.
58:28 --> 58:34 Okay. So we have Super Mario Brothers 1. All I know, Sarah.
58:34 --> 58:36 All I know is I'm going to go fucking play Commander Keen after this.
58:36 --> 58:39 You whatever you want.
58:40 --> 58:50 So supervisor is one NES era, right. The 80s. We have Celeste, which is how old Celeste now? 10 years. The indie title. Right. And then we have Jumpman, which is the original.
58:54 --> 58:55 Nothing really.
58:55 --> 59:02 Bit. Is there something 16 bit we'd want to put in there or 16 bit inspired super ghouls and Ghosts.
59:02 --> 59:08 I mean, the Ghouls and Ghosts. Super Ghouls and Ghosts probably would be. I. I would rather see DuckTales get on there myself.
59:09 --> 59:16 But yeah, I was also going to argue and say skip right ahead to the Messenger.
59:18 --> 59:25 I mean, but we have. I feel like Celeste is kind of representing games, but it's Celeste a better.
59:25 --> 59:29 Representation of modern platforming than the Messenger.
59:30 --> 59:34 That's like saying we're going to have Commander Keen and Jumpman on there at the same time.
59:34 --> 59:37 No, I'm saying maybe we replace Celeste with a Messenger.
59:39 --> 59:40 I really like the Messenger.
59:41 --> 59:54 I. I do think Celeste is an amazing platformer. To me, I like the messenger more because it incorporated combat as platforming.
59:55 --> 59:56 Yeah. Right.
59:56 --> 01:00:00 But I'm. I'm. I'm very torn between kind of biased.
01:00:01 --> 01:00:04 Like we're kind of biased towards the messenger because we all love the messenger.
01:00:04 --> 01:00:05 Yeah.
01:00:06 --> 01:00:08 If I throw Ninja Gaiton in there.
01:00:09 --> 01:00:20 If we're telling people that have never played a platformer, here's the four representatives. Would you say Celeste or would you say the messenger as one of those Representatives.
01:00:21 --> 01:00:26 I have told more people they need to play the messenger than I've told people they need to play Celeste.
01:00:26 --> 01:00:28 I mean, that's. There's truth to that.
01:00:28 --> 01:00:46 I would always recommend the Messenger. Anybody. And it's just. But it's not just because of the platform. It's just because the game is really fantastic. Yeah, right. But I can see what you're saying, Char, where Celeste and the messenger, both really great indie titles. I see. I see the only limited number of slots.
01:00:46 --> 01:00:50 Yeah. They're both spectacular modern representations of the genre.
01:00:51 --> 01:00:57 I feel like we can't have both. If we're talking four pillars, we need. Yeah, we got one or the other.
01:00:57 --> 01:00:57 Yeah.
01:00:57 --> 01:00:58 Well, in my.
01:00:58 --> 01:01:06 Not the messenger and Celeste together, then what would be another. Another pillar. Then if we, if we. Setting aside the messenger and Celeste, I'll put them side by side for now.
01:01:08 --> 01:01:12 I put. I put super ghouls and ghosts up there. I would, I would throw.
01:01:12 --> 01:01:14 Hold on, hold on.
01:01:14 --> 01:01:14 Good, though.
01:01:15 --> 01:01:16 We don't.
01:01:16 --> 01:01:16 But it is good.
01:01:16 --> 01:01:23 How. How can we not have a Mega man representative as a. Yeah, I forgot about that.
01:01:23 --> 01:01:25 No, I put Mega man up there. I would take.
01:01:25 --> 01:01:35 Yeah, Honestly, I think if you were talking platformers, I think like there has got to be a Mega man on the pillar somewhere.
01:01:35 --> 01:01:41 I would take. I would take Celeste off, put messenger on, and then Mega man rounded out. I would be fine with that.
01:01:42 --> 01:01:53 My only issue with Mega man to be on this, on this pillar is that because we already have Mary Brothers 1 and. And that's two NES games on this list on the four. But I think Mega Man 2 is an excellent platformer.
01:01:53 --> 01:01:56 Mega Man X, I would be fine.
01:01:56 --> 01:02:05 With Mega Man X. Mega Man X. What I hate, I hate those games. I hate them. I can't stand them. You know, I always like the original games.
01:02:05 --> 01:02:06 The first one is amazing.
01:02:07 --> 01:02:20 As far as a pillar. As far as a pillar representative of 16 bit platformers, what is better? And we're excluding Metroidvanias because I would be like Super Metroid all day long.
01:02:20 --> 01:02:22 Yeah, I'd throw Super Metroid up there too.
01:02:22 --> 01:02:29 But excluding Metroidvanias and of course Castlevania. Super Castlevania, etc. Mega Man X.
01:02:31 --> 01:03:10 My thing with Mega Man X is the view is too zoomed in and it feels less of a platformer and more run and gun than Mega man does. Right. Mega man was definitely platforming. Mega Man X feels more like a run and gun to me. Like the zoomed in look of it. It's faster, heavy focus on combat. I. I hate how yeah, there's a lot of dashing, not necessarily jumping the boss fights. I can't stand the boss fights in X because you have to use the. It's a. I have a struggle with Mega Man X. It's. I. I just don't like that series at all. And I've tried so many times. I would definitely take Mega Man 2 over X, but I. I feel weird not having a 16 bit title on this list. But the messenger is also 16 bit style.
01:03:12 --> 01:03:16 It represents the 16 bit era in their later accounts.
01:03:16 --> 01:03:29 I mean, honestly, if we're talking like modern platformers are a 16 bit retro style. Right. The minute you get to 32 bit, you're in 32 or you're in 3D platformers. Right.
01:03:33 --> 01:03:34 I'd like Mega Man.
01:03:35 --> 01:03:42 So are we kind of going with, you know, where they started and where they are? Is that what's happening with these four pillars?
01:03:43 --> 01:03:51 I argue that it's the four that we tell aliens to play, but it feels like we've applied some additional rules.
01:03:53 --> 01:04:10 Well, I mean. Because that's what it feels like at this point. Like, I do understand that Mega Man X is definitely more fast paced, more run and gun than platforming. I can understand that. I don't understand why Jake doesn't like it, but that's his issue.
01:04:10 --> 01:04:11 Yeah.
01:04:11 --> 01:04:11 Yeah.
01:04:12 --> 01:04:21 You got three people and they're very confused at that. That was. That was not an outburst any of us expected to hear tonight. Jake, you're muted, buddy. You're muted.
01:04:21 --> 01:04:22 I'm.
01:04:22 --> 01:04:23 It's fine.
01:04:24 --> 01:04:27 It's probably best we don't use.
01:04:27 --> 01:04:38 No, it's just. I like. GP fights hard for Mega Man X. And I think I had a debate with him before about the best Mega man games. And I'll. I will fight over NES ones being better than the SNES ones any given day. I just don't like.
01:04:39 --> 01:04:48 Okay, I'm okay saying the Messenger Celeste represents 16 bit esque.
01:04:50 --> 01:04:50 Yeah.
01:04:50 --> 01:04:55 Okay. So. And we think the messenger over Celeste. Does everybody agree to that or.
01:04:56 --> 01:04:57 Yeah.
01:04:59 --> 01:04:59 Yeah.
01:04:59 --> 01:05:07 I only. My only reservation is that Celeste is purely a platforming game, while the messenger has other attributes added to it.
01:05:07 --> 01:05:11 But. But like Wolf's. Right. Even the combat in the messenger is. Is platform coded.
01:05:11 --> 01:05:15 Right? Yeah. In its soul core, it is a platformer.
01:05:15 --> 01:05:15 The.
01:05:15 --> 01:05:18 There's just more to it than what Celeste has.
01:05:19 --> 01:05:28 One thing I want to mention is how November wanted to put Hollow Knight on this list. I think the type of platforming that Hollow Knight does, the messenger also does.
01:05:29 --> 01:05:31 Okay, I'd argue that.
01:05:33 --> 01:05:44 So I. Yeah, the messenger feels like. Like Celeste is a representative with the messenger. Right. Slash, Hollow Knight, Slash.
01:05:45 --> 01:05:47 You bought more. You. Both games in a bundle.
01:05:49 --> 01:05:53 Yeah. I think Hollow Knight, though, is more representative of the Metroidvanias, and I think that's a game.
01:05:53 --> 01:05:57 We're going to talk, but I don't think. Right.
01:05:57 --> 01:06:03 It's not super Metroidvania, though. It's. It's really not like I argue.
01:06:03 --> 01:06:06 November. November. Threw out Silk Song. What do you think about that, Jake?
01:06:07 --> 01:06:12 I mean, is that even real? Last I heard you play in a museum. It's. It's.
01:06:12 --> 01:06:15 I'm hoping it doesn't come out until next year.
01:06:16 --> 01:06:40 Yeah, fuck you. I'm already losing. Give. Give me some kind of hope for this fantasy critic. My thing with the Hollow Knight, though, I. Okay, yes. Maybe not as strong as Metroidvania, I guess we could argue that, but I think it's a different episode. It's also heavily combat, like boss battles. It's basically a Souls like, but 2D format. So that's why I don't think it's. When I think of Hollow Knight, I don't think of platforming at all. I know there's platforming in it, but I think of Metroid, I think Souls.
01:06:40 --> 01:07:00 Like battles, huge platforming segments, but those are fighting things all the time. Side quest, endgame content, as far as I recall. And those were my favorite parts of the game. But there was a lot of game there that I kind of struggled through because of the graphical style.
01:07:00 --> 01:07:00 Yeah.
01:07:00 --> 01:07:20 And that's just. That's a me issue. That's. I understand why people love the game, but. Yeah, it's. It's. I don't feel like the game has enough platforming throughout it to count that as a platformer. It's definitely Metroidvania. And I think the messenger does not have enough Metroidvania for it to come up in the Metroidvania episode.
01:07:21 --> 01:07:21 Yeah.
01:07:21 --> 01:07:22 Right. Yeah, I agree.
01:07:22 --> 01:07:29 November, We. We. We did kind of touch on Mega man having boss battles, but there are mega.
01:07:29 --> 01:07:32 There are boss battles in Mega Man 2 that involve platforming.
01:07:32 --> 01:07:42 Yeah. The dragon. The dragon specifically. And. And the. The meat and potatoes of that game is platforming until you get to the boss.
01:07:42 --> 01:07:43 Yeah.
01:07:44 --> 01:07:45 In each level.
01:07:45 --> 01:07:46 Yeah.
01:07:46 --> 01:07:52 Where. Where Hollow Knight, there's a lot of battle that happens as you're progressing through.
01:07:52 --> 01:07:52 Right.
01:07:54 --> 01:07:59 I think for the fourth pillar, I'm just gonna put it up here and we're just gonna look at it.
01:08:01 --> 01:08:01 Oh, dear.
01:08:02 --> 01:08:05 Just look at it and marvel at Charlie for a minute.
01:08:07 --> 01:08:08 It's been A great.
01:08:08 --> 01:08:12 It was a platform, guys. Except for a ball that you bounce off of or fire.
01:08:12 --> 01:08:15 It's been a great episode. Guys, our four pillars.
01:08:15 --> 01:08:18 What is a platform but something holding you up?
01:08:19 --> 01:08:20 Look, our four pillars.
01:08:20 --> 01:08:22 Like a giant rabid monkeys.
01:08:22 --> 01:08:30 What if I'm a lion? Let's quote Final Fantasy 8 for how maybe I'm a liar. Guys.
01:08:30 --> 01:08:36 Super Mario Brothers, the Messenger, Jumpman and Circus Charlie. It's been a great episode, everybody. Thank you. This has been press p to cancel.
01:08:37 --> 01:08:40 This has forever been breast canceled.
01:08:42 --> 01:08:48 So for a fourth slot then, are we thinking like Mega Man 2 versus DuckTales? Is that where we're at now? Or do you think something else?
01:08:48 --> 01:09:09 I would argue Mega Man 2. Like, yeah, I really feel like if you're going to like. Mega Man 2 is more representative of platformers than, Than, Than Sonic, right? I mean, yeah, yeah. And everybody thinks of platformers as far as Sonic goes. I mean, you know.
01:09:09 --> 01:09:15 But to Jake's point, is there more of a platforming core in DuckTales than there is in Mega Man?
01:09:18 --> 01:09:24 No, no. I think. I think Mega Man 2 especially is. Is at its heart, a platform first and foremost.
01:09:24 --> 01:09:29 And that's why I think I like DuckTales a lot. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But yeah, no, so my last question.
01:09:30 --> 01:09:35 Here is if we're doing that, like, is it Mega man or is it Ghouls and Ghosts?
01:09:36 --> 01:09:37 Mega Man?
01:09:39 --> 01:10:06 I think Mega man represents that better because, yes, Ghouls and Ghosts has, you know, you. You eventually get your weapon that you can, like your dagger or your arrow or whatever, and you are moving across and you are jumping and whatever. But Mega man adds disappearing platforms, adds the ability to create platforms, ads, you know, etc.
01:10:06 --> 01:10:10 Etc. So does, so does Super Ghouls and Ghosts. I mean, you have create your own.
01:10:11 --> 01:10:12 You can create.
01:10:12 --> 01:10:14 No, you can't create your own. No, no, no, that's.
01:10:14 --> 01:10:14 That's.
01:10:14 --> 01:10:15 That's a good point.
01:10:15 --> 01:10:15 That's a good point.
01:10:15 --> 01:10:16 Yeah.
01:10:16 --> 01:10:19 I just feel like Mega man controls better than Ghouls and Ghosts. That's that.
01:10:19 --> 01:10:20 And it does.
01:10:20 --> 01:10:22 But I don't have as much experience with that franchise like you guys do, though.
01:10:23 --> 01:10:33 Yeah, no, I, I'm, I listen. I am all in on Mega Man 2. 100 all in on Mega Man 2. But I mean, devil's advocate on some of these other things.
01:10:34 --> 01:10:38 Either of these choices are Capcom, so I'm not upset either way.
01:10:38 --> 01:10:46 Just put Capcom on there and we'll. I mean, it just encompasses everything, right?
01:10:46 --> 01:10:48 Wait, so Street Fighter 2 is a platformer?
01:10:48 --> 01:10:50 It can be, you Jump a lot.
01:10:50 --> 01:10:51 There is jumping.
01:10:52 --> 01:10:54 You ever played Street Fighter 2010?
01:10:55 --> 01:10:55 I have not.
01:10:56 --> 01:10:58 You just add more numbers and you're good.
01:11:01 --> 01:11:06 No, take them back, I think. Okay, so this is our four.
01:11:06 --> 01:11:11 I vote Mega Man 2 as the first pillar. Yeah, that's what I vote.
01:11:11 --> 01:11:12 I am in.
01:11:13 --> 01:11:17 Okay, so then for press B to cancel.
01:11:17 --> 01:11:19 How did we forget this one? Flappy bird.
01:11:19 --> 01:11:22 Flappy bird. I don't. I don't. I've. No.
01:11:22 --> 01:11:23 I mean, why not? Doodle Jump.
01:11:25 --> 01:11:26 Doodle Jump is a platform.
01:11:26 --> 01:11:29 Super Smash Brothers is a platformer.
01:11:29 --> 01:11:42 Oh, thanks. Object. Yes, it sure is. All right for the four pillars of 2D platformers. According to Press P to Cancel's podcast, our four pillars that you would give to the alien space whales so they don't blow our planet up.
01:11:42 --> 01:11:43 Whaley.
01:11:43 --> 01:11:54 Super Mario Brothers one on the nes, the messenger on everything. Jumpman on Apple, and Mega Man 2 on the NES. Let's go. I think that's a good lust of four.
01:11:54 --> 01:11:55 It's a banger soundtrack too.
01:11:56 --> 01:11:56 Yeah.
01:11:56 --> 01:12:32 And if you don't like our list, which is totally possible because we didn't put any Sega on this list whatsoever, we tried also not having Celeste or Meat Boy, I think might piss some people off. So I think if you don't agree with us, then please check us out over on Blue Sky. Just look for Press B to cancel or press b2cancel.com for links to our YouTube at press b2cancel. You can also look at our Discord link again@pressbeautycancel.com and yeah, let us know in Discord or let us know in the comments on YouTube video whether you like this list or not. I think there's definitely. Out of all the ones we do like this episode, this is one of the more polarizing lists to kind of do. And it's tough to just get four.
01:12:32 --> 01:12:34 And there just plenty of worse.
01:12:34 --> 01:12:41 I went onto Moby games and I selected Playstyle Platformer. And it's like 18 games.
01:12:41 --> 01:12:43 That's be here for a while for sure.
01:12:44 --> 01:12:58 And I was having some reservations about it having a few games from the NES on here. But I think that makes sense because once you get to 16 bit ERA, they start adding other genres. Right. Super Metroid is a fantastic platformer, but it's also a fantastic Ventroidvania.
01:12:58 --> 01:12:58 Right.
01:13:01 --> 01:13:07 I think the NES was one of the strongest platforming consoles ever.
01:13:08 --> 01:13:09 Absolutely.
01:13:09 --> 01:13:11 Particularly, obviously, I'm gonna pull in a.
01:13:11 --> 01:13:46 GP and be like in the. In the Venn diagram of platforming to Metroidvanian, which side is it? More on. Right. You're gonna be more on the metroidvanian side than that because it's Metroid, but you know what I mean? So it's. It's hard to pick, but the NES was. Was the first of its. Of its. Not the first of its kind, but the first major mainstay that had all of these different games on it that were all. Most of them, platforming to start. I mean, how did Quantum Kabuki Warrior not make it onto this list? I mean. Right. I'm just saying.
01:13:46 --> 01:13:49 It's not. It's not a good game. That's why I'm just saying.
01:13:49 --> 01:13:52 Right. There's. There are way too many options to choose from.
01:13:52 --> 01:13:52 Yeah.
01:13:52 --> 01:13:59 In this particular category. And. And for an hour and 23 minutes, we did our best to make it as short up as human.
01:14:00 --> 01:14:05 Yeah, Yeah. I made a joke offline that this was going to be a four hour episode. So.
01:14:05 --> 01:14:08 First 24 hour podcast, watch us sleep.
01:14:08 --> 01:15:33 If it was brackets, it might have gone longer for sure. Yeah. I think somehow we tighten it up with this. I'm going to go play the great list. There's a lot of good. I mean, all the games we mentioned today on this list, I think are great games. Right. But we have to pick four to appease the alien overlords that are coming to invade our planet and just really sell that genre. Anyway, I'm going to wrap it up because we've been going long again. We are. Press B to cancel. Find us all over your favorite podcast apps. Press B to cancel. And until next week, everybody. Have a good one, Sam. All right, Dr. Pepper. Oh, God, I saw Dr. Pepper. Freezies are coming to Canada.
01:15:33 --> 01:15:35 And I'm like, what are Freezies?
01:15:36 --> 01:15:38 Yeah, what's a freezy? Is that like an icy.
01:15:38 --> 01:15:39 What? No.
01:15:39 --> 01:15:40 Slurpee?
01:15:41 --> 01:15:43 Are you guys. You don't know what freezies are?
01:15:43 --> 01:15:44 We don't have freezes.
01:15:45 --> 01:15:46 We don't have Freezies.
01:15:46 --> 01:15:47 You don't have Freezies?
01:15:47 --> 01:15:48 Are they like Otter Pops?
01:15:49 --> 01:15:51 The is an Auto Pop.
01:15:54 --> 01:15:54 Yeah, yeah.
01:15:54 --> 01:15:56 It's not a transformer.
01:15:57 --> 01:16:00 It's a animal. Otter. Otter Pop.
01:16:00 --> 01:16:02 Auto Pop. Auto Pops.
01:16:02 --> 01:16:07 Hey, Jake, it's like, it's like those animals you have in Canada called beavers.
01:16:07 --> 01:16:08 Okay, Beavers.
01:16:08 --> 01:16:08 Yeah, we don't.
01:16:08 --> 01:16:10 We eat the tails, not the beaver.
01:16:10 --> 01:16:20 So. Okay, Jake, is a freezy. One of those, like popsicles in a plastic tube box of them, and it's liquid Otter Pops.
01:16:21 --> 01:16:22 That's an Auto Pop.
01:16:22 --> 01:16:23 They're just called Freezies.
01:16:24 --> 01:16:25 No, they're called Otter Pops.
01:16:26 --> 01:16:34 You guys are so weird, honestly, down there. Like, your name and your name and freezies. Otters for something. You don't even have otters down in the U.S. do you?
01:16:34 --> 01:16:35 No, we do.
01:16:36 --> 01:16:40 We don't. We don't have bees hunted. We don't have beers. We have.
01:16:41 --> 01:16:43 Yeah, you ought to know. Oh, wow.
01:16:43 --> 01:16:46 I caught what you did there. Nice. Nice.
01:16:46 --> 01:16:53 It's great. I'm glad we're recording this. This is great. Not on YouTube, but we'll have this as a treat for the audio listeners as they try and figure out what the freezing is.
01:16:53 --> 01:16:57 Didn't I say I was gonna do outtakes? At some point I. I probably should.
01:16:58 --> 01:17:00 Why is it called Otter Pops?
01:17:00 --> 01:17:03 Because it's like. That's just because it's what it's called.
01:17:03 --> 01:17:11 All of. All of the. All of the pops are a different animal. Like, there's like, grape gibbon and, you know, stuff like that.
01:17:12 --> 01:17:17 I thought they were all various otters with, like, different personality.
01:17:18 --> 01:17:21 Maybe, Maybe. Maybe. I don't know.
01:17:21 --> 01:17:26 Is the person. What personality is corn. Corn syrup. High fructose corn syrup. Is that an otter?
01:17:26 --> 01:17:27 It's all of them.
01:17:27 --> 01:17:27 Yeah.
01:17:27 --> 01:17:28 It's.
01:17:28 --> 01:17:32 It's encompassed by all that is the God of Otter Pops.
01:17:32 --> 01:17:34 Yeah, hi. It's.
01:17:34 --> 01:17:39 It's Mr. Fructose, let's say on the seventh day, he created fructose syrup.
01:17:41 --> 01:17:42 And it was good.
01:17:42 --> 01:17:43 And it was good.
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Recent Episodes
Cyber-Lip | The Earth Is Ours
Years before Metal Slug took over, there was this early gem! Andre and Aaron blast their way through Cyber Lip, the first Neo Geo run-and-gun. Catch us online at https://neogeogo.show Follow us on Blu...
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